Another Idea (J. Nantz)

[Don Guillette]

John: As I mentioned, originally I thought the "preventer snubber" was part of his anchor setup because, when I came upon him he had his complete anchor setup laid out on the dock and was washing it. He had a trip line rigged up to his anchor and that is what started the conversation.I know the advantage to a trip line but I have a windlass and I just crank away on it - it is as easy as pie. He did not have a windlass and had at least 40' to 50' of chain, which would have to be a back killer. He explained his system, which I didn't exactly get, at first, but here it is. He says he takes up the trip line until it is bearing the weight of the of the anchor and some of the chain ( I get that part of using the trip line to break the anchor loose). He then ties off the trip line and pulls in the rode until he feels the weight of the anchor and then takes up on the tip line and repeats the process. As I said, I don't experience these anchor problems, I just put my foot on a button and let the windlass crank away. At first I did not get it until I started to visualize what was actually happening with the system under the water. Instead of just hauling away by hand over hand, trying to pull in the entire load which could be difficult, he might be on to something by reducing the weight in half with each pull.Has anyone heard of this kind of a setup? Next time I'm at Alamitos Bay, I may look him up to see what other trick ideas he may have.

 

[Stu Jackson]

Nope

DonNo way is he reducing the weight in half with each pull.Just stop and think about it.If you dropped a 100 # weight off your house deck and had two lines connected to it, but were only pulling on one line at a time, the 100# weight just isn't gonna get lighter to 50#!Basic physics.Stu

 

[Don Guillette]

Another I dea (J. Nantz)

Stu: Maybe I misunderstood what he was trying to explain to me. I had trouble understanding what he was saying but when he told me he got the idea of the preventer snubber and the anchor trip line from a couple named Payson (I think that is the name or something like that). They give sailing tips in Sail Magazine or Cruising World, so I then thought what do I know and felt it was worthwhile to pass on. Maybe what he is talking about is holding the weight of the anchor while he takes up slack in the chain and rode.Who knows. Maybe the best idea is invest in a windlass and just crank away!! Possably this is one suggestion we should pass on. As I've mentioned in the past, I hate posting info that I have not personally tested on my boat. When I do that I can't defend my position.

 

[John Nantz]

Anchor and Chain weight

Basically, with a rode at one end of the chain and the trip line on the anchor, what he is doing is puting some of the weight of the iron on one line and the rest of the weight on the other line. One of the lines being the trip-line and the other being the rode.On a boat with, say, a 35# anchor attached to 45 feet of chain at 1#/ft (45# of chain), the total weight of the iron is 80# (when not submerged but slightly less when submerged). For the sake of discussion lets assume the weights are as submerged.I don't know what the situation is when the anchor is pulled loose from the bottom but lets assume he uses the tripline to break the anchor loose.When he hauls up on the tripline he breaks the anchor loose from the muddy or sandy bottom and all the gunk falls off (the ideal world). At the moment the anchor breaks loose it weighs 35# (no mud attached and bouyancy considered negligible based on our assumption). For the sake of discussion lets assume the chain is either on the bottom or supported by the rode but is not supporting any of the weight of the anchor at the point of breakout.Next he pulls the anchor up, say, 10 feet off the bottom and the anchor plus chain now weighs 35# + 10# =45#. Then he pulls up on the rode until one link of chain barely touches the bottom and the rode is supporting 35# of chain (35ft @ 1#/ft = 35#). If the rode is pulled up until the anchor isn't supporting any chain then the rode is supporting 45# of chain and the tripline is only supporting 35# of anchor.Basically, using this technique pulling on one line and then the other he can pull up all the ground tackle without ever having to lift the total weight all at once. A back saver.Or..... as I've been known to do, run a line from the rode aft to the primary via a snap shackle on the aluminum toe rail (for those of us that have a metal toe rail) and using the 43:1 Lewmar, crank away in grandma until the bloody thing breaks free (sometimes I just let the boat sit with the rode tight and eventually the anchor breaks free of it's own accord).Since I've got 430 feet of rode and chain, and on our Alaska trip I've had it ALL out several times, I've got a little experience in this area. Also, I'd like a windlass. My anchor is a 35# Delta and there is 45ft of 5/16 HT which weighs, I think, 1.08#/ft. I've thought about the tripline idea but at 80# the armstrong method still works.It also happens that I've got a LoFrans 1000w sitting on my tool bench (since March '04), complete with remote. But..... you know, it's a lot of work to install one of those things! So I keep using my trusty rusty Armstrong one. And the good part is my new one stays looking brand new, doesn't get salt encrusted, and never has problems....Hope this helps.