Angle of heel

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geehaw

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May 15, 2010
231
O-day 25 shoal keel Valdez
So I am just a bit curious at what angle of heel others are comfortable with in their Oday 25's? Newby to sailing here but beating I had a real trouble keeping her less then 30 degrees in 15 knot wind. Does a blown out main make i t harder to keep her on her feet? 30 degrees is a bit excessive to me is it though?
 
Sep 25, 2008
992
Oday 25 Gibraltar
So I am just a bit curious at what angle of heel others are comfortable with in their Oday 25's? Newby to sailing here but beating I had a real trouble keeping her less then 30 degrees in 15 knot wind. Does a blown out main make i t harder to keep her on her feet? 30 degrees is a bit excessive to me is it though?
Was this a question from sailing last year or have you already been out been out this year?
 

geehaw

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May 15, 2010
231
O-day 25 shoal keel Valdez
This is from last year. Right now not even sure if I will splash this year. The 700 mile round trip to sail may become to expensive. Have a lot of work to do to it and tried to get it out of it's hole but to icy to get traction to pull it up the hill.
 

geehaw

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May 15, 2010
231
O-day 25 shoal keel Valdez
Oh one more thing. I am not sure if the main is blow out or not. But it does seem to have an excessive belly and doesn't feel crisp like the jib does. But like I said I am a Newby to sailing so I could be wrong about the belly.
 
Oct 2, 2008
1,424
Island Packet 31 Brunswick, Ga
This is from last year. Right now not even sure if I will splash this year. The 700 mile round trip to sail may become to expensive. Have a lot of work to do to it and tried to get it out of it's hole but to icy to get traction to pull it up the hill.
Gosh, that would be awful. I hope that you get to go. Alaska area is one of the places on my bucket list
 
Sep 25, 2008
992
Oday 25 Gibraltar
Last year was my first year sailing 'PRONTO' and I didn't think the old main was too bad until I got my new main at the end of the season. She sailed OK with the old one. Just OK. Really looking forward to this year. I was only able to sail her a few times with the new.

Old

New



Rich
 

RECESS

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Dec 20, 2003
1,505
Pearson 323 . St. Mary's Georgia
It depends a lot on how you have your sails positioned in the 15 knots of wind and what jib you are flying. I have a main that is 30 years old but had very little use over those years. We sail ours in 20 - 25 knots of wind often and do not heel much but we let the main and jib out depending on the angle of the wind. When I was new to sailing I was pretty clueless about how to position my sails. It took me awhile to get a feel for where to have them so I did not heel too much. You do not go any faster with the main pulled all the way in and heeled way over when it should be out, it actually slows you down.
 

geehaw

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May 15, 2010
231
O-day 25 shoal keel Valdez
So far I have just been flying the 100% jib I have yet to try the genoa yet. At this point in time the less sail the better. And where I sail the winds are so erratic kinda not wanting to fly a bigger jib yet. One more question then. Do you start by letting out the main first or the jib if heeling more then preferred. I have no telltails either so that will be an addition this year for sure. Thanks all Greg
 
Mar 21, 2008
16
Oday 25 Milwaukee
It Depends

I find about 20 degrees is about right. I usually let the traveller down and ease the main out in gusting winds .I can certainly understand the frustration of trying to read the winds without any type of telltales.
You may try the folowing. Let both the jib adn the main sheets out until the sails are luffing(flapping). Then one at a time trim just one in. Just a little at a time. When the sail starts drawing go on to the remaining sail.
 

RECESS

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Dec 20, 2003
1,505
Pearson 323 . St. Mary's Georgia
I adjust the main first when I am handling both the main and the jib by myself, only because I keep my hand on the main sheet all the time when it can be gusty. Often my wife and I sail together and we move them together.

I would suggest using the orange caution tape, synthetic yarn, or christmas tensil tied and streaming on your side stays up at the level you look at your sails. I have a Windex on the top of my mast, but I look at the orange caution tape 90% of the time to see where the wind is coming from. I like the orange as it is easy to read at night. Your windward stay will show the wind direction. The lee stay will get pushed back from the wind coming off the jib. I did not have a clear picture of this with our Oday 25, but you can see what I am talking about with our Catalina 22. The orange caution tape is on both side stays.

 
Oct 2, 2008
1,424
Island Packet 31 Brunswick, Ga
Dakartimm said:
I find about 20 degrees is about right. I usually let the traveller down and ease the main out in gusting winds .I can certainly understand the frustration of trying to read the winds without any type of telltales.
You may try the folowing. Let both the jib adn the main sheets out until the sails are luffing(flapping). Then one at a time trim just one in. Just a little at a time. When the sail starts drawing go on to the remaining sail.
This seemed helpful, compliments of squ sailmakers (sp?):
RECESS said:
I adjust the main first when I am handling both the main and the jib by myself, only because I keep my hand on the main sheet all the time when it can be gusty. Often my wife and I sail together and we move them together.

I would suggest using the orange caution tape, synthetic yarn, or christmas tensil tied and streaming on your side stays up at the level you look at your sails. I have a Windex on the top of my mast, but I look at the orange caution tape 90% of the time to see where the wind is coming from. I like the orange as it is easy to read at night. Your windward stay will show the wind direction. The lee stay will get pushed back from the wind coming off the jib. I did not have a clear picture of this with our Oday 25, but you can see what I am talking about with our Catalina 22. The orange caution tape is on both side stays.
This seemed helpful : I found it under a sailmaker's web site as given by Ed k under the recent thread "new mainsail"

Dealing with Excessive
Weather Helm and Heeling
A little weather helm (a tendency for the boat to turn into the wind) is good. It gives the helm a nice positive "feel" and angles the rudder a bit off center which adds a little lift to the hull. However, weather helm can become so pronounced that it takes two strong arms to hold the helm and the rudder is at such an acute angle that it is acting like a brake slowing the boat down. At this point the boat is not only sailing inefficiently, it is no fun either. To reduce weather helm:
1. Use your shape controls to flatten both sails.
2. Keep the headsail in tight.
3. Ease the traveler off to leeward, or tighten the vang to keep the sail flat and ease the sheet.

Heeling also increases weather helm due to the shape of the parts of the hull that are underwater when heeling. To reduce heel, keep the sails flat with the draft forward and the head of the main twisted off. Also, get your crew members to sit on the windward side of the boat.

Even with proper sail trim, at some point heeling will become enough of a problem that it is time to shorten sail. Ideally, whether you reduce the headsail area or the main area first should be determined by how the boat is balanced. In general, reduce headsail area first. Then when the weather helm starts to get bad, reef the main.

However, not all boats should reduce headsail area first. If your boat tends to have quite a bit of weather helm under average conditions, you will most likely need to reef the main first. Some boats even balance well sailing under a big headsail alone. Just make sure you haven't given the boat a lee helm-a tendency to head off when you let go of the tiller.

Experience is the best teacher. Keep track of how your helm behaves under different sail combinations and conditions. You should be able to get the boat to sail nicely with reduced sail area no matter how it was designed to balance with full canvas. It is just a matter of finding the right combination of main and headsail areas.
 

RECESS

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Dec 20, 2003
1,505
Pearson 323 . St. Mary's Georgia
Heeling 30 degrees in 15 knots of wind says to me.... let it out or change your angle to the wind.
 

geehaw

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May 15, 2010
231
O-day 25 shoal keel Valdez
Well I have to say my sailing is very limited. thanks for that emergpa. Everyone talks about weather helm. But what is that??? I always am trying to keep lee-helm under control it seems. I have never experienced weather helm. My firt experience with excessive heeling I had water on the gunwale. ( Oh my god what do I do? Holy s.. i am going to die. Oh yeah let the sails out; whew!!!!!) The second time that happened I realized I had no to very little forward movement. The wind was just blowing me over. (A little less panicked gunwale still in water). After that I figured how to keep that from happening. Let the sails out pinch the wind a little. I keep it heeled about 25 degrees gusts pushing me to 30. But it seems maybe I should turn off the wind rather then pinch it? i don't do this because my pointing already seems to be bad, I would say at least 50 degrees off the wind. So I tend to pinch rather then the other way.I have only been out a couple of times in light steady winds. I did spend some time using just the sails to steer the boat never touching the tiller. That was very fun!!! Unfortunately the winds are seldom like that. Well 7 years ago I didn't know how to turn on a computer 2 years ago I built my own so I am I will learn how to sail a boat that I am sure. Sorry just rambling Thanks all for info. Greg
 

ruidh

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Oct 1, 2007
227
Oday 23 Manhasset Bay, LI
Weather helm -- when you are close hauled, you have to apply pressure on the weather side (the side away from the wind) of the tiller (the helm) in order to maintain your bearing. That is weather helm. You boat wants to turn into the wind and you have to apply a little pressue to counteract that. If you really have to pull on the helm to maintain course you are likely heeled way over and have to retrim or reduce sail area.
 

billh

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Jun 9, 2009
59
Hunter 28.5 Inland NY
geehaw,

I sail with the commander often and she lets me know very quickly when we are heeling too much! Too much for her is 15!

So, in light of that, and the fact that I end up connecting on the water with a guy who sails an O'Day 23 alone the answer I would provide would be to reef.

The 23 reefs often even when there is little wind he says it handles much better for him that way. He does not have to fight it much as there is less push on the upper part of the mast thus less heeling.

I reek pretty early alone as well, and reef often with my spouse. You can still get decent speed with a good headsail and the main reefed.

My two cents :)

And of course what the others have said about proper sailing :)



So I am just a bit curious at what angle of heel others are comfortable with in their Oday 25's? Newby to sailing here but beating I had a real trouble keeping her less then 30 degrees in 15 knot wind. Does a blown out main make i t harder to keep her on her feet? 30 degrees is a bit excessive to me is it though?
 
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