Advice for buying first sail boat

Sep 5, 2015
2
Oday 23 New jersey
I am looking to buy my first sail boat and looking for some advice. I want something small that I can go to on the weekends with my girlfriend or some friends and something that is not going to burn too big of a hole in my wallet. I do not mind making some repairs and customizations but I do not want to rebuild the whole thing from scratch. I was looking at an O'Day 23' (http://www.yachtworld.com/core/list...nits=Feet&access=Public&listing_id=76422&url=) but wanted to seek some opinions from others who have been doing this longer than me to gauge the right call.

I have a friend who can inspect the boat prior to purchase but given the age are repair parts hard to find? Would this boat and size serve the purpose that I am looking for? Are there any necessities that I may be over looking that may suggest getting a different boat? From reading the classified ad, I know its a little bare and I need to inspect it to really get a solid understanding of the boat and it's needs. But like I said just looking to ask people who have more experience than I if its the right call!

Thanks!
 
Aug 2, 2009
651
Catalina 315 Muskegon
An O'day 23 is a nice boat that would serve you well for what you've described.

MUCH has been written on this forum in response to new sailers like yourself looking for their first boat. Opinions vary on how a newbie should choose their first boat.

A few observations:
-As a newbie, you are NOT able to properly evaluate a 23 foot sailboat. Sail condition, deck condition (water penetration into the wood core), and condition of standing rigging are just a few things you won't be able to evaluate, and problems in these areas are expensive to fix.

-A $1,000 boat or even a free boat can eat a huge hole in your wallet.

-I would highly recommend you use a professional yacht surveyor to inspect the boat. Inspect it as best you can by yourself and then hire the best surveyor you can find. It'll cost you a few hundred. Post a query here to find out who's best in your area. That may seem like a lot of money, but you will spend so much more if you buy a boat with issues. And I mean soooooo much more. Not only will it cost you money, but it could turn you off to sailing, which would be even worse.

-$1,000 boats have issues. That's why they're not $5,000 boats.

-Sure, you could give it your own personal inspection, fork over $800 that you've negotiated, and have yourself a real gem, that just needs a power washing and some fresh fuel. And when you have it ready to go, I hope you'll sail it up and visit my unicorn ranch on the moon.

-It's just a big fiberglass thing, and fiberglass is easy to repair! Like I said, stop by my ranch anytime.

-If $1000 is your budget, get a $1000 boat. That'd be something like a nice Sunfish or a Butterfly, etc..

-If you want a 23ish sized boat, spend the loot to get one, and get one that's been maintained and can hold up to the scrutiny of a good surveyor. I recently sold a 2004 Precision 23, and the buyer used a surveyor. Smart buyer. I sold it for $18,500. Well maintained boat with fresh sails and a good value for the buyer.

-A 23ish is a terrific way to get started. Not too much to handle, but still has some "big boat" attributes...primarily, a toilet. And a cabin for whatever you might want to do in a cabin with your girlfriend. But seriously, a great sized boat to allow you to get a real feel for sailing and sailboat ownership.

-A common theme on sailboat forums is for a newbie to post a query just like yours and ignore the advice of people who have been at this for multiple decades (4 for me), get the inexpensive old boat, and then return to the forum with questions on how to either fix it or get rid of it. Okay...that's an offensive thing to say, because you DID ask the right questions, and there's no reason for me to make any assumptions about someone I don't know. Still, there's nothing wrong with relating what I've seen happen over and over.

-If you're serious about sailing (and your should be), and you want a 22-23 foot boat, find a NICE one. Something well maintained, with sails that aren't ready to be thrown away, an engine that starts and runs smoothly, and shows pride of ownership. Probably gonna be more in the area of $4k to $7k as you look at vessels from the 70's and 80's that are well maintained.

-You said you're not looking for a project boat. That's fine, because even well maintained boats have plenty of projects for you to do. I recently got a beautifully maintained 1996 Catalina 28 with only 200 hours on the diesel. I keep a maintenance log of everything I do and you'd be amazed at how many pages are filled after only one season. Align shaft, change engine oil, refinish teak in some areas of interior, change fuel filters, compound and polish topsides and portions of deck, new anchor chain and rode, tune rigging, replace batteries, apply new vinyl name registration numbers and hull stripes, and fix every hatch and porthole so they don't leak. It goes on and on and on. Oh yeah, and replace genoa...ouch!

Best of luck to you. You've already done the single smartest thing a sailor can do: CONSULT THIS FORUM. Some of use are just blowhards and some of us are highly experienced, which is the usual mix on any forum dedicated to any subject. You'll sort it out.

PS: You asked whether parts are hard to find. Answer: no
For the most part, sailboats don't have parts that are peculiar to them. There are exceptions to that, but they are few. The rigging, winches, cleats, hatches and so on are standard items. If you make Fords by the millions you can afford to have parts made for your product, but if you make O'days, and you're LUCKY to sell a few thousand of your product, you use standard stuff. Availability of parts should be at the very bottom of your list of concerns if it should be on the list at all.
 
Last edited:

Ward H

.
Nov 7, 2011
3,774
Catalina 30 Mk II Cedar Creek, Bayville NJ
When we started looking to replace our 17' Newport I chose several 23s and 25s to look at in our area. We aren't young nor are we small. It only took looking at one 23 to realize that it was just a bit to tight for us but would have been fine if we were younger, smaller and more nimble.
Just one thing to think about.
Other than that the O'day 22, 23 and 25s are great boats and can be had for a decent price.
As Siamese noted, direct replacement parts may not be available but none of the parts are really specific to the O'day.
D & R Marine has a lot of parts for O'days but even he sells "like" parts which may need a different hole pattern or something like that. Not hard to fill a couple of holes and drill/seal new ones.
 
Jul 21, 2012
47
Oday 222 Lake Monroe, Indiana
I started with an O'day 222 and it has been great. There is one in Missouri on Sailing Texas website that looks like a bargain. Road trip! The 23 will get you a head. That one foot does add some complexity and expense. The 222 is a simple, fun little boat. Also checkout the O'day owners website for reviews and specs by boat. I bought the boat to go sailing. No interest in a project. Have fun.
 
Aug 25, 2015
28
San Juan 28 Sequim, WA
newbie to larger boats, but lots of sailing experience

I appreciate your post and have more questions relative to my personal quest for a larger sailboat.
I've sailed Hobie 16s for decades....racing them, rebuilding them, selling them but have very little experience with larger monohulls, electronics or motorized boats. I recently was certified with ASA for basic sailing and ocean cruising up to 30 footers. I'm very skilled at historic home restoration and have basic skills with car repair but want to sail more than work on my boat. I live right on the Straits of Juan De Fuca and in sailing paradise which is why I moved here a year ago. I want a sailboat primarily to day sail but also to cruise the San Juans/Pugent Sound/Canadian Islands/eventually venture out into the Pacific and provide myself and/or my partner a place to get away. Our winds are pretty light here most of the time. My lady does not sail but has the desire and I have the ability to teach her. I'm 6'3" and prefer not to be bent over in the cabin or folded up in the berth. Our budget for purchase expenses and getting her into shape for something to last us for a decade or longer is UP TO $50,000.
My questions are:
1. Should I get an entry level boat that trailers for a couple grand (Catalina 22) and avoid the mooring fees then move up in a year? I'm afraid I will get bored quickly and not be challenged as well as not sail as often due to the effort of setting up and tearing down the rigging. OR should I get something that will challenge me immediately and avoid having to buy and sell another boat along with the efforts of getting it in the shape I want?
2. What are some good brands and size boat for my needs? I tend to like the blue water, full keel, classic lines of boats like the Cape George and they were/are made right here.
3. What is a good draft depth to stay under?
Thanks for the conversation!
--Christian

Prior response:
An O'day 23 is a nice boat that would serve you well for what you've described.

MUCH has been written on this forum in response to new sailers like yourself looking for their first boat. Opinions vary on how a newbie should choose their first boat.

A few observations:
-As a newbie, you are NOT able to properly evaluate a 23 foot sailboat. Sail condition, deck condition (water penetration into the wood core), and condition of standing rigging are just a few things you won't be able to evaluate, and problems in these areas are expensive to fix.

-A $1,000 boat or even a free boat can eat a huge hole in your wallet.

-I would highly recommend you use a professional yacht surveyor to inspect the boat. Inspect it as best you can by yourself and then hire the best surveyor you can find. It'll cost you a few hundred. Post a query here to find out who's best in your area. That may seem like a lot of money, but you will spend so much more if you buy a boat with issues. And I mean soooooo much more. Not only will it cost you money, but it could turn you off to sailing, which would be even worse.

-$1,000 boats have issues. That's why they're not $5,000 boats.

-Sure, you could give it your own personal inspection, fork over $800 that you've negotiated, and have yourself a real gem, that just needs a power washing and some fresh fuel. And when you have it ready to go, I hope you'll sail it up and visit my unicorn ranch on the moon.

-It's just a big fiberglass thing, and fiberglass is easy to repair! Like I said, stop by my ranch anytime.

-If $1000 is your budget, get a $1000 boat. That'd be something like a nice Sunfish or a Butterfly, etc..

-If you want a 23ish sized boat, spend the loot to get one, and get one that's been maintained and can hold up to the scrutiny of a good surveyor. I recently sold a 2004 Precision 23, and the buyer used a surveyor. Smart buyer. I sold it for $18,500. Well maintained boat with fresh sails and a good value for the buyer.

-A 23ish is a terrific way to get started. Not too much to handle, but still has some "big boat" attributes...primarily, a toilet. And a cabin for whatever you might want to do in a cabin with your girlfriend. But seriously, a great sized boat to allow you to get a real feel for sailing and sailboat ownership.

-A common theme on sailboat forums is for a newbie to post a query just like yours and ignore the advice of people who have been at this for multiple decades (4 for me), get the inexpensive old boat, and then return to the forum with questions on how to either fix it or get rid of it. Okay...that's an offensive thing to say, because you DID ask the right questions, and there's no reason for me to make any assumptions about someone I don't know. Still, there's nothing wrong with relating what I've seen happen over and over.

-If you're serious about sailing (and your should be), and you want a 22-23 foot boat, find a NICE one. Something well maintained, with sails that aren't ready to be thrown away, an engine that starts and runs smoothly, and shows pride of ownership. Probably gonna be more in the area of $4k to $7k as you look at vessels from the 70's and 80's that are well maintained.

-You said you're not looking for a project boat. That's fine, because even well maintained boats have plenty of projects for you to do. I recently got a beautifully maintained 1996 Catalina 28 with only 200 hours on the diesel. I keep a maintenance log of everything I do and you'd be amazed at how many pages are filled after only one season. Align shaft, change engine oil, refinish teak in some areas of interior, change fuel filters, compound and polish topsides and portions of deck, new anchor chain and rode, tune rigging, replace batteries, apply new vinyl name registration numbers and hull stripes, and fix every hatch and porthole so they don't leak. It goes on and on and on. Oh yeah, and replace genoa...ouch!

Best of luck to you. You've already done the single smartest thing a sailor can do: CONSULT THIS FORUM. Some of use are just blowhards and some of us are highly experienced, which is the usual mix on any forum dedicated to any subject. You'll sort it out.

PS: You asked whether parts are hard to find. Answer: no
For the most part, sailboats don't have parts that are peculiar to them. There are exceptions to that, but they are few. The rigging, winches, cleats, hatches and so on are standard items. If you make Fords by the millions you can afford to have parts made for your product, but if you make O'days, and you're LUCKY to sell a few thousand of your product, you use standard stuff. Availability of parts should be at the very bottom of your list of concerns if it should be on the list at all.[/QUOTE]
 
Sep 5, 2015
2
Oday 23 New jersey
Thanks for all the responses! While I'm a newbie to buying a boat I most defiantly have experience asking for advice :). I have 2 different friends with a combined 40 years of experience behind them in boating and will not make a purchase until they give the ok on it, I just want to get somewhat of a handle myself before I bother them.

My budget is not limited to $1000 but I understand the sentiment why $1000 and not $5000 or more. My point of view was to get something cheap to start off with and I can always build up. But in hindsite that philosophy won't work if I need to pour 10k in repairs into it. I won't really be in the market until the winter time since this season is almost over, so it gives me time to brush up on my knowledge.

But I'm glad to see that I'm at least in the right direction with a 23 footer. I think it fits what I'm looking for, basically a weekend destination during the summer to relax and have fun on and maybe entertain a few guests.

I will be sure to consult the forums as I keep looking!!
 
Oct 10, 2009
1,035
Catalina 27 3657 Lake Monroe
One thing I see is that it appears to have an old style bow rail. I could be wrong about that, but if it is a replaced rail, then its likely been smashed up on the pointy end. The going rate for a 23 in good shape is probably between $3500-$5000 (an educated guess). The most common problems are soft decks and rotted bulkheads due to poor maintenance, not deal breakers, but rather indications of future expenditures and sailing time lost to cutting, grinding, carpentry and painting.
I think at a grand, you are looking at a boat that may need a good amount of TLC to be a reliable, enjoyable boat, meaning one with an outboard that runs, sails in good order, running/standing rigging that is in good shape, rudder and centerboard not cracked and threatening imminent failure, and a working furler (which I mention because it looks to have an obsolete Hood LD).
 
Sep 25, 2008
992
Oday 25 Gibraltar
Then again if it's not too far away why not take a look at it. Maybe the owner is getting a divorce, making a sudden move away, lost his job and needs the money, just died and the family wants to get rid of it, etc. Odds are it probably needs a ton of work even though the outside looks decent (the rub rail looks like it needs work) and it's all closed up. Apparently it doesn't have a trailer so it can't be easily transported. A lot of ifs and unknowns.
 
Oct 10, 2009
1,035
Catalina 27 3657 Lake Monroe
Then again if it's not too far away why not take a look at it. Maybe the owner is getting a divorce, making a sudden move away, lost his job and needs the money, just died and the family wants to get rid of it, etc. Odds are it probably needs a ton of work even though the outside looks decent (the rub rail looks like it needs work) and it's all closed up. Apparently it doesn't have a trailer so it can't be easily transported. A lot of ifs and unknowns.
Yeah, maybe I made that sound worse than it really is. There are exceptions, good boats that are just looking for a new owner.
 
Jan 22, 2008
507
Catalina 310 278 Lyndeborough NH
I am looking to buy my first sail boat and looking for some advice. I want something small that I can go to on the weekends with my girlfriend or some friends and something that is not going to burn too big of a hole in my wallet. I do not mind making some repairs and customizations but I do not want to rebuild the whole thing from scratch. I was looking at an O'Day 23' (http://www.yachtworld.com/core/list...nits=Feet&access=Public&listing_id=76422&url=) but wanted to seek some opinions from others who have been doing this longer than me to gauge the right call.

I have a friend who can inspect the boat prior to purchase but given the age are repair parts hard to find? Would this boat and size serve the purpose that I am looking for? Are there any necessities that I may be over looking that may suggest getting a different boat? From reading the classified ad, I know its a little bare and I need to inspect it to really get a solid understanding of the boat and it's needs. But like I said just looking to ask people who have more experience than I if its the right call!

Thanks!
I purchased an O'Day 19 ($1625) and a Capri 22 ($1225) that were both ready (and safe) to sail with simply adding a little elbow grease. I have purchased other boats for less that needed much more work to be safe on the water.

Boats between 19' and 23' tend to be very easy to trailer, rig, and launch. My Capri 22 has a much larger cockpit than it's sister design, the Catalina 22. The larger cockpits of the O'Day 19 and Capri 22 make it very comfortable to take four adults out on the water. Keep that in mind.

The next thing only you can decide is whether you have the skills (or transferable skills) and the time you can spend learning the new techniques you will need to have to resurrect a neglected boat.

Can it be done? YES it can. But if your focus is to be mostly sailing, then it would be best to purchase a "better" boat.

You mentioned having a friend who can help you inspect the boat. By all means, do have this friend come with you.

Look for cracked fiberglass (beyond shallow "spider webs") and amateur repairs (most will not be quality ones and probably will need to be redone). Look for "spongy" decks by walking on them. Look for corrosion around any bolts especially the fittings on the mast and boom.

Sails should be very crisp like a well starched shirt collar. They ideally should not be torn.

It is possible to get a very good deal on a good boat. Be flexible and be willing to look for awhile as necessary.

Once you find one that meets your needs and budget, PLEASE do the proper maintenance and don't worry about offending the gods by not using the proper naming ceremony. Doing the proper maintenance keeps the gods happier.