Are there any large retailers that sell boat stove alcohol, such as Lowe's,
Home Depot, Cabella's, etc....?
thanks, pat
Home Depot, Cabella's, etc....?
thanks, pat
A little drink
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I have seen it at both Lowes and Home Depot. It might be labeled "Shellac Thinner" but the fine print will usually mention "alcohol stoves"
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Klean-Strip-Green-1-qt-Denatured-Alcohol-QKGA75003/202249513#.UhIkKo0o7IU
I have seen it in gallon containers too.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Klean-Strip-Green-1-qt-Denatured-Alcohol-QKGA75003/202249513#.UhIkKo0o7IU
I have seen it in gallon containers too.
the basic product you need will be called "denatured" alcohol.... in the paint department. all hardware type stores will carry it. lowes carries a good brand that has lower odor than some that you may find elsewhere....
it wont always say "stove fuel" on the label, and if it says marine anywhere on it, then it will be a bit higher price than the one next to it that doesnt say anything about marine use....
it wont always say "stove fuel" on the label, and if it says marine anywhere on it, then it will be a bit higher price than the one next to it that doesnt say anything about marine use....
NO! That is methanol (a.k.a. wood alcohol). Denatured Alcohol is ethanol (a.k.a. drinking alcohol) but don't drink it!!!!. The "denatured" part of the label means that they intentionally added toxins (often benzene or methanol) to make it unsuitable for drinking. This is all part of the B.S. associated with prohibition. If you can drink it then you have to add a bunch of taxes to the price. But if you just want some ethanol, you have to make it undrinkable in order to avoid the revenuers. That's big brother looking out for you.
Please explain why the big fat NO when you go on saying that benzene or methanol is added in denatured alcohol ? To quote some of the Google post:NO! That is methanol (a.k.a. wood alcohol). Denatured Alcohol is ethanol (a.k.a. drinking alcohol) but don't drink it!!!!. The "denatured" part of the label means that they intentionally added toxins (often benzene or methanol) to make it unsuitable for drinking. This is all part of the B.S. associated with prohibition. If you can drink it then you have to add a bunch of taxes to the price. But if you just want some ethanol, you have to make it undrinkable in order to avoid the revenuers. That's big brother looking out for you.
Methyl Hydrate is used primarily for thinning shellac
Also used for cleaning brushes that have been used with shellac, cleaning windows, when mixed with water, and defrosting air line hoses on tractor trailers and commercial vehicles during extreme cold temperatures
Can be used as fondue fuel or fuel for marine unpressurized alcohol stoves, and dissolving gums, resins, and celluloid
Has a low freeze point and is suitable for de-icing applications
I have been using Methyl hydrate for years in my Origo burners without any problems whatsoever. Ever !
Yeah, sorry. I did not mean to imply that it is unsuitable for this purpose. And I didn't mean to "SHOUT". I was emphasizing the chemistry. They are not the same thing. I teach chemistry so I'm naturally sensitive to chemical issues. My bias I guess... not your problem.
Methanol CH3(OH)
Ethanol CH3CH2(OH)
I guess if you use common sense it is okay to use but it is more dangerous than denatured ethanol. For instance the flash point of methanol is 2 degrees lower than ethanol which translates into it being more volatile and somewhat more likely to form explosive mixtures with air... not to imply that ethanol is a lot safer... just a tad safer. Both are dangerous but so is propane so ... be smart ????
I'm also the chemical hygiene officer at my work so I think about these things a lot.
Methanol has other issues...
Check out this listing of methanol related injuries in chemistry teaching labs...
http://www.eosenvironmental.com/docs/methanolaccidentsummary.pdf
And from the Material Safety Data Sheet (MSDS).
Vapors of methanol are slightly heavier than air, and may travel some distance to a source of ignition and flash back. Accumulations of vapors in confined
spaces may explode if ignited, and containers filled with methanol may
rupture violently if exposed to fire or excessive heat for a prolonged
duration. Direct exposure to methanol should be avoided as methanol
can be harmful if swallowed, absorbed through the skin, or inhaled.
Ingestion of as little as one to four ounces can cause irreversible injury to
the nervous system, blindness or death.
Ethanol is also a potential explosion hazard (as is rubbing alcohol) so I don't want to imply that one is a lot safer than the other. If you use alcohol stoves, It is important that you never open a bottle and/or dispense fuel if there are any open flames or hot surfaces on your boat. And if you are using methanol, you need to avoid breathing the vapors. I don't use methanol in my labs unless it is in a fume hood that draws the vapors away from my face. The stuff is toxic and prolonged, repeated exposure is likely to have negative consequences.
OK, so suppose you use denatured alcohol (Ethanol with a toxic additive) and the toxin is benzene. Do you end up breathing benzene or some derivative of benzene. If I remember whatever chemistry I learnt, I think the ring would survive burning and you would be breathing a known carcinogen.
Do formulated stove fuels have chemistry that burn without making a toxic vapor. I think I'd pay a bit extra for that!
Do formulated stove fuels have chemistry that burn without making a toxic vapor. I think I'd pay a bit extra for that!
... well most denatured ethanol contains methanol and benzene has been phased out... I have not seen benzene on an ethanol label in a long time now....but the truth of the matter is that gasoline is intentionally formulated so that aromatic rings (benzene-like) are produced in the refining steps. Aromatic rings have a much higher octane rating than does straight run gasoline (octane rating of 60) and are necessary as an anti-knocking agent (we used to use tetra-ethyl lead but leaded gasoline is now verboten) For instance pure methyl-benzene (aka Toluene) has an octane rating of 117. So to answer your question about breathing benzene vapors left over from the burn.. No... benzene burns very well and you would only be exposed when breathing the unburned vapors. And to put it into perspective, you breath more benzene-like molecules...every time you fill up your car, than you ever would in a lifetime breathing ethanol vapors from the trace amount in denatured ethanol. I'm not trying to minimize your concerns... just putting a reference scale on it.
Tks for the explanation. I understand the differences and I appreciate the analogy with the gaz we put in our cars. As with all fuels one has to be extremely careful, whether they are lit or not. Refueling the canister is also something that needs to be done carefully, and only when canister has not been used for long enough to come back to room temperature. Finally, storage in a safe area is also an important issue. Again tks.
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I have two heatmate stove/heater canisters on board that I use in the fall. i have used plain old denatured alcohol from whatever the nearest hardware store happens to be. They are very clean burning, low odor and no residue. Stay away from the "marine store" variety unless it is on sale. Last fall, I got a gallon jug from West Marine that was 4 bucks cheaper than Lowes.
Thanks for the reality check. I guess I wasn't really paying attention in Chemistry class after all.
I understand.... I'm still not sure what an infinitive is and I certainly don't know how to split one....
My boat has a Glomate alcohol stove and the only place I have readily found the proper size canister is at Gander Mountain.
You can also find the denatured alcohol in the paint aisle at Walmart. Probably the cheapest option.
One way to split an infinitive is to accidentally split one.
I understand.... I'm still not sure what an infinitive is and I certainly don't know how to split one....
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