32s5 Pointing Better
- Thread starter Elton
- Start date
Your ability to point higher might be a result of how your sails were cut, or perhaps their age. If they are stretched out, you may not be able to flatten them enough. If the sails are in relatively good condition, they might benefit from a re-cut. If you are still using the factory sails, it may be time to consider replacement.
Your crew position in the boat may have some effect as well. Experiment with getting them to move either forward or aft, and inboard or outboard changing the balance of the boat.
It might also be a perception problem. Boats ahead of you might appear to be pointing higher when in reality they are not.
Your crew position in the boat may have some effect as well. Experiment with getting them to move either forward or aft, and inboard or outboard changing the balance of the boat.
It might also be a perception problem. Boats ahead of you might appear to be pointing higher when in reality they are not.
First is this a new condition (pointing has gotten worse), or long-time condition (always like this)???
If new you have to look at what has changed. Sails get old. New crew? These other boats... new high-level competition?
But assuming you are just looking to point higher. Assumes good sails and moderate breeze:
Headsail: trimmed till leech is parallel with the boom. All telltales break evenly. Drive so outer flies and inner flicks up maybe 25% of the time.
Mainsail: sheet in till all break evenly. Traveler up till top telltail flickers. Boom should be very close to the centerline.
Helm should be close to neutral (slight weather helm). Moderate heal.
But even doing this will not keep you up with good teams. Good teams will ease both sails slightly in puffs as the wind goes aft. The driver then turns up in the faster breeze, and the trimmers trim back on. If you don't (just feather up) you will lose both distance and gauge to these boats.
If you sails are rubbish all bets are off!
Are you using your traveler properly?
http://forums.catalina.sailboatowners.com/showthread.php?t=168842
http://forums.catalina.sailboatowners.com/showthread.php?t=168842
pointing higher
There are a number of things that can be done to make a boat point higher. The first thing is to trim the sails properly. Read up on this if you are not an expert on it already. Next is good sails. If your sails are getting old pointing is the first to go. Next is the keel. Do you have a full keel? Is it clean? Have you ever had it faired?. Next is rig tuning. Have you ever had a professional rigger tune the rig. A sagging headstay will reduce pointing. Do you have an adjustable backstay? How tight is the jib halyard? Loosening the jib halyard will improve pointing (with a price).
There are a number of things that can be done to make a boat point higher. The first thing is to trim the sails properly. Read up on this if you are not an expert on it already. Next is good sails. If your sails are getting old pointing is the first to go. Next is the keel. Do you have a full keel? Is it clean? Have you ever had it faired?. Next is rig tuning. Have you ever had a professional rigger tune the rig. A sagging headstay will reduce pointing. Do you have an adjustable backstay? How tight is the jib halyard? Loosening the jib halyard will improve pointing (with a price).
All good points expressed, appreciate the feedback. The pointing issue has been the same since first got the boat 5 years ago. Since then we have completely renewed all sails (past 2 years), main, number 1 and 2 genoas (along with a new light air spin to complement our other 3 spins). In our generally light air conditions we rarely use a jib. Typically the 160 (light to 10 knots or so) or when the wind kicks up a bit (12 to 15) go to the 135. Tightly trimmed in 10 to 12 knots wind we typically point at about 23.5 to 25 degrees off. We compete most closely with a J 29, SR 27 and Melges 24, who all seem to get that 22.5 to 23.5 degrees off. Up wind we keep pace, just losing out on that 2 or so degrees. As pointed out, we likely need to feather and trim more closely in the puffs and work on overall crew weight placement to fine tune.
I was thinking about getting a hydrallic back stay tensioner to assist in that area... Anyone had experience with a hydrallic tensioner?
I was thinking about getting a hydrallic back stay tensioner to assist in that area... Anyone had experience with a hydrallic tensioner?
That's impressive company. What keel do you have? I doubt your 32s5 can match their angles. Trying to will be slow. Bigger question; how do you do on handicap?
To my point; the J29 is shorter than you but rates FASTER. But you outwaterline him. Part of how he does that is faster windward VMG via a better angle.
I agree. Have you done the math to see what footing off will do to help? sometimes pinching up to "keep abreast" of boats that point higher will mean more boat speed for you although over a slightly longer course. Could be the extra speed for a smaller longer distance could work out for you. Sometimes it works for us, even in our one-design races.
Yes, that is typically our strategy, go for speed, then come back on them. Our PHRF is 149 while theirs is in the 109 to 129 range. The overall fleet of 15 boats range from 109 through to 160. We almost always finish right in behind the speedsters (5), baring a major muckup which of course happens from time to time. Race season starts here in a few short weeks.
Fin keel... We will rarely correct over. They are rated at 109 for the SR 27, 129 for the J29 while I'm at 149. We have a fleet of 15 ranging from 109 to 160 PHRF. Going downwind they really fly... The good news is that we generally finish behind the 5 speedsters (3 Melges 24's plus the J and SR) but ahead of the others...
Racing starts here end of March, so starting to think about what we need for the season...
Elton,
All good!
The key to doing well as a slower rated boat in a handicap fleet is finding the ability to sail your own race. Following those guys upwind is no fun because you are gassed at the end of the line. And not being able to points as high means you lose your lane when you are ahead. I'd suggest finding ways to get clear. Upwind, make a clearing tack to get some clear air then get back in phase. Downwind its great because you get to the mark after they do; pop that big kite and mess up their air wherever possible.
Polish your maneuvers at the corners. The sporties will all get there at about the same time and piss on each other while rounding. You can come in clean and alone; make your turn and have the kite up before the transom clears the mark. fast.
All good!
The key to doing well as a slower rated boat in a handicap fleet is finding the ability to sail your own race. Following those guys upwind is no fun because you are gassed at the end of the line. And not being able to points as high means you lose your lane when you are ahead. I'd suggest finding ways to get clear. Upwind, make a clearing tack to get some clear air then get back in phase. Downwind its great because you get to the mark after they do; pop that big kite and mess up their air wherever possible.
Polish your maneuvers at the corners. The sporties will all get there at about the same time and piss on each other while rounding. You can come in clean and alone; make your turn and have the kite up before the transom clears the mark. fast.
You can also find a partner to do speed/upwind testing with. Set a measured course so you can adjust for handicap and do "rabbit starts" with the partner and see who comes out on top. You can also work upwind on parallel courses with the partner and make trim adjustments to your boat while holding the other boats trim constant to see what effects the adjustments have. Or, rent a pro for a day and do the above.
Is your sailmaker local? If you bought 4 new sails in the past couple of years I think he would be happy to take a ride on the boat and make suggestions, like maybe on the first race of the season.