I have bought a 79' 27' Hunter at the beginning of the season and while she is still a solid boat still, I have noticed while prepping her for winter the usual winter haul that the mast step inside the cabin roof is no longer convex. It's beyond flat, it's concave. My question is, is there actually a core under the mast and if so, where and how far does it extend? Should I just wait till the mast is off and go from there? Has anyone had this problem before and cured it? Jim@Ampcast.com
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What's in my 1981 27'
I had my topside checked for moisture this fall. Beside my maststep I have an antena wire that comes through the cabin top. It looked like there may be a small leak there. I drilled a couple of small wholes about two inches from the mast step too see if the core was wet. I did not find core. I found solid fiberglass and then metal. You say your cabin roof is concave around the mast? Thats a good indication as you know there may be a problem. I would have a surveyor check the mosture content first. Then drill a couple holes to see whats in your core. Regardless If it were my boat I would fix the concave problem.
I had my topside checked for moisture this fall. Beside my maststep I have an antena wire that comes through the cabin top. It looked like there may be a small leak there. I drilled a couple of small wholes about two inches from the mast step too see if the core was wet. I did not find core. I found solid fiberglass and then metal. You say your cabin roof is concave around the mast? Thats a good indication as you know there may be a problem. I would have a surveyor check the mosture content first. Then drill a couple holes to see whats in your core. Regardless If it were my boat I would fix the concave problem.
that would appear
Richard, that is what appears to be what is in my boat as well, no core, just fiberglass at crucial weight distribution areas when 'knocking around. to enlighten the matter a little more, the forward bulkhead has a weight carrying and decor piece of teak running just slightly off center from the mast to the sole where there is a timber directly underneath it. And at the top of this is where the bulge is at. So I don't think the hull is a problem, otherwise there would be damage there as well and adjaceant areas, but I however have a little bit of bulkhead shifting as I can now see little gaps where the wood has moved to a new postion leaving fresh marks in it's process. Granted it's not much, but it is there and the ceiling is now concave. I'm not sure how this problem could have occured and trust me, I will fix it, then I'll post an article about the how-to. I would just like to be armed with information before I dive in head first as I like to do all the repairs myself.
Richard, that is what appears to be what is in my boat as well, no core, just fiberglass at crucial weight distribution areas when 'knocking around. to enlighten the matter a little more, the forward bulkhead has a weight carrying and decor piece of teak running just slightly off center from the mast to the sole where there is a timber directly underneath it. And at the top of this is where the bulge is at. So I don't think the hull is a problem, otherwise there would be damage there as well and adjaceant areas, but I however have a little bit of bulkhead shifting as I can now see little gaps where the wood has moved to a new postion leaving fresh marks in it's process. Granted it's not much, but it is there and the ceiling is now concave. I'm not sure how this problem could have occured and trust me, I will fix it, then I'll post an article about the how-to. I would just like to be armed with information before I dive in head first as I like to do all the repairs myself.
Check the cabin sole
I had the same problem with my 1980 H27. The problem was the support rib under the cabin sole had rotted and the entire mast support was collapsing. This is a common problem with the wood encased rib or the metal support on the H30. Look at the cabin sole at the mast support and see if it isn't depressed. If it is, that is probably your real problem. I had take up the teak and holly plywood and cut the floor away to get to the rib. I did it without taking the mast down by drilling a hole in the support and jacking the mast up off the floor enough to work under it. If you take the mast down, it is a piece of cake and you can check the mast step area too. Email me at wrenninger3@comcast.net if you think I can be of help. Good luck.
I had the same problem with my 1980 H27. The problem was the support rib under the cabin sole had rotted and the entire mast support was collapsing. This is a common problem with the wood encased rib or the metal support on the H30. Look at the cabin sole at the mast support and see if it isn't depressed. If it is, that is probably your real problem. I had take up the teak and holly plywood and cut the floor away to get to the rib. I did it without taking the mast down by drilling a hole in the support and jacking the mast up off the floor enough to work under it. If you take the mast down, it is a piece of cake and you can check the mast step area too. Email me at wrenninger3@comcast.net if you think I can be of help. Good luck.
Step "sandwich" description & fix
Here is a recent post on the structure, problems, and a fix for the mast step/compression post on the h27: The bottom (fiberglass floor resting on the grid which is glassed to the hull) is seldom the problem on these boats. If there is a depression around the foot of the mast, though this bears further investigation. The most common problem is rot of the wodden cores between the aluminum mast step and the compression post. (the aluminum step on our h27 is a 3-4 inch stub that is bolted through the deck and liner, and fits into the bottom of the mast.) The "sandwich" under the aluminum step goes like this, top down: Aluminum step. Fiberglass layer around the step area. Wood layer 1. End balsa or plywood to add stiffness under the mast. The deck top fiberglass layer. Wood layer 2. Usually end balsa, but plywood has also been reported. Deck bottom fiberglass layer. Cabin liner - fiberglass. What happens is that water seeps into the bolt holes holding the aluminum step down, or along the pipe in the middle for the antenna and other wiring. It gets into the wood, and turns it to mush. Symptoms are: - The stays seem too long. - The cabin liner wraps around the compression post and cabin partition. - The cabin door (if you have one) won't slide. - The above two symptoms disappear when the mast is unstepped. - A moisture survey meter detects excess moisture around the step area. A drill core sample shows rotted wood - this is a destructive test, but may be needed to see if both wood layers are affected. A substitute is the get the wire pipe out (no mean feat) and sample the wood to the sides of the pipe. The repair is to cut out top two the fiberglass layers to expose the step area. scrape back under the fiberglass until you get to clean wood. Let it dry out. Replace the wood with epoxy (and aluminum where appropriate - it's cheaper than epoxy, stiffer, and sets a whole lot faster!) Build the fiberglass layers back with the correct amount of taper (look this up if you you are doing it yourself) to ensure like new strength. Finish the top layer, and blend it into the deck. (You took pictures and measurements before you started, right?) Then drill/fill/drill for the wire pipe, and the bolts holding down the aluminum step. (Drill a hole bigger than you need. Fill it with epoxy. Let it harden, then drill the hole you need in the epoxy. This protects the wood layer from future water infusion with a layer of epoxy. Reassemble, and remount. Step and tune the mast, and sail away! You can do the job if you have the time, and willingness to learn how to do fiberglass. I lacked both, and had an excellent job done by a local yard with a good fiberglass reputation for about $1,100 on our h27. The key consideration is just the time to let all that epoxy set! This is not a difficult repair. And you can end up with a mast step as good (or better) than new. Good luck, David Lady Lillie '77 h27
Here is a recent post on the structure, problems, and a fix for the mast step/compression post on the h27: The bottom (fiberglass floor resting on the grid which is glassed to the hull) is seldom the problem on these boats. If there is a depression around the foot of the mast, though this bears further investigation. The most common problem is rot of the wodden cores between the aluminum mast step and the compression post. (the aluminum step on our h27 is a 3-4 inch stub that is bolted through the deck and liner, and fits into the bottom of the mast.) The "sandwich" under the aluminum step goes like this, top down: Aluminum step. Fiberglass layer around the step area. Wood layer 1. End balsa or plywood to add stiffness under the mast. The deck top fiberglass layer. Wood layer 2. Usually end balsa, but plywood has also been reported. Deck bottom fiberglass layer. Cabin liner - fiberglass. What happens is that water seeps into the bolt holes holding the aluminum step down, or along the pipe in the middle for the antenna and other wiring. It gets into the wood, and turns it to mush. Symptoms are: - The stays seem too long. - The cabin liner wraps around the compression post and cabin partition. - The cabin door (if you have one) won't slide. - The above two symptoms disappear when the mast is unstepped. - A moisture survey meter detects excess moisture around the step area. A drill core sample shows rotted wood - this is a destructive test, but may be needed to see if both wood layers are affected. A substitute is the get the wire pipe out (no mean feat) and sample the wood to the sides of the pipe. The repair is to cut out top two the fiberglass layers to expose the step area. scrape back under the fiberglass until you get to clean wood. Let it dry out. Replace the wood with epoxy (and aluminum where appropriate - it's cheaper than epoxy, stiffer, and sets a whole lot faster!) Build the fiberglass layers back with the correct amount of taper (look this up if you you are doing it yourself) to ensure like new strength. Finish the top layer, and blend it into the deck. (You took pictures and measurements before you started, right?) Then drill/fill/drill for the wire pipe, and the bolts holding down the aluminum step. (Drill a hole bigger than you need. Fill it with epoxy. Let it harden, then drill the hole you need in the epoxy. This protects the wood layer from future water infusion with a layer of epoxy. Reassemble, and remount. Step and tune the mast, and sail away! You can do the job if you have the time, and willingness to learn how to do fiberglass. I lacked both, and had an excellent job done by a local yard with a good fiberglass reputation for about $1,100 on our h27. The key consideration is just the time to let all that epoxy set! This is not a difficult repair. And you can end up with a mast step as good (or better) than new. Good luck, David Lady Lillie '77 h27
drill holes and inject epoxie
someone told me you could unstep mast and inject epoxy into the resulting cavity through a series of drillrd holes. would this be to weak a repair?
someone told me you could unstep mast and inject epoxy into the resulting cavity through a series of drillrd holes. would this be to weak a repair?
I'd fix it right
This is a critical part of your boat. If you have the time, and can learn to lay-up fiberglass (lot's of us have learned) you can take apart the step, get out all the rotted wood, and do the rebuild yourself. The material cost for my job was minimal. To avoid re-occurance of the problem, your have to get all the rotted wood out. I read about a repair of the deck by putting a bent nail in a drill through regular holes in the deck, then sucking out the pulp with a vacuum. I just don't see how this will work on this complicated structure. David Lady Lillie
This is a critical part of your boat. If you have the time, and can learn to lay-up fiberglass (lot's of us have learned) you can take apart the step, get out all the rotted wood, and do the rebuild yourself. The material cost for my job was minimal. To avoid re-occurance of the problem, your have to get all the rotted wood out. I read about a repair of the deck by putting a bent nail in a drill through regular holes in the deck, then sucking out the pulp with a vacuum. I just don't see how this will work on this complicated structure. David Lady Lillie
D.F. H'33 owners are looking for you!
David Foster: There are several Hunter owners looking for you on the Hunter List. I guess you email address on the HOW site is not correct. You may want to contact Steve Weinstein at (windsock1@pipeline.com)
David Foster: There are several Hunter owners looking for you on the Hunter List. I guess you email address on the HOW site is not correct. You may want to contact Steve Weinstein at (windsock1@pipeline.com)
Well
I am a veteran of fiberglass repair or more so, construction, thanks to prior previous job 'professions'. Today I was able to get away from my day job and further inspect the problem. And what I found was that the cabin sole is not the problem and there isn't any rot, indication of rot or floor anomolies and this obviously leaves me looking to the cabin roof. So when I pull the boat for winter storage, I'll drill some key point holes around the foot of the mast and go from there. If anyone else has any ideas about the construction methods used on this particular boat, I am all Ears
I am a veteran of fiberglass repair or more so, construction, thanks to prior previous job 'professions'. Today I was able to get away from my day job and further inspect the problem. And what I found was that the cabin sole is not the problem and there isn't any rot, indication of rot or floor anomolies and this obviously leaves me looking to the cabin roof. So when I pull the boat for winter storage, I'll drill some key point holes around the foot of the mast and go from there. If anyone else has any ideas about the construction methods used on this particular boat, I am all Ears
I bought a 78 30 Hunter a few years ago and have done and endless amount of reading on the famous mast sag situation. I have to admit that I feel a little perplexed that I've never read whats causing the problem. I'm posting this for those who would like to know what the real deal is. I finally got around to tearing my boat apart for various upgrades and in doing so I also tackled this mast sag problem. I took the mast down, removed the pressure post and am rebuilding the iron I beam at the bottom with SS. After looking closely at the mast step the cause of this sag problem became very obvious. We all already know that water gets in under the mast and rots the core. We also all know that its normal for water to get inside the mast. The bottom line is the mast step is poorly designed. By that I mean it does have a cut out in the aft portion for water to drain out from any water getting inside the mast but it also has a cutout in the bottom of it which serves as a pocket built to hold water. Until the water level gets up to about 1/4 inch or the thickness of the step bottom plate it can't run out the aft drain. So where does it go, it just sets there and works its way under the mast step and towards the 4 bolts holding it down. Then of course contanmates the underside and rots the wood under the mast. My solution is after I get this all put back together I'm going to put a couple of inches of resin in the bottom of the mast step to cover the 4 bolts and to fill in this bottom area. Then anything coming down the inside of the mast will have no place to go except out the aft drin in the step. This was really a stupid thing for Hunter to do. What were they thinking? Steve
new to sailing
I had my hunter inspected a couple of weeks ago because it had a very slight concave area around the mast. The inspector indicated this was not uncommon with Hunters of this vintage (1980). He sounded the area and found no gapping or defect. His meter did not detect any moisture but told me I should pull up the plate this winter when the mast is unstepped and check things out. Then re-seal the plate but continue to check it out each year. He tells me that more than likely some mositure has gotten in there but that this is common for a deck stepped mast. His view is to monitor it for now, but check it each winter. Love to hear view or commons I am new to sailing.
I had my hunter inspected a couple of weeks ago because it had a very slight concave area around the mast. The inspector indicated this was not uncommon with Hunters of this vintage (1980). He sounded the area and found no gapping or defect. His meter did not detect any moisture but told me I should pull up the plate this winter when the mast is unstepped and check things out. Then re-seal the plate but continue to check it out each year. He tells me that more than likely some mositure has gotten in there but that this is common for a deck stepped mast. His view is to monitor it for now, but check it each winter. Love to hear view or commons I am new to sailing.
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