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SBO format

Discussion in 'Ask A Macgregor Owner' started by walt, Feb 3, 2018. Add this thread to a FAQ

  1. walt

    walt

    Joined Jun 1, 2007
    3,239 posts, 371 likes
    Macgregor 26S Hobie TI, Capri Coronado 15
    US Denver, Colorado
    I have in the past thought that SBO was a really great forum - great folks and they made that even better by hosting pictures.

    However, a couple years ago SBO changed the format somewhat to put all recent posts on a side line. This had the effect of blurring the boundaries of all the forums. Sometimes this is good as you often get expert advice from outside the sub forum you are posting in. However, there are also bad sides. I personally have had poor forum behavior because of responding to some thread that popped up in the recent posts without really knowing what the thread was about. My apologies for doing this.. I try and be more careful now. Since this is a Mac forum, we also sometimes have some complete dink head post something negative about Macs. Since I own a Mac and know what tradeoffs that are important to me and this is still the boat I pick, I think its just fine for dink head to have those opinions.. but I dont want to participate with that sort of person in a forum.

    So.. Im wondering if people that participate in this forum would prefer if it was NOT part of the global "recent post". I enjoy a more private place where I can share my enthusiasm for the boat I have but it takes only a very small percent of dink heads to screw that up and drive people off.

    I would vote that the Mac forum NOT be on the global recent posts. Anyone could still go to and respond to the Mac forum, it would just cut way down on the fly by and sometimes dink head posting.
     


    Last edited: Feb 3, 2018
    TortugasRoyal likes this.
  2. Brian D

    Brian D Moderator

    Joined Feb 17, 2006
    4,085 posts, 729 likes
    Lancer 27PS
    US MCB Camp Pendleton, Ca KF6BL
    Walt, I am going to tag @Phil Herring on this so that he is aware of your feelings and desires for the Mac forum.
     


  3. Traveler

    Traveler

    Joined Nov 29, 2017
    18 posts, 3 likes
    MacGregor 26M
    US Home
    To be frank, I came to this forum when Mac Sailors was down.

    I am disappointed with what I found here. Not that the posters are bad, or the content is not factual, but rather, this forum does not really do much for M owners ( of which I am).

    I also found this site confusing. I was suddenly getting post for the “Hunter’s Owners” forum. As for the “dink”, I have not seen that yet. I’m just going back to macgregorsailors.

    Thanks for the shot of Mac juice I got while the other site was down.
     


  4. Phil Herring

    Phil Herring Dethroned Admin

    Joined Mar 25, 1997
    4,378 posts, 254 likes
    US Bainbridge Island
    Hi @walt! That's a fair point. There are two different ways to access recent posts -- the old style with the threads on the left and the posts on the right I can modify, and we should be able to offer that tailored to the site.

    The other method (at https://forums.sailboatowners.com/index.php?find-new/15259387/posts ) will be pretty tough to modify. It's part of the core forum software and messing with that can do more harm than good. Maybe it's time to think about a new forum entry page that shows recent posts in a way that's configurable. I will give that some thought.
     


  5. Kermit

    Kermit

    Joined Jul 31, 2010
    4,697 posts, 1,888 likes
    Hunter 260
    US Lake Murray Sailing Club, SC
    I thought you could choose which forae you wanted to read. I choose to be able to read just about all of them on the outside chance there could be info that could pertain to my interests.
     


    kloudie1 likes this.
  6. Sumner

    Sumner

    Joined Jan 31, 2009
    5,153 posts, 202 likes
    Macgregor 26S/Endeavour 37 .
    US Utah's Canyon Country
    I often wondered where the people come from that want to post negative posts on a forum that isn't associated with the boat they have, like the ones Walt mentioned. Now I know thanks to Walt's post.

    I go to basically 4 forums on here and have a link saved directly to each in my favorites and go directly to them via their individual links so never see the 'new posts' page. Didn't even know that it existed :what:.

    I guess now I see where these posters are coming from. I try to ignore them but at times they do get under your skin and I don't understand why someone, anyone, would want to bash someone else's choice of boats. We all have different needs and wants and even they often change with time.

    I think the behavior of a few keeps many from posting on these boards and they become 'looker's' only. Unfortunately it takes a thick skin to contribute at times,

    Sumner
     


    Last edited: Feb 3, 2018
    centerline, JCall and Will Gilmore like this.
  7. AlastairLC

    AlastairLC

    Joined Jan 2, 2017
    343 posts, 98 likes
    O'Day 322
    US Lake Pleasant


  8. Brian D

    Brian D Moderator

    Joined Feb 17, 2006
    4,085 posts, 729 likes
    Lancer 27PS
    US MCB Camp Pendleton, Ca KF6BL
    Eh? Can you elaborate for me please? To the best of my knowledge, I haven't seen a post disappear (except the ones that us moderators make disappear). If there is an issue we need to know about it.

    But back to Walt and Traveler and the rest of the Mac group. Now is a good time to let Phil know what is on your mind. I have seen him work wonders, although his hands are tied by the design of the board. So work with him, just don't jump ship. There are lots of Mac sailors here both seen and unseen.
     


  9. Joe

    Joe

    Joined Jun 1, 2004
    6,524 posts, 350 likes
    Catalina 27
    US Mission Bay, San Diego
    I don't see how you can filter out trolls by eliminating the "ask all sailors" tag without disrupting the entire membership. Though there are a number of boat specific issues, most are general in nature. They can spark discussion by a wide cross section of forum members, which is good for everyone... even Macgregor owners.

    In the past, there have been incidents of "dink" behavior....I guess a "dink" is someone who bad mouths someone's boat.. (dink, like dinghy. Get it)....... but for the past few years the moderators have kept this in check and I, personally, have seen little of it..... Of course, I don't go deep into threads that aren't of interest to me... so perhaps I missed Walt's conflict.

    That said, I hope we don't change the forum layout again... I still use the "legacy" old style mode 'cause change is hard for me. And I don't want to have to check 7 or 8 separate forums to see what's new.
     


  10. Will Gilmore

    Will Gilmore

    Joined Oct 19, 2017
    3,153 posts, 1,417 likes
    O'Day 19
    US Littleton, NH
    I appreciate the current SBO format. I use the New Posts page alot. I generally stay off posts like "What did you do with Your Mac Today" because that's obviously Mac specific, but I would feel free to read and join in on a conversation about sail trim, CBs, navigation, onboard cooking, beach camping, anchoring, etc, even if it was posted in a Mac specific forum.
    As an O'Day owner, I really don't spend much time on the O'Day forum. Most of my interests, questions and knowledge are general to sailing.

    It would be nice if those who felt one boat or another was inferior would refrain from being insulting. A pros and con examination when talking to the many concerned buyers that post here is fine, but to offer an opinion that is completely subjective and uninvited, is just insecurities coming out as meaness. There may be nothing the moderators can do about that because those people may go out of their way to spread their malcontent.

    Perhaps, there could be an opt-out list so individuals can choose not to see new posts from specific forums.
    When I see the latests posts on the New Posts page, they are removed from the list simply by my visiting them. I see the same list if I use the back button, but not if I click on the New Posts tab. Could that feature be used to filter specific forums out? It is obviously a static page that is generated on the fly. If the page generator saw me as having already seen the pages on that forum then it wouldn't include those posts in the list it generates for me.

    I'm am sorry that such negative behavior has to have this effect on the rest of us. I personally, have not read anyone's posts that either denigrate a particular brand of boat or insult individuals directly, but with this many people all collecting and contributing their thoughts and perspectives in one place, it isn't surprising to hear about. It is more surprising that there is so little of it.
    SBO has my gratitude for the incredible job they are doing. The sailing community, as well, is populated by a truly exceptional group of people. :thumbup: I am honored to be able to count myself among them and I hope I will be welcome to contribute to any of these forums. Thank you.

    - Will (Dragonfly)
     


    BigEasy likes this.
  11. Sumner

    Sumner

    Joined Jan 31, 2009
    5,153 posts, 202 likes
    Macgregor 26S/Endeavour 37 .
    US Utah's Canyon Country
    Agreed, and hope my previous post didn't imply that.

    I'm very happy with the board and not going anywhere, just wish some people would refrain from bashing other people's boats, ideas and/or mods they have done. Still, as Will mentioned, not to much of that goes on here. I do feel that more would post if they felt they weren't going to be the recipient of that kind of behavior,

    Sumner
     


  12. Sumner

    Sumner

    Joined Jan 31, 2009
    5,153 posts, 202 likes
    Macgregor 26S/Endeavour 37 .
    US Utah's Canyon Country
    An example...
    I don't see where the comment above serves any constructive purpose,

    Sumner
     


    BudGates likes this.
  13. Will Gilmore

    Will Gilmore

    Joined Oct 19, 2017
    3,153 posts, 1,417 likes
    O'Day 19
    US Littleton, NH
    I had read that comment and remember thinking how insulting that was, but I can see where the poster that was directed at would remember it, where I was just a bystander and hardly notice it as more than some of the boisterous ribbing that sometimes goes on here. I would be surprised if the person who said that really thought he was going to hurt anyone. It was a thoughtless thing to say. I wouldn't be prepared to believe it was meant to be mean.

    I was told to refrain from posting on subjects I have no experience with, but I don't think that comment was meant to hurt me. He was just concerned that the waters might get muddied around a technical subject. My opinion may have been controversial where a conservative approach was looked for. It's no big deal and it certainly didn't affect how I felt about the poster, who happened to be one of the most knowledgeable members on SBO. He later admitted to being a little more thoughtless in his words than her meant to be. It's all fine and I hope that he may consider me a friend even if it's just as members of the same online community for a few hours a day.

    - Will (Dragonfly)
     


    centerline likes this.
  14. walt

    walt

    Joined Jun 1, 2007
    3,239 posts, 371 likes
    Macgregor 26S Hobie TI, Capri Coronado 15
    US Denver, Colorado
    Well.. it is what it is and thanks for at least considering making the Mac forum a little more private. Sounds like too much of a pain in the axx so please dont worry. Besides the great people here, I have to say this is also a very well moderated forum. The forum is not only useful for learning something but I love it when someone gets enthusiastic about something they are working on or some adventure they had. But it takes very little, even just one person to damage that enthusiasm.

    I personally have no interest at all in the large outboard stuff so am happy to not see much of it here (just not my sport but I have zero problem if someone want that option - your choice in tradeoffs is just as good as mine) but, if you want to know where the Mac power sailors have gone , its to here http://www.macgregorsailors.com/forum/index.php and if you go to face book and search for "macgregor sailboat", two active groups pop up. These are also mostly the power sailers. I cant help think that a FB group just focused on older Venture and Mac sailboats (not the power sailors) might be an option if someone (it only takes one) still needs to try and damage the stoke here. It would be sort of like this thread https://forums.sailboatowners.com/i...u-do-to-your-mac-today-thread.156758/page-105 same easy to post pictures. That group does not currently exist however..

    Anyhow.. hope to continue the fellowship and sharing the enthusiasm here at SBO in the Mac forum. And if its a hassle to make it a little more private.. well its 99.99 percent great just as is.



    it_is_what_it_is.JPG
     


    Last edited: Feb 4, 2018
  15. shemandr

    shemandr

    Joined Jan 1, 2006
    3,642 posts, 664 likes
    Marblehead Skiff 14'
    US Greenport, NY
    I like the Legacy new posts format and page. That is where I go first to see new posts or additional posts on a thread I am following.
     


  16. Sumner

    Sumner

    Joined Jan 31, 2009
    5,153 posts, 202 likes
    Macgregor 26S/Endeavour 37 .
    US Utah's Canyon Country
    It is also amazing to know that a lot of those Mac power sailors have had large boats in the past and have done extensive cruising outside of U.S. waters, often times years at a time. Their current boat meets their current needs and most of them are just as passionate with their current boat as they were with their past boats.

    These guys/gals are sailors. I personally know of one husband wife team who own a Mac power Sailboat. They have sailed it from Seattle to Alaska and back, Sea of Cortez, three times to the Bahamas (once to Long Island there), the Great Loop along with many other Canadian and U.S. waters. How many of us regardless of boat size or type can say the same?

    I wish more of them would also call this home as they have a lot to offer,

    Sumner

    1300 miles to The Bahamas and Back in the Mac...
    Endeavour 37 Mods...
    MacGregor 26-S Mods...
    Mac Trips to Utah, Idaho, Wyoming, Canada, Florida, Bahamas
     


    Last edited: Feb 4, 2018
    centerline and Will Gilmore like this.
  17. Will Gilmore

    Will Gilmore

    Joined Oct 19, 2017
    3,153 posts, 1,417 likes
    O'Day 19
    US Littleton, NH
    I had never heard of Macs, not to turn this into a Mac focused thread because I think the important issue at stake is overall organization and site behavior, two years ago when I was looking online for a good trailerable boat that would beach in thin water, I came across the Macs. I asked my father if he was familiar with them. His experience was decades old and he thought people just bought them because they were fast. Another friend who is into modern racing had completely the opposite opinion of them. However, from what I've seen here, Sumner is right, Mac owners are one of the most enthusiastic owner groups I've seen.
    :clap:

    - Will (Dragonfly)
     


  18. Scott B

    Scott B Moderator

    Joined Sep 20, 2006
    2,542 posts, 122 likes
    Hunter 33
    CA Georgian Bay, Ontario, Canada
    It lists the threads with new posts that you have not seen. Once you read the thread, or reply, it lists it as "read" and goes to the bottom of the list. It's still there, just many pages down. You just need to go into the forum that contains the thread and it will be there by replied date.
     


    Will Gilmore likes this.
  19. Scott B

    Scott B Moderator

    Joined Sep 20, 2006
    2,542 posts, 122 likes
    Hunter 33
    CA Georgian Bay, Ontario, Canada

    If you just click on Ask a MacGregor Owner forum, it lists the thread in order of most recent posts. The other New Posts captures all the forums. If you just want MacGregor threads just click that forum. It's the same for all owners, Catalina, Hunter, Bene etc.

    BTW, if you see a "dink" post just hit the Report button. With 2 of us on the East coast and 2-3 on the West coast, one of us is typically awake so can respond fairly quickly. Bashing of any brand is not tolerated.
     


  20. Jackdaw

    Jackdaw

    Joined Nov 8, 2010
    9,432 posts, 2,518 likes
    Beneteau First 36.7 & 260
    US Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
    I'll dip a toe into this...

    I'm a huge fan of anyone that sails, and the boat that they choose to do it is 100% their business; often a refection of where they are in life, location, and whats important to them. Just like me. We're all the same in the end. Personally I get a lot out of reading all posts, including the Mac forum. I think guys like Walt, Sum, and Cus have done amazing things to their boats and its all very impressive, and shows a lot of ingenuity, passion, and pride.

    I do agree that sometime peoples brand passion can go too far. The passion is great, as long as it does not come at the expense of others. NOBODY'S boat is perfect, even for them. Its even less perfect for others. I love my perfectly imperfect boat, but know its definitively not right for everyone. Maybe even no one else.

    Personally, I try and strike a balance between good advice and not offending. I can be rather opinionated so sometimes the second part might be hard, so my apologies in advance! ;^)

    In general I'm pretty chill about differences in pure opinion. Where I'll really make a stand is in factual errors. If I think you're wrong, I'll tell you I think you're wrong. If I know you're wrong, I'll for sure say that as well.

    As to the new guys, they are the lifeblood of internet forums. No one stays around forever, and even if they did the same old topics over and over would start to get boring. So guys like Simon and Will add a lot to the conversation.

    Its a great formula.
     


    Last edited: Feb 7, 2018
    Roland5048, JCall, BudGates and 3 others like this.

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