New rudder from Beneteau

[Bluewaters2812]

Hi folks,

We have just ordered a new (complete) rudder from the Beneteau factory in France. Our Oceanis 50 is French built.

The beneteau rep has advised that it can be fitted in the water. I assume that this means that it will be treated by the factory ready to fit without having to do anything to it or am I wrong? The rep has made no mention of having to prepare the rudder with antifouling or the like prior to fitting and has arranged for a diver to do the fitting as soon as the rudder and assembly arrives.

 

[Captn TJ]

I wouldn't think it has anti fouling paint since this tends to be owner specific.

Just curious why you had a replacement ordered.

 

[Jackdaw]

Hi folks,

We have just ordered a new (complete) rudder from the Beneteau factory in France. Our Oceanis 50 is French built.

The beneteau rep has advised that it can be fitted in the water. I assume that this means that it will be treated by the factory ready to fit without having to do anything to it or am I wrong? The rep has made no mention of having to prepare the rudder with antifouling or the like prior to fitting and has arranged for a diver to do the fitting as soon as the rudder and assembly arrives.

It will need what ever Anti-fouling your local conditions require. You should check to see if it needs a barrier coat. If your boat is newer, probaby not.

 

[Bluewaters2812]

I wouldn't think it has anti fouling paint since this tends to be owner specific.

Just curious why you had a replacement ordered.

Ours simply snapped off 72nm from land.

 

[FB111A]

I would want to haul the Bene and have a good look at the installation so this one doesn't fall off.

 

[Bluewaters2812]

I would want to haul the Bene and have a good look at the installation so this one doesn't fall off.

No, it didn't fall off, it snapped. There appears to have been some sea water ingress that weakened the resin where it snapped below the hull.

 

[John Nantz]

Weight the rudder

Snapped off? Ouch! That must have been a surprise!

One has to wonder about the design now, for example, does the new one have the same rudder stock as the old one? Same as in, wall thickness and strength? If it does, then one must wonder if the old one had a defect or what it might take for the new one to have a problem.

If the rudder stock is stronger, then the part that holds the bearing probably needs strengthening. These would be thing I'd be asking Beneteau about.

For installing the new rudder it will have to be weighted so that the diver can have it go under water in order to get the rudder stock into the bearing. Without weight, the flotation is tremendous.

Barrier coat: I'd second that it should be checked. Mold wax removal needed?

Once the rudder is installed there may need to be a hole or holes drilled for a quadrant or what ever is used for steering. If possible, one would want to do this before installing it but measure twice and only drill once.

Perhaps use a sacrificial pipe to check if the hole would be in the right place, even plastic pipe would work, doesn't have to exactly fit. Don't know who will be doing the job but if a yard person does it they probably wouldn't like their "professional" credentials questioned. But if they screw up, who pays? A few years ago I had a guy with many years of journeyman work put a wall in a rental and, guess what, it was crooked to the wall it was perpendicular to by the amount of the wall thickness. Turned out he was a bit dyslexic. I didn't notice the error until we put the floor tile in.

If there was a spacer between the rudder and the boat it is probably long gone. Check if there was supposed to be one.

 

[Bluewaters2812]

Snapped off? Ouch! That must have been a surprise!

One has to wonder about the design now, for example, does the new one have the same rudder stock as the old one? Same as in, wall thickness and strength? If it does, then one must wonder if the old one had a defect or what it might take for the new one to have a problem.

If the rudder stock is stronger, then the part that holds the bearing probably needs strengthening. These would be thing I'd be asking Beneteau about.

For installing the new rudder it will have to be weighted so that the diver can have it go under water in order to get the rudder stock into the bearing. Without weight, the flotation is tremendous.

Barrier coat: I'd second that it should be checked. Mold wax removal needed?

Once the rudder is installed there may need to be a hole or holes drilled for a quadrant or what ever is used for steering. If possible, one would want to do this before installing it but measure twice and only drill once.

Perhaps use a sacrificial pipe to check if the hole would be in the right place, even plastic pipe would work, doesn't have to exactly fit. Don't know who will be doing the job but if a yard person does it they probably wouldn't like their "professional" credentials questioned. But if they screw up, who pays? A few years ago I had a guy with many years of journeyman work put a wall in a rental and, guess what, it was crooked to the wall it was perpendicular to by the amount of the wall thickness. Turned out he was a bit dyslexic. I didn't notice the error until we put the floor tile in.

If there was a spacer between the rudder and the boat it is probably long gone. Check if there was supposed to be one.

Thanks for the advice. Yes, the spacer has gone with the rudder. We could see it float away. had to be towed 72nm. Not a great feeling when a rudder snaps off completely for no apparent reason. We have ordered the entire assembly with spacer and bearings.

 

[John Nantz]

Oh, and one more thing ….

Thanks for the additional information.

Just thought of something else. The rudder stock will be a pipe so it will obviously be hollow on the inside. To keep water from going inside the rudder when it is put on with the boat in the water, why not fill the end of the rudder stock with some foam to keep the water out?

The devil is in the details.

Just curious, was there any sign of crevice corrosion on the remaining rudder stock where it broke?

Just re-read the original post and noticed the word "rep". Is this a warranty job, or maybe the rep just helping out?

 

[Gunni]

Glad to hear you made it in safe and sound in one piece. Was this a composite rudder shaft, or a SS shaft? Was a strike involved? Assume you don't have any suitable lift available to get the boat out for a short haul and inspection prior to rudder re-fit. Loss of a rudder is my nightmare scenario. I haul and check mine every year, but always wonder whether I missed anything. There are a few options for steering the boat without rudder, but not sure I could pull them off.

 

[Bluewaters2812]

Thanks for the additional information.

Just thought of something else. The rudder stock will be a pipe so it will obviously be hollow on the inside. To keep water from going inside the rudder when it is put on with the boat in the water, why not fill the end of the rudder stock with some foam to keep the water out?

The devil is in the details.

Just curious, was there any sign of crevice corrosion on the remaining rudder stock where it broke?

Just re-read the original post and noticed the word "rep". Is this a warranty job, or maybe the rep just helping out?

The Benny rudder is apparently sealed around the section where the rudder post enters the rudder itself with sikaflex but I will wait and see. It has a foam-filling on the inside of the post. Rep just helping out. All out of our own pocket unfortunately.

 

[Bluewaters2812]

Glad to hear you made it in safe and sound in one piece. Was this a composite rudder shaft, or a SS shaft? Was a strike involved? Assume you don't have any suitable lift available to get the boat out for a short haul and inspection prior to rudder re-fit. Loss of a rudder is my nightmare scenario. I haul and check mine every year, but always wonder whether I missed anything. There are a few options for steering the boat without rudder, but not sure I could pull them off.

It is a composite. No strike involved when it snapped. I am trying to ascertain whether a previous owner did though. The sea water ingress has happened over the last 2-4 years so it isn't new.

I managed to get a small amount of direction but with the seas and winds the way they were it was a hopeless task. I was doing maybe 1-2 knots but the current and winds were doing that or more against me and she kept intermittently swinging 180 degrees. Maybe flat water with a steady light breeze one might be able to get some direction but with no rudder at all it is virtually impossible unfortunately. :cry:

 

[Gunni]

This is troubling. The composite rudder shaft design was adopted to negate the corrosion-weakening of the encapsulated metal shaft and grid. there is no metal in my composite shaft rudder. And while my rudder tests dry, it does weep moisture from drain holes drilled each year during winter haul. These rudders really flex during heavy conditions, I wonder about the constant cycling and what the failure limit may be. It would be useful to know what the shaft looks like at the breakpoint. Did the fracture show signs of weathering and prior small stress fractures?

 

[gettinthere]

When a composite stresses it will snap quicker than SS that will bend instead.
Hunter had to switch from composite back to SS after several rudder stock failures.
Was a SS option available? What will prevent this from happening again?

 

[Manureva]

Crap! I have a rudder for an oceanis 50 2002 here. A friend gave it to me, he had ordered a new one since he thought there was a void in it. It is an easy fix and it just need to be recoated with gel coat since my friend had stripped it. You can have it free if needed, much cheaper then the 4 g beneteau want for one ! You pay shipping from bathurst new brunswick canada

Paul

 

[Bluewaters2812]

Crap! I have a rudder for an oceanis 50 2002 here. A friend gave it to me, he had ordered a new one since he thought there was a void in it. It is an easy fix and it just need to be recoated with gel coat since my friend had stripped it. You can have it free if needed, much cheaper then the 4 g beneteau want for one ! You pay shipping from bathurst new brunswick canada

Paul

That's a very kind offer Paul and thank you very much. I only wish I knew about it earlier because unfortunately I have already paid and the factory are (apparently) already building our rudder. :cry:

 

[Bluewaters2812]

Folks, thank you for the input here. I have posted about this failure elsewhere and here is the link should you be interested: http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f55/rudder-nightmare-at-sea-114018.html.

We can't wait to get out sailing again and are desperate to get out of here.

 

[AXEL]

I snapped the rudder on my C30 a couple of years ago during a grounding. I bought a replacement from Foss Foam (see link) in Fla. These guys prices were excellent and delivery time was only 7 days from Fla to NY. This included fab. They manufacture many aftermarket rudders for all boats. My new rudder needed barrier coat and bottom paint. The boat yard charged me $200 to dig a hole under the boat to fit the rudder into place. Talk about digging a hole and throwing money into. Fortunately BoatUS picked up the tab.
.
http://newrudders.com/

 

[Bluewaters2812]

I snapped the rudder on my C30 a couple of years ago during a grounding. I bought a replacement from Foss Foam (see link) in Fla. These guys prices were excellent and delivery time was only 7 days from Fla to NY. This included fab. They manufacture many aftermarket rudders for all boats. My new rudder needed barrier coat and bottom paint. The boat yard charged me $200 to dig a hole under the boat to fit the rudder into place. Talk about digging a hole and throwing money into. Fortunately BoatUS picked up the tab.
.
http://newrudders.com/

Thanks for the link. Glad you got yours sorted. We have paid the Beneteau rep already so are committed and are waiting for the rudder to arrive from the Beneteau factory in France (hopefully next Tuesday).

 

[tommays]

I know someone else whose post DID NOT BREAK as it was a bit stronger than the hull

That was the much worse scenario due to the giant leak

It is the 64 million dollar question , should you hit a UFO at speed it is unlikely something is not going to break just what is best and how you deploy the emergency rudder