New Main and Sail Repair

[Simon Sexton]

Hey Everyone,

Good evening! Yesterday, my brother, best friend, girlfriend and I all went out on my boat for a sail. Gusts were up to 27 knots, and I had my main reefed and about 110% of the genoa unfurled. Valiant performed very well, and we topped out at about 8.3 kts. on a steady reach. While sailing, though, I kept looking up at my old, worn and stretched main; the top two battens and their pockets are missing, and some of the stitching in certain spots is fraying. The sunbrella on the genoa (which is white) is also torn in a few places. My sails are functional, but I look like a ghost ship skimming across the bay. That being said, I'm saving up some cash to purchase a new main. I was thinking loose-footed with full battens, but does anyone have other suggestions? I'm also looking for performance improvement as well. I contacted a local sail repair place, and am still waiting to hear back from them so I can get a quote on a new blue sunbrella.

 

[kappykaplan]

Loose footed.

 

[glaufman]

Full batten. Plus roach.
Or maybe just repair what you've got... sounds like it might not be too bad... Is it blown out?

 

[SG]

How "old" are your sails?:

• When were they made?
• Who made them?
• They're Dacron, I presume?
• How many days have they been sailed during that time?
• How "hard" have they been sailed?
• What control "equipment" do you have AND use? (e.g., vang, backstay adjuster, Cunningham, out haul, etc.) -- Are you a tweaker? or?
• Are you using the boat in heavy weather? Generally light air? or ????

From your description, I doubt you'll be happy with some "repairs" -- but that could just be a misperception.

 

[Will Gilmore]

Loose footed.

Why full battens? You adding roach to the sail? Watch the back stay.

-Will (Dragonfly)

 

[jssailem]

Simon are you considering the ranks of racer? There is a cost savings to a top full batten and partial battens below on the main. I chose that for my new sail. Very pleased with the results.
I am cruising not racing and Dacron of today is better than Dacron of years ago. That said if I wanted to race the boat then a full set of the latest and greatest laminate sails would improve my chances of a higher finish.

 

[Joe]

Loose foot. Top two battens full, lower two partial..... That's what most sailmakers will recommend. Partial lower battens with loose foot will give you quite a bit of draft adjustment.
I would also add a couple of "draft stripes" and an extra reef attachment. (two total)

 

[Simon Sexton]

might not be too bad

I would if it weren't the original sail from 1984. Even if I did get it repaired, it'd still be stretched to heck.

 

[Simon Sexton]

How "old" are your sails?

They are the original sails that were sold with the boat in 1984. They're made of dacron, yes, and have been sailed hard from the week the owner bought her. The first owner, a guy named Breck, sailed her from California through the Panama Canal and up to Louisiana. A few years later, he met a woman through an online dating website who lived in Costa Rica, so he sailed the boat all the way there, where she stayed for about a year. He then moved in with her, married her, and sold the boat for some money to provide for his twins that were on the way. All that happened up until 1997. That year, a man named Brian and his wife were traveling Mexico for vacation during the summer, and stumbled upon Valiant sitting in dry dock. She was still in good condition, so Brian bought her, looked at his wife, and said, "What the hell, let's do it." So the both of them sailed her back to Kemah, where she stayed and didn't see too much action. Brian was a commercial pilot for Continental (United) Airlines, so his steady work schedule prevented him and his wife from sailing Valiant very often. From the year 2003, she mostly sat in her slip and was sailed maybe a handful of times a year. This all was recorded in a journal I found in one of the galley drawers. Once I found out my boat had seen so much action and done so many miles, I made sure to replace and check almost everything I could afford...everything except the sails, which were fine at the time.

 

[Simon Sexton]

Watch the back stay.

Yeah, I know ALL about the struggle of "backstay + roach = aneurisms while racing"...If the roach is too much, I'll probably just add an adjustable backstay so I can loosen it, pop it out of the way and then tighten it again.

 

[Will Gilmore]

This all was recorded in a journal I found in one of the galley drawers. Once I found out my boat had seen so much action and done so many miles, I made sure to replace and check almost everything

Don't replace that journal. Keep it going. What a treasure.

-Will (Dragonfly)

 

[SG]

Simon,

How do you sail your boat? I think that has a lot to do with what recommendations one might make.

 

[SG]

Yeah, I know ALL about the struggle of "backstay + roach = aneurisms while racing"...If the roach is too much, I'll probably just add an adjustable backstay so I can loosen it, pop it out of the way and then tighten it again.

About the fourth or fifth on the list of controls for most sailors would be the backstay adjustment on my list of main controls. That’s after traveller, outhaul, vang, and Cunningham. I know you have a main halyard ;^))).

I don’t know an adjustable backstay you “pop out of the way”?

 

[Simon Sexton]

How do you sail your boat?

I'm a racer, so I go as fast as I possibly can all the time. Light weather, foul weather, storms, rain...if there's wind, I'll sail it. I wouldn't say I completely punish my boat, but I do push her to her limits pretty often. I enjoy it

 

[Simon Sexton]

Keep it going.

Yes sir, I plan to do just that!

 

[Simon Sexton]

list of main controls

I've got all those things (the traveller is kinda weird, but it works), but an adjustable backstay would be nice to have, especially if I'm purchasing a sail with increased roach. The way I've experienced the issue firsthand is that the second batten from the top gets caught up on the backstay, preventing the sail to come through the wind on a tack or jibe. To solve the issue, I would uncleat the backstay, loosened it just enough to wiggle it, and I'd shake the heck out of it until the batten came unstuck. It was annoying for the first half hour, but I eventually got the rhythm down and it wasn't too bad.

 

[SG]

The boat isn't a little Farr. Be careful. You might try it in non-
fully battened configuration. Then use some Kevlar patches instead of treating it like it has a twing.

 

[Will Gilmore]

To solve the issue, I would uncleat the backstay, loosened it just enough to wiggle it, and I'd shake the heck out of it until the batten came unstuck.

I don't like your solution. Maybe it works fine for you, but it seems to me, during a tack, especially in strong wind, there can be a lot of sudden pressure on the jib that the backstay counter balances. Even flapping in the wind before you've sheeted in. The main sheet will usually work to hold the mast from being pulled forward, except where down wind with the sheet way out and the traveler all the way over on one side. You loosen the backstay to switch tacks and the boom comes around a little harder than expected, mast down.
This is pure speculation on my part. Maybe there won't ever be a time when the backstay is loose and the sheets are not supporting the mast while forward pressure is on them. Be sure your lower aft shrouds are in good shape. Aft swept uppers also would be a good idea.

-Will (Dragonfly)

 

[Joe]

I've got all those things (the traveller is kinda weird, but it works), but an adjustable backstay would be nice to have, especially if I'm purchasing a sail with increased roach. The way I've experienced the issue firsthand is that the second batten from the top gets caught up on the backstay, preventing the sail to come through the wind on a tack or jibe. To solve the issue, I would uncleat the backstay, loosened it just enough to wiggle it, and I'd shake the heck out of it until the batten came unstuck. It was annoying for the first half hour, but I eventually got the rhythm down and it wasn't too bad.

On your masthead rig you'll be better off not increasing the roach too much because of that issue, but if you do stay away from full battens since they are more prone to hanging up on the backstay. If you're sailing in big winds you don't need the extra roach and the snagging batten issue will become very irritating and somewhat dangerous.
The backstay on your masthead rig is for headsail adjustment, not mainsail shape..... so tacking upwind and releasing the backstay on each turn will affect the dynamic forestay tension on the headsail.....

 

[Bill19233]

Simon, I would get expert advice, talk to a local sail maker. Like Banks Sails in Kemah, they're probably familiar with yours and most boats around here and can tell you exactly what you need to sail and race on the bay. I didn't have a lot of luck with the local Quantum loft, I'm sure others are happy with them, but they measured my rig wrong and messed up the mainsail shape trying to fix it and never would make the jib right. I'm not familiar with any other area lofts.
I would get 2 top full battens and 2 lower partial battens on the main. I would not increase the roach, instead I would make sure you have all the controls set up to easily manage the mainsail area the boat was designed for. Cunningham, outhaul, traveler, vang, etc..., I don't think a backstay adjuster is that important on a masthead rig.
Good luck with it. GBCA Icicle races start this Saturday.