installing electric macerating head

[sailme88]

I hope this helps other owners who may endeavor to go this route.

As many of us have experienced, our best friends seldom appear able to read. This fact becomes obvious when they attempt to use a marine head. Very simple instructions with pictograms don't get the point across. It was getting to be a royal P.I.A. explaining how the head works. Finally, I threw in the towel. I decided to install an electric macerating head. Push the button...and it all goes away... Sound familiar? So , got the new head and went to install... Oops, the foot prints don't only NOT line up but the electric motor wants occupy space that is part of the sloping bulkhead to deck. Cutting a hole was not an option, as this head is also a shower. I needed to have everything a bit higher to clear the slope.
The solution: I went to Lowes and bought a 1x8x96 PVC trim board. I cut it into 8x8 squares. Drilled bolt holes to mount the bowl and copied the hole alignment thru all four squares. The old holes on the deck were sealed with 4400. 5" SS lag bolts secure the bowl of the head to the deck with the needed clearance in place. A second benefit... the head is now ADA compliant.. The PVC is the perfect solution. It's stable, non wood, clean white and cleans easily....

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

Good job! Got any pictures?

 

[Jerry Clark H356 SV Persi]

You will be glad you got an electric head.

 

[Parsons]

Great project, Sailme. To re-iterate Peggy's comment, for those of us who have this same improvement in our near future (this winter, if I can gather my pennies up), please post some pictures of your project. I'm also interested in the electrical button placement, if it's not one of the integrated models. Also, what head did you decide to go with, and why?

 

[sailme88]

Ok, I'll take pics of the head... I'm sure my bride will raise an eyebrow.....

I do have a short video that I sent my bride upon completion. I'll try to up load it.

RE the button: It is mount on the bulk head that is common to the wet locker and just below a grab handle. It is convenient to both sitters and standers...Although I, umm... well I suggest to all potential "standers" that they sit and no one will know but them. And should they choose to stand, EVERYONE might know....

 

[sailme88]

uploading a pic is proving difficult. Never, repeat NEVER had this problem before..I'll keep at it..

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

There is a small learning curve, but it's not that tough.
First, click on Upload a file ... "browse" to find the photo you want to upload (I selected something fun) and click on it to load it.. Now you'll see it below your post (and I'll bet this is the step you're skipping 'cuz it's not that clear that you need to)...click on it (PLEASE select thumbnail!) and then post reply.

And there it is on the forum in all its glory!

 

[sailme88]

Thanks Peggie for the quick tutorial... here we go..

 

[Parsons]

Thanks for taking the time to do the photos, Sailme. Looks like a great installation, and creative solution to the fitting problem. I love when people come up with elegant solutions. What brand and model head is that anyhow?

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

I'm glad you posted pictures 'cuz I see several problems. The first three should be corrected immediately, the last one can wait. 1. The 360 loop in the toilet discharge hose is just asking for a clog. You need to replace the discharge fitting with one that will let you come straight into the toilet. Call Paul Campagna at Jabsco 978-282-5246 to request one 2. Intake line needs to be sanitation hose. Clear water hose isn't rated for below-waterline connection. Plus algae, dead and decaying micro-and not so micro-animal and vegetable sea life will turn it a yucky black and green very quickly. 3. Intake line needs a vented loop...it needs to be at least 6-8" above waterline AT ANY ANGLE OF HEEL, which puts it 2-3' above the bowl on most sailboats. Sea the installation instructions on page 1 and the drawing on page 2 of the owners manual Jabsco 37010 owners manual 4. Wood isn't the only thing that can rot. So if the head doubles as the shower stall, you need to seal every edge or put a waterproof cover on your stack of boards and also seal the base of the toilet and the bottom of the stack to keep moisture from rotting them and corroding the toilet pump.

Otherwise it looks good!

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

After taking another look, I don't think a new discharge fitting is the answer after all...the current straight fitting is already aimed straight at the wall. What's actually needed is a new hole in that bulkhead high enough to provide a straight run for the discharge line. That's gonna require a little cosmetic surgery to close up the existing hole.

 

[Kermit]

Good job! Got any pictures?

OMG. First time I've EVER seen a reply like this from Peggie. Dang, man. You got it going on!!!

 

[Kermit]

I'm glad you posted pictures 'cuz I see several problems...

I guess I spoke too soon. But you still got the first one I've ever seen, @sailme88 .

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

I guess I spoke too soon.

And apparently I did too! His description did sound great, but this proves that a picture really is worth 1000 words! I didn't post that list of problems just to beat him up...everything on it is guaranteed to cause him problems sooner or later if not corrected. I debated whether to send 'em to him in a PM, but decided to post instead because I've always believed that my forum posts should help (or at least entertain), not only the person to whom they're directed and the other participants in a thread, but everyone who reads 'em including all the lurkers...a part of my "prevention is always cheaper and easier than cure" philosophy."

 

[sailme88]

Peggie, et al... Realized as the install progressed that the bulk head hole to allow hose passage was not conducive to straight shot. Since I had replaced the old hose (1 1/2) with a new 1" and had extra, the loop appeared to be the best short term arrangement. The plan moving forward is to redirect the hose and fill the old hole with that PVC board. The intake vented loop is out of sight under the sink. While the reinforced hose is not " code" I can tell you that it is as strong if not stronger than sanitary. That hose is several years old now. Water and RV winterizing antifreeze can still be seen in it.

So, after hauling out for the loooong New England winter the following will happen:
1) size a hole saw to the old bulk head hole and saw out plug from the PVC plank and 5200 it in place.
2) cut a new hole that will allow a direct line of travel for the discharge hose. The plan here is to oversize the hole so that a " sleeve " hose can be fit and waterproofed. Then run the discharge hose thru it. I'll try to angle the "sleeve" up hill just a bit to discourage wicking and migration.

As an adjunct to this entire system, I had already made changes to the holding tank plumbing. This past spring the tank macerating pump was replaced. In doing so, the ill engineered plumbing was reconfigured to guard against future failures by:
1) a sewage rated gate valve of PVC was short nippled to the tank outflow. I tried a quarter turn ball valve but they operated so stiffly that I was afraid of torquing the nipple out of the tank.
2) a PVC union sits between the pump and valve.
3) should the pump fail ( again) it is now isolated from the tank and can be easily swapped out with little leakage.
4) vent line from the tank was increased in diameter and removed from "out of sight stanchion vent" to a thru hull .

phew !

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

The intake vented loop is out of sight under the sink.

That's not high enough to keep it the required 6-8" above waterline at maximum heel. As I said above...on
most sailboats it would have to be 2-3 feet above the bowl (see photo...since you're flushing only into the tank, you don't need the disharge loop). However, because yours is an electric toilet, you'd need the
solenoid valve installed in the nipple on the top of it that's described in your installation instructions
.


As for your intake line...it doesn't matter how strong it is, fresh water hose isn't rated for below waterline connection...no competent surveyor would accept it. The old saying, "there's a right way, a wrong way and what some guy has gotten away with" applies here.

 

[sailme88]

Peggie,
So, the Catalina installed location of the vent, with access thru the head sink door is too low? I'm not sure where else it could be located with the exception of the transom. But the distance would exceed the specs of the pump as far as distance.
The sink itself is easily 8-10 inches above the waterline and the top of the vent tucks up under the counter top.

Is the solenoid to prevent flooding?

 

[sailme88]

 

[Peggie Hall HeadMistress]

The sink itself is easily 8-10 inches above the waterline and the top of the vent tucks up under the counter top.

That location would be fine on a power boat 'cuz powerboats don't heel. But sailboats do, and vented loops need to be at least 6-8" above the waterline at ANY angle of heel. Where you have the loop wouldn't put it above the waterline at all when you're heeled enough to put your rails anywhere near in the water. It really does need to be 2-3' above the bowl to put it where it needs to be on your boat and that's where you'll see it (unless it's hidden on the other side of a bulkhead behind the toilet) on every sailboat on which it's correctly installed.

Is the solenoid to prevent flooding?

No, that what the vented loop does. There should be an air valve threaded into the nipple on the top of the
loop (see photo...not all air valves are red, btw).

It closes to when the toilet is pumped to allow the toilet to prime, opens to allow air into the line to break the siphon started by flushing the toilet.
On a manual toilet, the vented loop belongs between the pump and the bowl...the short piece of hose the mfr uses to connect 'em is replaced by enough hose to put it where it belongs. But on most electric toilets it has to go between the flush water inlet thru-hull and the pump...a regular air valve won't work when it's in that location (which is why it has to be between the pump and the bowl on a manual toilet)....flushing would pull air into the loop that would interfere with the toilet's ability to prime. So it's necessary to use a solenoid valve that's wired to the flush button...pushing the flush button also closes the loop allow the toilet to prime, releasing it opens it to allow air into the line to break the siphon.