HELP! -- Bent Rudder Post/Tube on my '78 Hunter 27

[doc_cj]

Just over a week ago I ended up on a submerged rock pile (insert sad story, boo-hoo, etc.). Fortunately, I had BoatU.S. (Geico) insurance and tow service. Unfortunately, between the rocks and the pull off by the tow boat the rudder tube/post got bent. So I've been researching the DIY options for the fix. I'm hoping some of you that have done similar jobs can help shed some light on a few issues.

Item 1) Complete custom or commercial package price and need

I've spoken with a couple rudder fix or make operations that can put together a whole new system ranging in price from around $2200 and up to $4300. That would include the bearings and all hardware. The question is if the bearings in place now are in good condition, is there an actual need to replace them if I just put in a post or straighten the existing one?

Item 2) OEM or non-OEM choice and problems

My research here and other sailing sites have found lots of discussion on the type and size of tubes that can be used to replace the OEM part. It has been some good information on the category of steelto use as well as some of the fabrication to fit the specific boat. For those that have used non-OEM (direct from the manufacturer or from a licensed fabrication shop) and especially those that have simply had their own fabricated, were there specific problems that you would watch for if you had to do it again?

Item 3) Converting to a helm/wheel operation

If I decide to keep the boat and do the work on the rudder then I am also thinking of converting it from a tiller to a helm/wheel setup. Has anyone fabricated such a setup, and if so what types of issues are worth considering in the question of yes/no on a wheel?

Thanks to everyone that offers positive and helpful information. I look forward to reading your wise words. ;-)

 

[SailormanDan]

for wheel steering, that and an inboard engine were requirements when I moved up from a C22.
Sorry I can't help with the bent rudder other than to offer my condolences, good luck with it.

 

[doc_cj]

Thanks Dan. Just before 5 this afternoon I got a call from BoatU.S. on the claim. Looks like they are going to total the boat and also give me a chance to buy it for salvage. Now to figure out if I want to try to repair the rudder or maybe just salvage the good stuff off the boat. The sails are in decent shape as are the winches, mast, and electronics. The old Yanmar motor works and is coupled to a strong tranny.

Maybe if anyone has experience selling off their boat like this then let me know. I'll need to make some decisions pretty soon. If I buy it back then i'll have a little less for a purchase of another boat. Decisions ... decisions ... decisions.

 

[David in Sandusky]

I assume Geico is covering your rudder damage!? No experience myself. I'd go with whoever seems most competent. Bearings are minimal, doubt replacement of bearings is needed.

IMHO, a tiller is always preferred if you can maintain a rudder position in high winds using the tiller since:

1. The tiller gives you much better and faster feedback on rudder position and force.
2. Once anchored or in port, flipping the tiller up totally clears the cockpit.
3. You can move the rudder much faster with a tiller.
4. In the long term, the tiller connection to the rudder is more reliable, and much easier to repair than the wheel and cables.

The best reason to go to a wheel is that it gives you more mechanical advantage in moving the rudder. A real advantage if you do not have the strength to use the rudder in tough conditions.

 

[SailormanDan]

Unless there was something about a Cherubini Hunter 27, or this boat in particular that really spoke to you, I'd be inclined to shop around and find a boat I could go sailing in "now", boats in this size range seem plentiful and sometimes you can find a deal out there. I surf craigslist and sometimes see a deal and wished I was in the market. Some wisdom from the forums: "spend your time sailing the boat, not working on it." (I'm not always good at it, but I'm trying to hold the sentiment in mind.)
David has some good points about a tiller, mine was personal preference, plus a hope my wife would take to it better.
I don't have any experience with salvage, other than seeing the same ads years later on craigslist because no one needs what they are selling.
Good luck.

 

[Warren Milberg]

In 2003 I had a nice Catalina 27 (that I had owned for 6 weeks) that had its rudder smashed and the rudder post bent - along with a lot of "dock rash" type damage -- caused by Hurricane Isabel. BoatUS totaled the boat and gave me a check for its insured value a few weeks later. I could have bought the boat back at salvage and tried to repair it. I chose to take the money and buy an undamaged used boat. I never regretted the decision and was back sailing that same season....

 

[Hunter Ad Bot]

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[jdhohmann]

Firstly, How much is the rudder post bent ?
I have had the same problem before on my Hunter 40 post. My dad had a very easy solution, which I though would never work, but all he did was heat up the post where it was bent, and on ours it was just before entry to the bottom of the hull, and with some well placed heat in intervals, the damn thing straightened out perfectly. I would never have imagined it...
Again, I was schooled by my father which I am learning to accept.
If you don't know how to do this or don't have a real set of OXY-ACETelyn torches, contact a metal fab shop and ask them if they can help....

 

[Alan Johnson]

Been there with a bent rudder

Years ago I had a H37C that I bent the rudder during some really hard sailing. I luckily was pointed to Foss Foam in Florida where the original rudder was made. They quickly fabricated a new one with a heavier wall thickness for the tubing and shipped it to me. Pretty simple to remove old and replace with new after marking up here to drill and tap a couple of holes. If they did not build the original, maybe they can duplicate your old.

Alan Johnson formerly H 37C Valhalla, current, C400 Skol

 

[ggrizzard]

for Foss Foam.
Total the boat for a rudder?
Another sailboat customer friendly response from Geico "Can't Be Bothered" Insurance!

 

[doc_cj]

Thanks for all the responses. Here's a quick update on my progress; part of which has been based on the information here. Let me address the actual claim first. I may be an exception, but my experience with BoatU.S. (Geico) has been very good. I won't bore you with details but simply say that I will come out of this mess in better shape than when I went in. With that said, let me turn to the actual repairs and work being done on the boat.

For those interested, there is a short video of the damage to the rudder/shaft here:

One of the better parts of this event has been the ability to actually keep the boat. It is my first boat of this size and the first I've taken onto the open ocean. I was actually a little fearful that I would not be able to buy a boat of this type or quality without spending 50% more money (at least). So when I got the chance to buy the boat back, and for a price that is more than reasonable, I jumped at the chance. So, I've begun the repair and that's what I'll discuss next.

I have located a replacement rudder with the shaft. The marina's shop has given me a great (in my opinion) price to pull the old one out and put the new one in. The price is under $140.00, which is about 1/3 of what I expected. The insurance money will be enough to also get some minor work on the keel done and probably a new bottom paint job. Once I get the rudder/bottom work done I can splash the boat and finish anything I want to do this year from the top and interior.

When this is all done I think I'll be better off that I was before. I'll have the repairs made, prep bottom and top for paint, get the bottom painted, add some new electronics, and have the boat back in the water within the next 2 weeks.

 

[SailormanDan]

My dad was an accountant with an Ivy League MBA and he would think exactly like this, it's cheaper to total the boat than fix anything. I think he'd applaud you for then buying the boat back and fixing it. Does sound like a good deal on the labor from the yard. Time to go sailing!