H260 Rudder . . . . Dyneema?

[GBGraham]

On reading topics and reviews I have noticed that one of the complaints for the quasi rudder system is the up/down haul that is often fraying of which mine has also suffered the same problem.
I have ordered a CL 257 Auto release Camcleat so when I fit this does anyone have any thoughts of using Dyneema for the up/down haul (and may be also to the keel up/down haul for that matter) to stop the fraying?

 

[thinwater]

Dyneema will probably be too slippery.

 

[MaxinCalgary]

Rope for the rudder and I used Dyneema for the centreboard , to the first block.

 

[GBGraham]

Thanks for your advice guy's

 

[GBGraham]

Hi guys. back again. Unfortunately I'm in the UK and my 260 is in Greece and I want to replace the rudder polyester lowering line. This I wish to get made up here in the UK, Does anyone know the length of this line please. I can see the layout but I can't see the length mentioned anywhere . . . . must be the only one that isn't shown

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

Order 18 feet

 

[GBGraham]

Order 18 feet

Thank you so much Dave. Do you know if the pulley block has removable pins so if I get both ends made up with eyelets I can cut and use as necessary?

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

Search rgranger post as to what occurred removing center board

 

[GBGraham]

It's the rudder I'm dealing with Dave, not the centre board?

 

[BobbyFunn]

Whatever line you use make sure it is very stiff. Sounds like you are using a clamcleat. They have the v channel with ridges.

They are flawed in design. You go througj the expense of buying top of the line rope only to find that the clamcleat gives up all the tension while tensioning.

The clamcleat is angled towards the load. As the line is gripped it slides down and towards the load. Single braid is the worse since as the line is compressed more line is given back to the load.

I cant think of any use for a clamcleat other than applications that should include stretch. I dont understand how Clamcleats gor so popular.

If you pick dynema single braid the rope will compress and the rudder will bounce around. Youll tighten it, but then it will mysteriously loosen up again.

Old double braid is solid and will probably work better for you.

 

[BobbyFunn]

I have ordered a CL 257 Auto release Camcleat

Consider a disposable line that will snap when the rudder is obstructed.

There is cognitive dissonance with using high strength line to hold a kick up rudder.

Use cheap line that will snap at the first sign of trouble. Use dyneema for the part at the rudder then place an eye in it, then have another line for cleating that has an eye in it. Between the two lines is a thin line that will reliably snap. Put a couple of these on board.

Dotan makes a cool rudder head system that i look forward to seeing more of.

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

The use of a good yacht braid that is flexible is suggested. I was involved with the design of the boat and as a dealer sold appx 20-25% of the production line. Contact this site at
Help@sailboatowners.com addressing it to Al or Joe

 

[GBGraham]

Thanks Bobby F for the extentsie reply. I went for auto cleat realeae on the advice of other forumites and it all seemed feasible to me. The initial reason I mentioned Dynema was to down size so I could get a better fit in the cleat. I will talk to my supplier and see what stiff line he can do and talk about down sizing to 6.0/6.5mm double braid.
I don't have any real misgivings about hitting the rudder, it was aabelt and braces type thing. I go out for the day sailing at sea and I don't go rock seeking.
Thanks for the heads up Dave but unless I'm really stuck the nice customs officials prevent me from buying anything States side.

 

[BobbyFunn]

Demonstration of Clamcleat tension slip.

This is marlow excel line 4mm single braid with core. It is a little stretchy, but it is dense. The line is on CL218 mk2 clamcleat ive done the experiment on 6mm doublebraid line as well with the same results.

In this test the 4mm line is marked with black ink when set. After what would be a normal pull the line is cleated. I then placed tension on the line and remeasured. The black line moved towards the load about 1/8inch.(see flecks move as well) In my rudder that translate to about 15-20 degrees of uphaul.

With stretchy line you can pre-stretch as it is cleated so that as the cleat tightens, the slippage is taken back up by the stretch...but now the rudder can stretch the line.

The Hunter260 manual has a horn cleat for the uphaul/downhaul. I would use that or use a cam cleat if you dont care about hitting bottom.

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

If you ran aground that would mean sailing as a general rule in an area you should not be. The centerboard would hit first slowing you down considerably and then some generally stopping the boat by the rudder. If you have a non stretch stiff line, the boat would stop but more damage has and will happen to the rudder head vs a line that does have low stretch. This was the thought by Hunter after talking with me. There were a couple of give way cleats one of which was ok but boy when really the line was jammed in was hard to get out. Keep tools on board

 

[GBGraham]

OK thank you once again for your advice. I've taken this on board and will order accordingly.
I am rigging to fly a shute, could you or anyone else please explain why the handbook gives 3/8- 9.5mm XLS for the uphaul when the main and jib is 5/16-8mm LS. Is this extra diameter and spec necessary and if so will it fit the pulley sheave ok in the mast? Cheers in anticipation.