EPRIB TESTING

Screen Saver · Apr 17, 2018

Hi John
I have mostly Raymarine equipment on board. They provide a very simple MOB system which I suspect could connect to any seatalk or nema based plotter. http://www.raymarine.com/view/?id=157

Given both products in my case are Raymarine it just plugged in and worked. I have modified the MOB external alarm relay to disengage the auto pilot. This part is not standard it’s my own mod but again I suspect it could be done with any auto pilot. Its simply a relay on the MOB alarm which is wired back to the auto pilot, and does the exactly the same thing as if I pushed the button on the auto pilot to disengage it.

I am on a number of marine manufacture beta programs, and I have tried several times to get a more advanced version of this as a feature in there plotters. There is absolutely no reason the plotter could not round the boat up and attempt to hold it into the wind. My plotter ( as do most others) have all the inputs. Sadly liability is there pathetic argument, ie if the vessel rounds up with another vessel beside it and thus causes an accident.

Screen Saver · Apr 17, 2018

Hi John

I have mostly Raymarine equipment on board. They provide a very simple MOB system which I suspect could connect to any seatalk or nema based plotter. http://www.raymarine.com/view/?id=157

Given both products in my case are Raymarine it just plugged in and worked. I have modified the MOB external alarm relay to disengage the auto pilot. This part is not standard it’s my own mod but again I suspect it could be done with any auto pilot. Its simply a relay on the MOB alarm which is wired back to the auto pilot, and does the exactly the same thing as if I pushed the button on the auto pilot to disengage it.

I am on a number of marine manufacture beta programs, and I have tried several times to get a more advanced version of this as a feature in there plotters. There is absolutely no reason the plotter could not round the boat up and attempt to hold it into the wind. My plotter has all the inputs. Sadly liability is there pathetic argument, ie of the vessel rounds up with another vessel beside it and thus causes an accident.

Judy

MOB/AIS systems.

There are many different systems on the market. MOB ( Man overboard) can and does use different technologies to achieve the same end result. The very basic one I use is really nothing more than a very simple transmitter that you wear not much bigger than a big wrist watch and it sends out a pules to a receiver typically at your nav station. When that receiver no longer see's the pule, ie you fall overboard it triggers and alarm and sets and MOB condition. There are more sophisticated versions based around AIS technology which is what I believe the Volvo race guys had.

Screen Saver · Apr 17, 2018

Les, I am not aware of any Raymarine potter having an MOB relay, mine is on the external MOB.

I have tried in fact to get the seatalk command sent from Open CPN which I also run beside Raytech.

OpenCPN has the capability to inject any seatalk commands, and it should be possible disengage it via seatalk rather than from a relay and wires as I have done. However my efforts to do that were unsuccessful.

Its 3:30am Im going to bed guys.

JimInPB · Apr 17, 2018

jssailem said:
Alan. You indicate you use a personal MOB unit. Can you share the manufacturer?

Is this an option of the unit or did you have to fabricate the connection? If the latter how did you do it?
Does it work with a specific plotter?

I'm not Alan, but I also use a MOB system on my boats. Mine are the MOB+ system. They came from Fell Marine in Norway. Mine are older & were bought directly from Fell. They have a form C contact set (SPDT) on the output that can be connected to anything you want to connect them to. On my motor boat, it is set up to kill the engine. I rigged up another one for use when doing night watch on sailboat deliveries. It sounds a LOUD horn that will wake up anyone else on board if I go over the rail.

The Fell unit is now marketed in the US though distribution channels that allow purchase in brick & mortar stores. The new unit has some helpful writing on the base unit that mine does not have. The current version also has a new feature that monitors the presence of more than one person on the boat. If the primary person goes overboard, it trips the kill switch, like the old unit did. If someone else goes over, it just beeps.

JimInPB · Apr 17, 2018

I like the idea of the new AIS personal beacons, although I have not tried one yet. A lot of people watch AIS. If one of those things goes off, you have a very good chance of having some eyes on the person in the water quickly.

What I have been doing for the past few years, is using a handheld VHF with DSC for that purpose. I like the option of of my MOB person showing up on the mother ship's instruments without needing to trigger an international distress call that brings out the Coast Guard. 95% of the time, I am likely to be able to recover an overboard passenger without assistance. I prefer not to make a federal case out of it & involve the authorities, if I don't need to.

I would be interested to learn what went wrong in the case of the Volvo guy that was lost at sea with (supposedly) full gear on & working.

DrJudyB · Apr 17, 2018

Here's a VHF radios with built in GPS, DSC, and AIS receiver which uses the same VHF antenna, and can link to a chartplotter via NMEA 0183. No need for a separate AIS receiver or antenna and splitter.

Add a couple of AIS/DSC enabled personal beacons, and it would make a nice system, I think. Comments anybody?

Matrix AIS/GPS GX2200 - Standard Horizon
https://shop.sailboatowners.com/prod.php?7285

Ocean Signal MOB1 with AIS & DSC
https://shop.sailboatowners.com/prod.php?5080

JimInPB · Apr 17, 2018

DrJudyB said:
...Comments anybody?

Matrix AIS/GPS GX2200 - Standard Horizon
https://shop.sailboatowners.com/prod.php?7285

Ocean Signal MOB1 with AIS & DSC
https://shop.sailboatowners.com/prod.php?5080

Looks promising.

One of my boats could use a new VHF. I may go for that one.

Gunni · Apr 17, 2018

A personal AIS transmitter assumes that there is a boat and radio nearby ready to respond. If the weather is severe, boats/crews are disabled, or you are not carrying a handheld radio to communicate you are not likely to get a rescue. It is a line-of-sight VHF radio technology, so you maybe have 5 mile range. If you have lost your boat and are in the water or in a raft you should have a satellite-based EPIRB with GPS and radio homing signal. That is how you get the pros tracking you, on site in any conditions.

DrJudyB · Apr 17, 2018

LeslieTroyer said:
This is basically my setup. Except I also have a splitter and a AIS transmitter (AIS650) and a ACR EPRIB Manual deploy mounted just inside the companionway. I try to have my SH hand held with GPS and DSC clipped on. The nice thing about the MOB1 is it fits inside my PFD and very unlikely to get striped away. Can’t say the same for the handheld

I like it.

Too bad I don't have room for the SH 2200 and two MOB1's in this month's budget... I'm going for two weeks of cruising in the Pacific NW in a couple of weeks, with a guest for crew. He's got some kind of tracker that requires an inexpensive monthly subscription and I've got the ACR 406 PLB.

We'll stand ready to hit the MOB button on the chart plotter if either of us goes overboard. And if there's more trouble, the backup is the DSC emergency button on the VHF.

It'll have to do for now.

Screen Saver · Apr 17, 2018

Morning; I do like the idea of killing the engine. I guess I had not pondered to much about me going over the side under motor. But in thinking further about it, in my case when it rounds up due to the auto pilot being disengaged it will still motor on away from me if the engine is on. Great idea and simple I could just connect it to the stop solenoid.

Yes I also installed a loud piezo horn originally from a car alarm. You may have herd of Jessica Watson the young solo girl who sailed around the world. Her accident was because she slept through both AIS and Radar alarms. This will not happen to me.

Yes my Raymarine one also supports two units. The idea being if there are more than two of you, that you hand it over when you go off watch. Mine does not distinguish between primary or secondary. All are treated the same.

AIS personal Beacons definitely have a place and as you implied in some environments better than pEPIRB. As I suggested earlier though the key to which pieces of gear is best, is dependent on both your typical sailing location and hence likely response of any of the rescue services and who you have on board if anyone else. These change the dynamics and the best solution a lot. In Ozy costal sailing the personal AIS has a very good chance of bring help and like in your situation it will come quicker, there are many coastal station monitoring and many vessels paying attention to AIS. But equally the personal EPIRB would work just well argeuably better but take longer, and in the Ozy segment you would get rescued, they have the resources and they will go to some very big extreme’s. However once you step out of the Ozy limits in this half of the world your chances of getting help from other than your own boat with personal AIS beacon I would estimate at less than 10% and with a personal EPIRB it would definitely be better, but for reasons I identified earlier, far less than the likes of Ozy, the US or UK.

Yes I also have a hand held VHF with DSC predominately this was just a backup to my VHF and something I can grab should I need to leap into the life raft. However I find it very useful on land. My VHF on board is connected to a VOX unit. When I leave the boat in perhaps in an area where I am concerned about it being broken into, I leave both AIS on and VHF on a low use channel. If someone enters the boat the VOX will trigger and I can here it on the handheld, plus if I am concerned the boat might have moved, I can ping it for its long and lat. Though the later was a personal mod.

Yes I would also love to know what happened in the case of the Volvo guy. Clearly something else went wrong, because the last report I read it took nearly 45 minutes for them to get back to where he went over the side. The only legitimate answer for PEPIRB I can come up with here is it took that time for Volvo rescue co-ordination to obtain the lon/lat and pass it back to the boat. That is exactly what I don’t like about pEPIRB. I suspect there is more to this story though, surely he would not ( or should not)have been on deck on his own, why did they not come head to wind within in minutes. As for the Personal AIS, I have no idea why it did not identify him as MOB immediately. As for being unclipped and struck by boom while in the cockpit area…. Himmm all sound sus to me.

DrJudy. The combined VHF Radio AIS/DSC GPS looks good. All systems have there pro’s and con’s a couple of maybe con’s for you to ponder. If installing in a steel or alloy boat, the chance of installing the radio where the GPS will get a fix is probably slim. If sailing outside the US you probably want the silent/hidden feature on your AIS and at a quick glance surpassingly I did not see it

jssailem · Apr 17, 2018

DrJudyB said:
I'm going for two weeks of cruising in the Pacific NW

It is easy Judy... 'DO NOT FALL OVERBOARD'

rpwillia · Apr 17, 2018

DrJudyB said:
Here's a VHF radios with built in GPS, DSC, and AIS receiver which uses the same VHF antenna, and can link to a chartplotter via NMEA 0183. No need for a separate AIS receiver or antenna and splitter. ...Matrix AIS/GPS GX2200 - Standard Horizon https://shop.sailboatowners.com/prod.php?7285

FWIW, I helped a friend install one of these and integrate it to a Garmin chartplotter. Really nice set up.

JimInPB · Apr 17, 2018

To sum it all up, in my personal opinion (& this is just my opinion)
Within VHF range of land, I prefer DSC at this time, but if the personal AIS trackers turn out to be as good as advertised, I will probably lean towards them in the near future.

If I am planning to go past VHF range, but not more than 100 miles from land, I might squeak by with a PLB/personal epirb in addition to DSC &/or AIS. A sat phone would give me extra warm & fuzzy feelings, if it was available. If I am planning to go past 100 miles from land, I want a good solid epirb & a sat phone & some other equipment to back them both up. I want a couple of items to be hand held & have internal rechargeable batteries. For years, my off-shore ditch bag had a handheld aircraft radio in it. Unfortunately, that old Icom is getting decrepit now. I need to get a new one some day.

Screen Saver · Apr 17, 2018

Sounds like a good plan to me. The Sat phone verse HF DSC would make another good debateable thread. I infact have both, but have let the Sat phone laps and will not be replaceing it.
We should all be sailing instead of here of course.

JimInPB · Apr 17, 2018

Screen Saver said:
...
We should all be sailing instead of here of course.

NotCook · Apr 27, 2018

SG said:
To paraphrase that old joke with Jerry Lewis and Dean Martin told about emergency parachutes,...

No one ever complained that their EPIRB didn't work.

Back when I was skydiving there was a brand of clothing named “Bounceproof@. Their warranty said that if you “bounced” while wearing them they would refund the purchase price. Never heard of anyone ever getting a refund...