Capri 22 Fin Vs. Wing

[Joe M]

I am looking for a daysailer/ club racer and am considering the Capri 22.One is for sale in my area, however it is a wink keel.I see that the fin keel has a rating of 201 in my area but the wing is not listed.Has anyone raced the wing? how good or bad is it? Should I consider the wing at all if the primary use is to race her?Thanks in advanceJoe Mjm13169@aol.com

 

[Bayard Gross]

Probably a bad idea.

At this point, my personal experince with PHRF style ratings is that they do not provide a sufficient handicap for shoal and ,therefore, wing keels. Quite simply, they do not point as well as full keel boats, which creats a big problems on upwind legs by their having to make more tacks and or travel longer distance. Further, they really do not gain anything on downwind legs with ther shorter keels.To exemplify this point for a boat made by Catalina, in the lastest issue of Main Brace, the quarterly for the Catalina 22 National Sailing Association, there is a proposal about changing the regulations for sail size for different weighing boats for national championships. In this proposal, there is also mention of the different keels on the C-22. Using the swing keel as a base, wing keels would be given a 5% advatage, or say a three minute advantage after an hour, and fin keels would be given a 5% disadvantage, or say a three munute disadvantage after an hour.To put this another way, the wing keel on a C-22 is considered 10% slower than a fin keel C-22. Same hull which with a different keel, but six minutes slower after an hour. I am willing to bet the same characteristics would be true on a Capri 22.In essence, I do not think PHRF ratings have yet to properly recognize this difference between shoal or wing keels and full keels. Note that the difference between a swing keel, which is five feet when lowered, and a fin keel is at only 5% at tops and sufficiently insignificant where the fin and swing keels may race as a class together.Further, I beleive that hauling up on a wing keel during a downwind leg, does not produce enough additional speed to be worth the effort. Again, maybe so at some times, but I don't think in all wind conditions.So if you are intending to race and wish to win, I think the wing keel Capri is a poor choice.I currently crew in races on a thirty-foot Seidelman (?) 30T which has a shoal keel. Dispite excellent starts, good sail trim, good tacks, good executions, we have yet to win, and frequently are the last boat to finish. It is very tough for us to go the additional distance required by the shoal keel, not to mention the additional tacks we must make as well.

 

[Gallegodude]

what's the diff?

I have a retractible keel, what is the difference between a retractible, wing, and fin keel?

 

[Bayard Gross]

C-22 keels

There are three different style keels for the C-22.The first and of which nearly all C-22’s have is the swing keel, the retractable keel that the inquirer from Annapolis refers to.Swing keels are normally associated with big band era cohorts. There is a swing keel C-22 owner known to from time to time to prance wildly around deck singing “Oh it an’t got a thing, if it don’t have that swing, Do what, Do what, Do what, Do what, Do what, Do what.” Any resemblance between that C-22 swing keel owner and myself is purely coincidental. The second style of C-22 keel is the fin keel. It is believed northern European sailors inspired this keel, although what they were doing in southern California at the time remains a mystery. The third style of C-22 keel is the wing keel, which is actually a shoal keel with wings, or a shortened fin keel with wings. This keel may have originated from southern United States C-22 owners with their warm salutation “Hey there you shoal.” Or perhaps from the more common “You shoal have a nice boat.”

 

[Ben]

fin keel

I have a Capri 22 with a fin keel, and I wouldn't give it up for any other type. It gives the boat a good feel heading upwind, and I really appreciate the simplicity - nothing to crank, and no worries about broken parts, leaks, etc. Also, unlike a wing keel, if I ground the boat, heeling it over will immediately lift up the keel out of the mud. Of course the swing keel has the advantage over all three in this situation, but it's been over a year since since I've touched bottom. *fingers crossed* Then again, I typically sail in one of the deepest parts of the Chesapeake. Somewhere else, I might wish I had a swing or wing.The only place the fin keel would be really bad would be attempting to get it on a trailer. If I tried to trailer it I would probably be cursing the whole idea of a fin keel and anyone who ever had anything to do with it. But I don't have a trailer, nor do I have any vehicle that could haul it anyway.I can't speak to the racing aspect; I'm new to PHRF racing and haven't had my own boat racing yet, just crewed for other people.