Beneteau First 310 Tuning Help

Randy Rohrbeck · May 13, 2009

I'm assuming you've got the mast in column and have tensioned the shrouds using the Loos gauge.

You didn't mention what the wind conditions were the day in question, but if it was a constant 15+ and you didn't have the main reefed I guess that's your problem. If you're getting much weather helm at all the rudder will really act like a brake.

That said we have the shoal draft as well and it doesn't point that great, although it should do better than a Catalina 30. Max backstay will help as welll.

r1texas · Apr 20, 2010

Hello!!

I've been owned a First 310 (shoal draft) for 1 year and I have the same issue when pointing.
Under 15 it's OK, and the speed is pretty good (6).
But above 15, I need the first reef and she's even hard to sail. She always wants to luff!!
Any tips?

I have old sails and I plan to change them soon. Do you think I should buy a larger genoa? I have a 130 now and I'm wondering if it will be better with a 150?

Erwan.

Randy Rohrbeck · Apr 21, 2010

drvrdad said:
Erwin
We are still experimenting, but got a new main and tuned it "flat", throwing a reef @ around 12 - 15. At times we are able to point very well, and others not worth squat. Sail it as flat as possible. I went to Lake Stockton last summer and crewed on another 310, shoal draft and the thing pointed great. Took note of all of the sail trim, settings, etc... and still working on ours.

If you come up with some good ideas, please share as we are still getting "killed" by Catalina 27's and 30's.

Tony

Well Tony was on our First 310 and I don't remember it pointing that well so it must have been the adult beverages I was serving him.

We did enjoy having you Tony.

We get out pointed by a lot of boats also, some things that seem to help as the wind comes up include sails in reasonably good shape, reef the main early, move the cars all the way back, and more wind more backstay.

We have a 150 head sail, but had a 130 before. I doubt if the 130 is causing a pointing issue, I got the 150 mainly because we get a lot of light air days in late spring and summer. Didn't go with the 155 because I was worried getting the jib flat given where the track ends.

Randy

r1texas · Apr 22, 2010

Thank you both for your advices. I'll see this summer with the new sails if I can improve her behavior...

r1texas · May 3, 2010

see try

I sailed saturday. Wind 17 to 20 knots. One reef in the main and all the genoa. I tried to point the wind as much as I could. It's difficult to do better than 45 deg or the speed decrease and I'm not sure it's better. I was able to maintain 5.5 to 6 knots and when I beared away I sailed to 7.5 knots.

When I pointed the wind, I put the automatic pilot and kept the main sheet in my hand. So I was able to ease out to prevent the luff.
When a increase of wind comes, the boat heel too much and the rudder is not efficient anymore.
But I tried to follow your advices and it's better when the genoa is very flat.

Erwan.

Mike B · May 3, 2010

Not sure what the specific issue is but I had a 310 with 4'3" draft and it was one of the nicest sailing boats out there at the time. It should smoke any of the boats you're referencing. A friend had a Catalina 27 and it was no contest, we'd leave him in the dust. Between the adjustable genoa cars and backstay you should be able to tweek the sails every which way. I will say that with the genoa reefed you do lose up wind performance. That's pretty much the normal for any roller furling headsail though, especially one without the foam luff. For that reason I prefer to reef the main before the headsail. Good luck finding the answer.

Mike B · May 3, 2010

After digging into the memory bank (it's been 10 yrs since I've sailed the 310) I thought of how I used to set her up. Make sure the traveler is far enough to windward to bring the boom to center line. Adjust the mainsheet so the top batten is parallel or just to leeward of the boom. Telltale flow will let you know you've hit the spot. Try to get the main's draft apx 33% back from the luff. Adjust the main's halyard so you have a smooth luff. Adjust backstay tension to further flatten the main. Tweek the outhaul if necessary for more main flattening. Adjust the genoa car position so the sheets angle at apx 45 degrees. Keep a smooth but not overly tight leech. Too tight and the genny will cup and interfere with the air flow at the leech. Hope this helps.

Gunni · May 4, 2010

What Mike said. Is your vang loosened? Lots of folks forget to ease the vang when going to wind.

r1texas · Sep 15, 2010

I changed my sails begining of august and sailed her 3 times then. It's much better now!! I can even keep the main full longer. Now I put the first reef when the wind blow more than 17 knots.
And the behavior of the boat is much better in winward. I don't know if I can go more into the wind, I didn't try that far yet, but at least she is much easier to steer. The main sail shape is flater and the genoa is a bit bigger (I put a 140%).
I tried her with a 15-17 knots coming perpendicular to the boat and I think her speed has been increased of around 0.5 knots. I was able to sail her to 6.5 to 7 knots, with 8 knots in the blast. In the same condition, before it was more around 6/6.5.
I will continue to test it, but it's impressive how the sails can affect her behavior.

Jackdaw · Nov 8, 2010

In case anyone is still reading this, here are the polars for the First 310.

http://www.finot.com/bateaux/batproduction/beneteau/first310_a/First310Vpp.pdf

r1texas · Dec 1, 2010

7 days of windward!!

Hi,

I just come back from Florida after crossing the Gulf of Mexico from Houston. We had the time to tune our sails because we sailed almost all the way with the wind in the nose.
So I confirm that the First 310 (shoal keel) is not very good to sail very close to the wind, and especially in a 6 feet waves see. Even with new sails, and playing with the traveler, backstay or outhaul...
But as soon as we were able to bear away, the speed was increasing a lot.
But the good thing is that the behavior of the boat was very good even if the speed was not here. We were able to attach the helm with shock cords and let her go without any problem!

erwan

mark_swart · Dec 10, 2010

I have a 285 wing keel and our boats have a lot of similarities. I have noticed that mine is very sensitive to how much weight is in the stern. If your stern is going under when you are at speed, try to redistribute weight.
Your boat has new sails so, but I've also found with mine and my old sails that I have to bring the traveler pretty far over to windward and then run relatively light sheet tension to get a decent shape and speed.
I also think mine started pointing a little better when I increased my mast rake a little bit.
Hope this helps... I love the look of the 310s, my boat's 'big sister'!!

Jackdaw · Dec 11, 2010

r1texas said:
Hi,

So I confirm that the First 310 (shoal keel) is not very good to sail very close to the wind, and especially in a 6 feet waves see. Even with new sails, and playing with the traveler, backstay or outhaul...

erwan

Indeed. I don't care who draws the boat; finot, farr, whoever, there is NO substitute for deep, high aspect ratio draft when it comes to being able to point well. The marketing material tries to make it sound OK by saying that the CLR is the same on the shoal keels, but thats not the same thing at all.

tictacteau · Jan 12, 2011

310's not pointing

The Beneteau 310 will not point as well as other boats because of deck geometry. The jib sheet lead angle is too wide. This is the angle measured from the centerline of the boat at the jib tack aft to where the jib sheet block is located.The back of the jib track on the 310 is about 11 degrees and at the front about 17. I have measured many boats that have lead angles that are in the 5 to 10 degree range and these boats will point. I am sure that the catalina 25's and 30's have tighter sheet lead angles than the Beneteau. If you try to sail as high as they do you will stall the headsail.

There are a number of things that you can do to overcome the inherant bad geometry.

Make sure that you have as much mast rake as you can tolerate, this will move the center of effort aft and will want to rotate the boat to windward. Presently I have about 19 inches, but have tried the whole range between 8 and 26 inches.

Have a loose headstay, which effectively moves the headsail luff to leeward which is the same thing as bringing the clew inboard to achieve a tighter angle.

Too much halyard tension will move the draft of the sail forward and steepen the entry angle, keep the draft in the center of the sail. draft stripes required.

A non-overlapping headsail could be sheeted inside the shrouds and barber-hauled to a tight sheet lead angle. You would gain pointing but loose power in light winds.

A over-sized genoa with a LP of 180 would come around the shrouds with an appropriate lead angle. The jib block would be about 3 feet aft of the existing jib track.

More modern versions of this style of boat have taken the chain plates to the rail and use a smaller headsail sheeted inboard to get efficient jib sheet lead angles and better pointing ability.

Glenn