Why do some sailboats, sail more than others?

TomY

Alden Forum Moderator
Jun 22, 2004
2,758
Alden 38' Challenger yawl Rockport Harbor
On a nice day; open water, blowing 10 to 15, sure - everybody is sailing.

But there's a boundary or something around rivers, wide channels, easily navigated inlets, entrances to anchorages and broad - easily sailed thoroughfares, that turns most sailboats into power boats. Sails drop at this boundary sure as the sun will set.

It doesn't bother me to see other boats not sailing in these 'no sailing' areas (that's pompous). It's not for everybody.

Almost as much as sailing in these 'no sail' areas, I enjoy watching other boats sail through, then asking myself, 'why do they do it?'

J35  (1 of 1).jpg


It doesn't seem to be the kind of sailboat. New, old, easy to sail, not so easy to sail, there doesn't appear to be a connection.
Under sail inside Pulpit Harbor.jpg

And performance: Fast, slow, doesn't make a difference. I remember this old Tancook Whaler (a 100 year old fishing boat design), was the only boat to sail into a tricky anchorage.
Tancook whaler 1 (1 of 1).jpg

And the captain (alone), did it with ease.
Tancook whaler 2 (1 of 1).jpg


If not the boat, then why?

One reason is clear; these sailors are at ease sailing their boats. When you leave the clear air of open water, the wind can become finicky and the sailing, challenging. These sailors - I think - like the challenge and in fact may look for those conditions.
HOUND thoroughfare.jpg

At times I think this experience and skill with their boats, can be taken as arrogance. I'm convinced it's not. I think of it as more of an invitation to join them.
Sabre 34.jpg

About a dozen boats came into Pulpit Harbor on this afternoon. Here's to the only one, a Sabre 34, that sailed in. I wonder why?
 
Jan 24, 2017
150
Chrysler C26 Lake Sakakaweea
Some like me are not going to carry fuel. I was going to build a house boat then just decided to stay with the sailboat design and forget the fuel. I plan on traveling 90 miles to the boat moored on Lake Sakakawea, then sail all weekends. I'm not going to have the room to carry enough fuel on the Goldwing to motor a house boat, so it was sail. If I have to I will have two 80# thrust elect. motors. I took the engine out of my Triton also, I figure if I have a sailboat then sail.

Happy sailing
 
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Jan 19, 2010
12,362
Hobie 16 & Rhodes 22 Skeeter Charleston
Nice pictures....

I think there is probably more than one answer to your question. You touched on one already and that is the comfort level of the skipper. But I also suspect there is a large proportion of sailors who's behavior is governed by habit patterns. For instance if they first started sailing in a marina that forbade entering the mooring field under sail, then they may have gotten in the habit of motoring out and in. People don't break habits unless they put some serious effort into breaking them.

I can also imagine that for some, it may be that they have gotten into an embarrassing jam at some point in the past and now don't want to risk it again.

For me, I like to sail out of my slip but I always have the O.B. at idle just in case things go sideways. That is my comfort zone. And one time it really came in handy. I was on Tangier Island for the 4th of July about five years ago and I had sucked some bad gas into my O.B. I could not get it started. The wind was on our nose at the slip so we let go the lines, let the wind push us out and we turned broadside, opened the genoa and sailed out of the marina. The down side was that no one was around to see us.... :biggrin:

When we got back to the marina from where we had launched... the wind was dead calm inside the marina and I had to scull the rudder to get us back to port. It was a hot and long afternoon. I also keep one paddle on board and my son was at the bow helping out.

So it is good to practice these things. But if I'm being honest, I'd rather have my O.B. at idle as I come into port and when I get close to the slip, I switch to the O.B. for power and drop my sails.
 

walt

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Jun 1, 2007
3,511
Macgregor 26S Hobie TI Ridgway Colorado
I have some simple rules for myself regarding something like that..
First, you can take all the risks you want with your personal property and safety.. but dont take risks with others property and safety. Second, if you are making others wait because you are tying up a pathway, not a good idea unless its an emergency.. Those who are having to wait are just not going to understand how cool it is that you can sail to your slip..
 
Sep 30, 2013
3,538
1988 Catalina 22 North Florida
Where we live and sail, I see at least five sailboats motoring for every one sailboat sailing. Probably even more than that. And it has nothing to do with the wind, or sea state, or tricky channels, or any of that. I see people motoring all the time who could be beam reaching on the most beautiful of days.

I am convinced, for my part, that most of the sailboat owners in my area bought their sailboats for the "cool factor"; so they could tell people (including themselves) that THEY own a SAILBOAT. Nothing wrong with that - it is their money after all - but their money would have been better spent on motor yachts, IMHO. Why pay for sailing apparatus you never intend to use?? Then again, perhaps at the time of purchase, they actually did sail, or dreamed that they would. In any case, I marvel at this phenomenon all the time.
 
Jul 12, 2011
1,165
Leopard 40 Jupiter, Florida
I'll speak for myself, rather than guess why others drop sails early ... I'm concerned for sail dowsing in a hurry, either solo or short-handed. I don't want to be on YouTube like Captain Credit Card ...
I am not particularly frightened about getting the boat (mostly) to go where I want if I have some breeze, but I do not think that I have the ability (speed, mental capacity etc.) to select an anchorage, come up to the wind, drop the main, furl the genoa, and run forward to drop anchor single-handed. I know that my wife and I could not pickup a mooring without having everything buttoned up, and motoring up to it.
 

TomY

Alden Forum Moderator
Jun 22, 2004
2,758
Alden 38' Challenger yawl Rockport Harbor
This small schooner (a 36' gem), was anchored close by this past season in Seal Bay - Vinalhaven Island, in Penobscot Bay.
Schooner anchored in Seal Bay .jpg

After pulling the anchor on deck, they raised sails in very light wind, sailed downwind to get some way on, then tacked up toward us (they had warmed up their engine, then shut it down once underway-a good precaution).
Schooner Seal Bay - under sail (1 of 1).jpg

The schooner was nimble and easily manned by a couple guys.
Schooner Seal Bay approaching 2 (1 of 1).jpg

They passed close enough that I could hear the hiss of the bow wake.
Schooner helmsmen (1 of 1).jpg

Then they sailed up through about a half a dozen of us at anchor.
Schooner Seal Bay passing (1 of 1).jpg

The most memorable thing was the channel they sailed out of, here on my ipad.
Sailing out of Seal Bay is a formidable task. .jpg

They had some tacking to do in the Northwest winds. I didn't see anyone else sail out, including myself. That's the right thing to do. They just felt comfortable sailing the old schooner in this area.

As far as I could tell, they made it.
Schooner Seal Bay exit (1 of 1).jpg

Note: I should add, the schooner came into the anchorage and dropped their anchor - all under sail - the night before.
 
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RussC

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Sep 11, 2015
1,578
Merit 22- Oregon lakes
I am convinced, for my part, that most of the sailboat owners in my area bought their sailboats for the "cool factor";
That would truly be sad if true. but at the lake where we sailed at the most last year we rarely see even one other sailboat out sailing, even though there are 10-12 sailboats slipped there year around, so perhaps that is correct. We have to motor in and out of the marina at that lake for various safety reasons, so I can't answer to that specifically.
 
Feb 11, 2017
9
Pearson Alberg 35 Freeport, Maine
That's our friend's 35' Southern Cross anchored in the background of the first shot.
 

Kermit

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Jul 31, 2010
5,657
AquaCat 12.5 17342 Wateree Lake, SC
Sailboats don't sail. Sailors sail their sailboats. It's called Seamanship and handling your boat the best way you know how. Sailing a boat when you're not comfortable sailing it is poor Seamanship. I know because I've been there.

And don't get me started on "your camera takes pretty pictures."
 

pateco

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Aug 12, 2014
2,207
Hunter 31 (1983) Pompano Beach FL
This is why I usually enter my inlet under power. In south Florida, they like to play bumper boats at the inlets and bridges.
Inlet Mayhem.jpg

Without other boaters acting insane, I would sail much more inland.
 
Jan 19, 2010
12,362
Hobie 16 & Rhodes 22 Skeeter Charleston
@pateco

Wow! that looks like sailor hell.

That photo reminds me of a big jam I got into a long time ago. Very much related to this thread I was sailing out of Kiptopeke in the southern part of the Chesapeake Bay. I was coming up to the pier under jib ... dropped the jib about 20 feet from landing and was gliding in when a fishing boat pushed out of the next slot and its wake knocked me 90 degrees off and I then had to come around in tight quarters. I fired up my O.B. and got the jib sheet wrapped around the prop. Then things went really sideways. An hour later I finally landed... with bloody shins from holding off of some rip wrap. Very long story. Because of that experience, I now always start my O.B. even when I'm sailing into a spot. And I am a fanatic about keeping my sheets wrapped up with sail tie bungees.
 
Feb 14, 2017
29
Mainecat 38 Anacortes
Having recently, (the past two weekends) 'enjoyed' southern Florida's weekend boating traffic, I totally get it. I think I will/would try pretty hard to do my boating during the week days instead. Totally crazy!!!
 
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Oct 29, 2016
1,915
Hunter 41 DS Port Huron
@pateco, that picture resembles many ports on a weekend on the Great Lakes especially when the fishermen are out hunting salmon, it is down right crazy, I really don't think they care about a 10 ton vessel bearing down on them. So yah that is why many including myself use the engine to navigate the business of port.
 
Last edited:
Jun 3, 2010
177
Hunter 27-3 Erie
Three reasons.
1st, the area you are in. Our area is exactly like the photo of the inlet in Florida. Cross wakes, many more power boats and jet skis than other sailboats. Where we sail is about as different from Tom's photos from Maine as you can get. Trying to navigate the bay and channel is done easier, safer and less stressful under power.
2nd, being a navigation hazard to others. The facts are that most power boaters don't really understand how a sailboat works and what to expect. There are many times when you can't just point the boat and go. I don't want to be the cause of a dangerous situation by tacking through the channel and being a surprise navigation hazard to other boaters.
Lastly, I don't trust people. For example, when heading down a fairway in our club, if I'm under sail I can't avoid other boaters leaving their slips without checking for traffic. I also don't trust other boaters in the bay or channel, I don't know if they will do "the right thing" or even know what the rules of the road are?
 
Jun 14, 2010
2,082
Robertson & Caine 2017 Leopard 40 CT
I think a lot of people have a "speed floor" (SF). It's my own expression so I get to define it: The SF is defined as "the slowest speed at which you sail before turning on the auxiliary engine". For any given sailor, boat, time, and place: The SF varies based on the following factors, partial list -- not in any particular order:
  1. Distance from next port
  2. Whether trying to make a destination, or just sailing out and back (daysailing)
  3. Time remaining until last daylight
  4. If inclement weather is approaching, and when
  5. Schedule imposed by reservations at a marina or restaurant, or rendezvous with others, or work obligations
  6. If the dog must be walked
  7. Normal sailing speed of boat (faster boats have a higher SF)
  8. Cruising speed of boat under power (faster boats have a higher SF)
  9. Whether it is extremely hot, cold, or raining.
  10. Wind direction and speed (probably should be #1)
 

Gunni

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Mar 16, 2010
5,937
Beneteau 411 Oceanis Annapolis
A number of years ago we arrived at the Bight (Norman Is, BVI) and picked up one of the last mooring balls. The balls are arranged in neat rows to make it easy to fit you and 500 of your new sailing buddies into the anchorage. While we tidied up and mixed sundowners, shouts and screams erupted from other boats. Into the anchorage came sailing an aged and faded 45' CSY with a rag tag crew slaloming down the alley's between mooring rows. The captain entertained his crew with loud screams and calls as he singlehanded the boat, tacking between the shiny charter boats all in a line. 20 feet off stern and bow. Scold yachters shouted angry warnings and tsk-tsks. Warnings of impending litigation lit up the VHF. To each one the scoundrel captain waved his cap and gave a loud "Whoa!". Finally he neared the beach and in a flourish loosed his sheets and stalled to the wind, laying up neatly to an ancient motor yacht with a squeal of bumpers. The crew shouted and cheered...while the radio filled with calls to the authorities. It was hilarious, and some of the best close quarter's sailing I have ever seen.
 
Jan 19, 2010
12,362
Hobie 16 & Rhodes 22 Skeeter Charleston
I think a lot of people have a "speed floor" (SF).
@Larry -- DH

I think you might be onto something. My son loves to go sailing but when we are moving along at 3 or 4 kts, he takes a nap and has no interest in working the boat and leaves crewing to his sisters. But as soon as the gunwale is in the water, he wants the tiller and sheet in his hands.
 

Gunni

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Mar 16, 2010
5,937
Beneteau 411 Oceanis Annapolis
Those are some great shots of sailboats and scenery Kris! Keep telling myself one day I am going to go out and hang a left and sail north to that lovely coast.
 
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TomY

Alden Forum Moderator
Jun 22, 2004
2,758
Alden 38' Challenger yawl Rockport Harbor
Great to read all these responses! I'm not surprised few really enjoy this type of sailing, but everybody is interested in the subject. Larry's speed floor is a good way to look at the way people sail. I've often heard sailors report a certain speed; 5 knots, 4 knots,...3 knots,....2 knots. 2 knots? I don't hear 2 knots, very often.

My speed floor can go lower (I won't drift, I need steerage to enjoy the feeling of sailing). To sail so slowly means you're under no schedule or you have converted your speed floor, to time under sail.

For instance, here's a sail we enjoyed, last season. I knew the number of miles we needed to cover (we sail through here a lot), and we decided we wanted to be under sail long enough, that our miles could be covered with ease.

Starting from Perry Creek, in winds less than 5 knots out of the Southwest, our speeds rarely got above 2.5 knots. More often we spent time between 1 and 2 knots. We were moving through the water a bit faster as there was a current flowing against us. It was challenging sailing as the speed going through our short-ish tacks, was pretty low. We were cracked off a bit for best speed. Our old boat doesn't tack quickly so you lose speed coming through the wind, slowly. You loose ground to the current.
Close tacking to windward, foul current.jpg


A 50 minute power turned into a two hour sail.

What do we get out of it? We got to see a beautiful morning on an interesting stretch of water, at a slow speed. Slow wind speed means the water is usually flat, which makes sailing it easier. And it's quiet under sail with all the unique sounds a sailboat makes (that's a big plus for me).

Plus it was rewarding to know we could do it. It was fun trying to keep our speed up through our tacks with my wife on one sheet winch, me on the other.

And, as I often find out, light air usually increases as the sun gets up. It often pays off, to stick with it(under sail). Toward the end of this track, the sailing was fantastic, close hauled with boat speeds cresting over 5 knots. We sometimes miss these sailing nuances, if we start under power waiting to feel sufficient wind, to raise sails.

Another plus: I get to take interesting shots of sailing. A shot under power on a sailboat, isn't as nice.
North Haven ahead (1 of 1).jpg


We were passed by about a dozen sailboats all under power. That doesn't bother me a bit. People have schedules; most don't like to sail slowly. Many need to charge batteries (or cool holding plates) at the beginning of the day.

And without local knowledge, you're not as likely to tack through a thoroughfare like this(although this one is fairly easy to sail through).

Most everybody waved but occasionally when you do this, a sailboat under power becomes annoyed if they have to slow down, and wait for you to sail out of way.

Oh well,...