Shaft seal really dripping

goblin · Nov 8, 2014

If it's the green item, it's the stuffing box which is adjustable. Easy! Google it.

McIntoshUSA · Nov 8, 2014

Check out these videos.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3AG40cfmR60

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6W7CPA1AmU

All U Get · Nov 8, 2014

DIY after viewing the link here on repacking a stuffing box.

http://www.marinehowto.com/

All U Get

Stu Jackson · Nov 8, 2014

And here's the written version:

http://www.c34.org/wiki/index.php?title=Stuffing_box_packing

Delezynski · Nov 8, 2014

Bawlmer,

Now that you know how to do the repacking, I suggest you use Dripless Moldable Packing!
See it at; http://www.defender.com/product3.jsp?path=-1|311|2349117|2349129&id=569209

I repacked our shaft in 2003 with it and even with replacing the shaft once, it has not leaked a drop! And I have run it at high RPM for quite some time and can still hold the fitting with my bare hand. No excess heating.

Greg

TENACITY CS36T · Nov 8, 2014

Beware of the mouldable stuff, see MAine sails how to article regarding this material.

AnsleyS · Nov 9, 2014

Steve,

Start with a tightening of your stuffing box before you even think about restuffing it. Put some penetrating oil on the threads and let sit for a while, then back off the lock nut (small one aft) and slightly tighten the packing nut. Tighten until there are no drops coming in while the shaft is not turning but about one a second while the shaft is turning. You will need two big wrenches to do this, one for the nuts and the other to stabilize the stuffing box ( just forward of the rubber pipe). Check the tightness while under power by touching the stuffing box (it should NOT be hot to the touch).

Alan Gomes · Nov 9, 2014

AnsleyS said:
Steve,

Start with a tightening of your stuffing box before you even think about restuffing it. Put some penetrating oil on the threads and let sit for a while, then back off the lock nut (small one aft) and slightly tighten the packing nut. Tighten until there are no drops coming in while the shaft is not turning but about one a second while the shaft is turning. You will need two big wrenches to do this, one for the nuts and the other to stabilize the stuffing box ( just forward of the rubber pipe). Check the tightness while under power by touching the stuffing box (it should NOT be hot to the touch).

One drip per second with the shaft turning is way too much. Two or maybe three drips a minute should be just fine. But I agree that if it isn't dripping when stationary that's preferable.

AnsleyS · Nov 9, 2014

Steve,

The next thing that I would try is to loosen the locking nut with heat. Back the stuffing nut off the locking nut and then hit the locking nut with the heat from a propane plumbing torch for a minute or so and then try to turn it. Try not to heat the stuffing box as you heat the nut. If you think that you have heated the stuffing box pour cold water on the box threads to cool it. The difference in thermal expansion may let you free the locking nut. You will have to grab on to the stuffing box with a pair of big channel locks or a pipe wrench and turn the nut with your adjustable wrench.

Ralph Johnstone · Nov 9, 2014

bawlmer said:
I feel a wallet buster coming. Any ideas still welcome.

Truer words were never spoken.

You may be able to salvage this yet but from your original photo, you may still want to replace the gland and shaft in the long run. Depends on how much you can salvage. Your photo doesn't look too encouraging but you won't know until you get it cleaned up.

Before I get started here, remember, most of what you've read on this so far is purely opinion based on anecdotal evidence ............... too many variables to state anything as fact so forget the "must do's".

1. Keep the PB Blaster coming but try heating the lock nut with a hair dryer and see if you can get it hot. Use your wife's fancy 1500 watt dryer (and pray she doesn't catch you). Don't use open flame as this may not go well with the log hose. This will be slow but don't get it so hot it will damage the log hose (maybe that's the one fact here). Try the wrenches again. No luck, hit it with the blaster, heat, and wenches repeatedly. Try lightly tapping each nut face in the hope of breaking the bond between nut and the gland sleeve. This shouldn't be too bad as the lock nut is thin with not much surface area while the bigger gland nut is already free. Try to keep the Blaster off of the log hose as it may not be the best thing for it.

2. Go easy on the aft portion of the gland which is round. Try using pump pliers to grip it and don't let them slip. Obviously you're not going to be able to apply too much force hence repeat, repeat, repeat. You may also want to ensure your hose clamps are tight as you mentioned the gland was turning in the hose.

3. Hopefully, with a little luck and a lot of swearing, the lock nut will come loose.

4. Before getting into the packing, the shaft should be smooth and clean under the packing so as not to abrade away the hopefully new packing you'll be installing or worse yet, score the shaft. Hard to say what your shaft is, SS or bronze and don't know if it's just dirty or heavily corroded. Try to clean up the exposed shaft as you will be sliding your new packing over the shaft several times and don't want any of that crud in the packing. Try 600 grit emery paper so you don't score the shaft. Just remove the dirt but don't take any metal off the shaft. It's bloody slow work but you can't UNSCORE the shaft.

5. Once you can pull back the gland nut, examine the shaft under where the packing sits. Hopefully it's not too badly scored. If necessary, clean it with 1,000 grit emery. In a perfect world, the shaft should have a mirror polish if the gland is regularly attended to.

Once everything is smooth and clean, you should be ready to re-pack. Use All U Get's link as MaineSail has a very clear write up on packing a gland. See Stu's link as well for more information.

This will no doubt take many hours and only you can decide how much your time is worth. You'll have to weigh that against somewhere in the neighborhood of $1,000.00 to:

1. haul the boat
2. separate the coupling from the shaft
3. pull the shaft
4. damage the cutlass bearing from all of the corrosion on the shaft
5. purchase a new shaft, coupling, cutlass bearing, and gland
6. install all of the above
7. pack the gland
8. splash

Mind you, probably won't be using the boat if your winters are anything like ours.

Just thinking about it, maybe it would be easier to get another job and use the money to pay a yard to do the work. Mind you, they'd never do as good a job as you because it's YOUR boat. :dance:

Once you do get things back in service, slather all exposed metal parts near the gland in Super Lube or anything else that will keep corrosion at bay. I use a spray called Fluid Film. Goes on like penetrating oil. Smells like a restaurant grease trap on a hot day and protects all metal from corrosion for great lengths of time. Put some inside the gland nut as well. Next time should be a piece of cake.

I've attached a few photos from notes I made on running a stuffing box dry. Concentrate on getting yours back to a drop or two per minute for now.

E-mail me if you need any other info.

Alan Gomes · Nov 10, 2014

bawlmer said:
I want to thank everyone for their responses. It gave me what I needed to get started. This morning I began hitting the threaded areas with PB Blaster. I was careful to keep it localized. Went to Home Depot for wrenches to give the stuff time to work. All they had were flimsy plumbing wrenches. Returned to boat and attempted to crack the nuts. No go. Applied more PBB and tried again. Still no go. Applied more PBB and went to Harbor Freight (which is where I should have gone in the first place) and bought 2 HUGE adjustable wrenches. Returned to boat and tried again. After much persuasion I managed to open one of the nuts. I removed the 2 HUGE wrenches and found the stuffing nut, not the locking nut was the one that moved. Unfortunately the stuffing box sleeve behind the threads is smooth and a wrench will not attach. I tried using big slip joint pliers on the stuffing box and one of the wrenches on the locking nut. The nut was so attached to the stuffing box that the stuffing box was actually turning in the sleeve hose it was attached to. Given the boat was still in the water I did not want to violently force it. I applied more PBB and headed home.

It seems as if the locking nut is fused to the stuffing box sleeve. The strategy will be to keep hitting it with PBB and trying to get it to turn. As for the packing nut I tightened back on the sleeve. The good news is it did not get any worse. If this does not take in the next few days I am probably going to have to get it hauled and have parts replaced. I was planning to leave it in the water this winter but this may change my plans. I feel a wallet buster coming. Any ideas still welcome. Thanks...Steve

Once you get everything apart and the new packing in, you'll want to get it adjusted properly. Here is a great thread on the subject, where MaineSail provides some excellent advice as well as some important cautions: http://forums.sbo.sailboatowners.com/showthread.php?t=153899 It will be well worth your time to read through this thread in its entirety.

Good luck.

Alan Gomes · Nov 10, 2014

bawlmer said:
Update. Went to target and bought a 12 dollar hair drier. Knew better than to borrow the Admiral's. Returned to boat. Applied more PBB. Applied heat and tapped repeated with hammer. I backed off the stuffing nut enough to align it to the locking nut. Put the channel locks on the stuffing box just ahead of the hose. Turned both and felt something move. Removed wrench and channel locks. This time it was the locking nut. SUCCESS! The locking nut was freed. I backed it off and began adjusting the stuffing nut until the drip was down to about one to two drips per minute. I cleaned all the threads and resealed the two nuts. Still 1 to 2 drips per minute. I fired up the engine and let it idle in gear for a few minutes. All good. I took it out for about a 20 minute spin around the harbor. Seal was dripping during the 2200 RPM run. I was by myself so I did not want to push it. After returning to the dock the seal was still cool and dripping returned to 1 to 2 drips per minute. I am going to call this fixed. I am also now the proud owner of two huge 18" adjustable wrenches from Harbor Freight. I could not have done this job without them.
I want to thank everyone who provided knowledge and informed encouragement. I was very close to Busting Out Another Thousand (or two) to get his fixed. I will eventually repack this seal but not today. Joining and participating in this forum is probably the smartest boating decision I have made so far. Thanks again to all!

Congrats. Sounds like you've made good progress. You can probably try sneaking up on the adjustment to get it to drip a bit less. But at least now you are in the ballpark. Again, take a look at the thread I referenced above so you can get an idea of the sort of range you are shooting for.

WayneH · Nov 10, 2014

I joined the board BEFORE I bought the big boat.

bawlmer said:
I want to thank everyone who provided knowledge and informed encouragement. I was very close to Busting Out Another Thousand (or two) to get his fixed. I will eventually repack this seal but not today. Joining and participating in this forum is probably the smartest boating decision I have made so far. Thanks again to all!

This board has saved me lots of money. Both ways. Knowing how to fix something is just as important as knowing when to let someone else fix something.

I've never regretted posting something here. Somethings I've been told I was full of Sh!t. I've learned something new nearly every day. Like I'm full of sh!t sometimes.

Claude L.-Auger · Dec 17, 2014

Lucky you caught those clamps and replaced before something dreadful happened. and yes as everyone here will tell you you only tighten a little at the time until you're satisfied. Overtightening and then backing off is a no-no as packing material material has no memory. Once compressed it will not expand back.

Ralph Johnstone · Dec 17, 2014

bawlmer said:
Is there a rule for tightening these things? All comments welcome
Thanks...Steve

You can't do any damage by overtightening it over the winter while it's not in use. Just remember to loosen it slightly for the first usage next year.

As a rule, just tighten it about a half a nut flat as you bring the leakage to a minimum and ALWAYS monitor the temperature of the gland.

pateco · Dec 17, 2014

I changed the packing on mine back in November. below are before, during and after pictures, and a link to a short video. The previous owner had used just 2 layers of 1/4" graphite impregnated packing. I replaced with the specified 3 layers of 3/16" standard flax. The 1/4" was really too tight, and very difficult to remove. however, it does not look like the graphite caused too much corrosion. It did however cause definite staining on the shaft as you can see in the pictures. Now I just need to take it on a test run, and readjust for the correct drip. This site is a lifesaver. Thanks to everyone here for the advice and insights.

BEFORE

DURING

AFTER

VIDEO LINK
Repacking Video

Shaft seal really dripping

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