Introduction and new to me O'day 25 project...

[Mikesab]

First an introduction...

I have been a 40 year power boater and have owned and operated boats from 8' to 48'. We just sold our most recent powerboat (30' Searay Weekender) last year.
I did sail a 14' Sunfish for lots of summers in my youth, so I am not totally experience-less in sailing, but still basically a sailing newb.

I have been interested in getting into sailing and have taken a few sails with friends, and been wearing down my local brokers climbing thru all kinds of boats this winter getting a feel for what I liked. (plus reading tons on here and other forums)
I kind of settled on O'day 25's as being the boat for us, and began looking.

Long story short, I saw an O'day 25 on Craigslist near where my dad lives in Florida (I am in Michigan)
So I arranged for him to go look at it, and kind of before I knew what happened, my dad called to say he ended up making the guy an offer and got it for a very, very good price.
He is going to motor it down to his dock on the canal this week.
Wow! I went from "hey take a look at this if you have time" to "you own a sailboat" in nothing flat.

It does need some things, which I was aware of, and is actually good, because I love having a project to focus my energies into, and for the price I have lots of room to work on stuff, and do it right.

Projects:
1. Port bulkhead/chainplate attachment is needing repair or replacement.
2. Mast step/tabernacle is "tweaked" from aforementioned chainplate movement
3. remake interior settee cushions
4. Acquire/purchase Sails (previous owner is taking the sails over to his 22 o'day... I guess they fit it too?)
5. Adapt a powerboat trailer to accommodate the Oday. (I have a few available)

The bulkhead replacement and tabernacle repair is well within my skill set, but I did have a few questions.

Question:
1. Where else besides this forum would you look to find some used budget sails that have maybe 1-3 seasons left in them. (Main and Jib/genoa) ?
(anybody getting new this year, and want to pay it forward?)


I could afford new sails right now, but I am working on adapting a trailer to haul this back to Michigan after my sabbatical in Florida, and I have owned enough boats to know there are multiple ($$) projects waiting in the wings, that I haven't become privy to yet.
Hence the budget plan on the sails for this year.

Thanks in advance,
Mike

 

[topcat0399]

Perhaps the $$$$ you save expending hydrocarbons can be used for something truly beautiful such as that sweet ship you just married.

Your punch list is certainly manageable, the biggest item will probably be a decent suit of sails. We are in the same boat in that regard.

A flock of sail boats is so much more beautiful than any swarm of buzzing stink pots I always say.

Welcome to the light side.

 

[Sunbird22358]

Unless the previous owner has a very much over-sized rig on his 22 the sails from the 25 are going to be way too big....... something "fishy" there! Maybe he had been using a set of O'DAY 22 sails on the 25?? Actually, that was my first thought... HOWEVER! If, and only IF.... he has a 1980-83 O'DAY 22..... it appears that the Mainsail IS the same size (but maybe not same cloth weight?) as the 25. So, the main sail from a 25 may very well fit the 22 fractional rig and the main from a 22 fractional rig (1980-83) may actually fit the 25.

I would still say that the sails from hte 25 will not fit the earlier (1972-79) 22 with the masthead rig. So, the sails from htat vintage 22 would still be too small for the 25 (jib would still sort-of fit the 25, but would be kind of small and not really line up properly with the jib lead blocks on the 25).

There are several dealers of used and surplus sails, check the web. Atlantic Sail Warehouse comes to mind (might not still be around.. but worth checking out?) I'll list the O'DAY 25 rig dimensions below, a good sail broker will be able to compare sails to these to find a near match.

 

[Mikesab]

I was thinking the same thing, but it seems like the guy was desperate to get rid of the boat, and so he was kind of in a scavenge mode. he was taking things like the curtains, cushions and such. (maybe not fishy, but strange, or extremely frugal)

Maybe he just bought the sails when the bulkhead went bad, and is going to have them recut to fit the 22, who knows... anyways, It looks like I can replace the OEM main and working jib for about $1100 total, so I will decide that once I actually see the boat in person. (my dad, says it is extremely clean and well kept... solid decks, etc... minus the bulkhead of course)

The other thing I will do tomorrow is call the seller and see if he is willing to part with the sails, for more cash, etc... I will definitely ask about the rig size and his interest in the larger sails. =)

Thanks for the replies,
Mike

 

[korchinskyp]

I've got a Mylar 150 genoa used one season and a 120 Dacron almost new.
I'll sell both for $1000.

 

[Jackdaw]

I was thinking the same thing, but it seems like the guy was desperate to get rid of the boat, and so he was kind of in a scavenge mode. he was taking things like the curtains, cushions and such. (maybe not fishy, but strange, or extremely frugal)

Maybe he just bought the sails when the bulkhead went bad, and is going to have them recut to fit the 22, who knows... anyways, It looks like I can replace the OEM main and working jib for about $1100 total, so I will decide that once I actually see the boat in person. (my dad, says it is extremely clean and well kept... solid decks, etc... minus the bulkhead of course)

The other thing I will do tomorrow is call the seller and see if he is willing to part with the sails, for more cash, etc... I will definitely ask about the rig size and his interest in the larger sails. =)

Thanks for the replies,
Mike

Well I hope you didn't get screwed. New sails will add much to the cost of the boat. I cannot image how he thinks he could use the sails on a 22, the luffs will be WAY to long. Best bet will be used.

Bulkhead issues on O'days a very common problem, so you will find lots of helpful advice there. A friend of mine had the same on his O25 and documented it very well on his blog; you might find it helpful. It's in here somewhere....

http://danssailingblog.blogspot.com/

 

[cb32863]

Welcome to O'Day 25 repair and refurbish Mikesab. Thanks for posting my blog Jackdaw!

As for new sails, I got a new main late last season from Sailwarehouse. $725 plus shipping. new sailnumbers from sailrite was about $35 I think... somewhwere in there. I also got a slightly used jib, 145%, from Bacon sails out east. Shop around and you will find some thing for sure. Feel free to message me if you have any questions. How's the centerboard looking? I have re-cored the deck under the mast as well as swapping bulkheads.

PS - As for the previous owner using the 25's sails on a 22.... ain't gonna fit.

 

[Mikesab]

I really don't think I can get too screwed on this one. I knew the sails weren't part of the deal.

If the guy uses the sails to stoke his nightly bonfire, makes a years supply of toga party costumes, or has them draping off the end of his too short mast and boom, I guess that's up to him

I figure if I do buy new, and decide to scrap the boat in 2 years, (which I DO NOT plan on doing, but for sake of discussion...), I feel the sails would still be a very resale-able asset.

@cb... Ha, I actually came across your blog before I bought the boat! I was researching this type of repair to see if it was something that I wanted to tackle.
Thanks for sharing your experience!

I am prepared to re-core the mast step/deck area, if it needs it, and from my phone call this morning I found out that the boat has a roller furler for the headsail too, which I wasn't expecting, so that changes the type of attachment for the headsail than I thought I was looking for. (I was wanting to add roller furling anyways, so I am pretty stoked about it)

QUESTION:
If you were to buy ONE all around headsail, mostly for Lake Michigan use, for someone novice in experience, mostly singlehanding, what size would you recommend?
plain OEM Jib or Genoa, 110, 130, 150, so many options, and I really have no clew about what I should be looking for.
The mainsail is a pretty standard OEM decision, at least I think it is.
I am not looking to win the america's cup or anything, just trying get from point A to point B. =)
=)


I will hopefully have more pics on Wednesday, and then begin work on April 4th

Thanks for all the encouraging posts!

Mike

 

[cb32863]

Mike, glad you found my information useful. The 25 came with a 150 I think when new. You could probably get by with a nice 135 with a foam luff cut for your furler. Again, I would look at Sailwarehouse for your age boat. They are not going to win you a TransSuperior race but, the sails are decent quality and a decent price. You can get a 135 as described for a little over $1K. So if you do the main too you can be outfitted with new for around $2K.

No affiliation with Sailwarehouse. Just think the provide good sails for older boats at a decent price.

EDIT:You can also do some leg work and find decent used sails too I would think.

 

[Mikesab]

Ok, an update of sorts...
As you know I am stuck in Michigan, and the boat is in Florida.
My dad and a friend motored it up to his house yesterday, and have it tied up along side his lift/dock.

So with that I was able to get some more pictures.

The damage is as expected, but of course I won't know the full extent until I start skinning fiberglass, but the pictures look pretty typical

Bulkhead

Deck Mast/step

Another view... and black electrical tape works just as well as teak bungs right? :neutral:

Deck where chainplate went skyward...

Mast step/hinge

"Curvy" Roller Furler (Hood Sea-flex)

Interior Starboard side bulkhead

Rudder missing lower pintle attachment.... so how do you lose that!!?

Initial Plan from the pictures is to get the deck under the mast opened up to see how far the neglect was allowed to spread..... replacing any coring as needed, seal it up and then begin the side stay deck assessment and repair
Fill/seal any other deck perforations (the guy was in the process of scavenging little parts off of this boat for his other one... weird.

After that, address replacement of the bulkhead(s)

That's the major stuff to stem any further damage and then I will begin cleaning up and rebedding any deck hardware one piece at a time.

Ah, boat ownership.... I so remember you, and so does my checkbook

More to follow....

 

[topcat0399]

How about a photo of the whole darn boat????

I bought a wreck with no sails too but it sounds like
you are going into it with your eyes open unlike what I did.

Have to buy sails this spring! I've been doing the homework for a year now -
its a heady experience.

Welcome to the fix it club and cabin top cores are the easiest...

 

[Jackdaw]

Sab,

Well at least you are in good company. I have seen more O'days with total chainplate failure than in all other brands combined. This one happened during a friend's haulout. The mast just missed hitting us. Between his toes and two feet in front of him, you can see the chainplate that ripped straight out. Just like yours! ;^)

 

[Mikesab]

Well, glad to see I am in good company.
As for pictures of the whole boat, I am at the mercy of my retired mom, who is climbing around taking all the pics for me down in Florida (I am in Michigan until the 29th)

Here are a few of the "big picture" pics she took. =)

 

[cb32863]

Mike, forgot to give you this link as well...

http://www.drmarine.com/categories.asp?cat=73

Rudy used to work for O'Day... I got my chainplates and centerboard from him.

 

[Mikesab]

Thanks!
I have been using that same bookmark to add potential purchase items to my pre-work spreadsheet for cost/budget analysis.

Update: I spoke with the PO today in reference to the missing lower rudder pintle (drmarine part $75) and he said, he thinks he knows were it is, and I could have it..., however it needs a new PIN welded to it. This is good news, as heliarc-ing a new pin will be a piece of cake, and take $75 off the project budget =)

Oh, and as and update to the update, the PO said he just came across another boat he really wants and might now be selling his 23 Oday... which would mean all the stuff he scavenged off this 25 to use on the 23, would be available.
Of course for a small price, but that would mean sails, running rigging, cushions, curtains, outboard, whatever.... for a fraction of sourcing all that stuff separately, since he has no need for it any longer. praying that part works out. =)

Q: You needed a new centerboard?

Mine functions, raises and lowers, but because it is in the water, I won't be able to see it until I go swimming (which I plan to do to inspect below the waterline)

 

[Mikesab]

cabin top cores are the easiest...

Have you (or have you heard of anyone) had to do the entire cabin top? or is it generally just the mast step and surrounding area, seeing as it gets the most stress/torquing which allows water intrusion?

 

[RichBone]

There's been some of us that have done the cabin top. The size of the repair depends on the amount of water intrusion of course. It varies from boat to boat. Also the chainplates and bulkhead repair and replacement. And there are pictures here. Other places of water intrusion are the side and fore decks and cabin sole. One important thing to keep in mind as you go forward is to note and take very careful measurements of locations of the chainplate attachment on the bulkhead, where the chainplate goes through the deck and most important the exact location of the tabernacle on the cabin top. Many of us been through this and there's a wealth of info here. In my case it started getting disheartening when I slowly realized the extent of repairs on mine. Let's see; bulkhead replacement, cabin top repair, makeshift stabilization of the water intrusion of the decks and cabin sole, rewiring and replacement of the hull liner. My best friend lives in Florida and has worked on repairing and rebuilding many boats and gave me plenty of encouragement and ideas which really helped me through the rebuild plus all the help I got here on this forum. Luckily the boat had always lived in fresh water so the standing rigging, spars and fittings hadn't suffered. Keep a sense of humor and your eyes on the prize and enjoy the 'process' That being said, I love the boat. It's forgiving, feels like a 'big boat' and sails comfortably.

 

[Mikesab]

Thanks for the replies!

I can't wait to get started working on this! In fact I added another week of vacation to the front end of my planned trip with the sole purpose of giving more working time on the boat!

UPDATE: So I talked to the previous owner today and he said, "I guess the sails don't quite fit my 23 Oday... so maybe I can make you a package deal with the outboard and the sails."

*Outboard is 9.8 hp longshaft 4 stroke Tohatsu

Both Sails just came back from the sail shop where he had new sunbrella put on the Genoa, and had the main fixed/checked over and fixed anything that looked worn.. anyways, his package deal was a great price, way less than I was expecting him to offer.

Moving closer to just "Fixing" instead of sourcing what was "missing" :dance:

 

[RichBone]

Now if only we can move on to Spring

 

[cb32863]

Very cool. Sails are a good thing to have! And why he thought they would fit on a 23 is beyond me.....