New furling genoa for a 76 30ft Catalina
- Thread starter TAJ
- Start date
A photo would be helpful.. assuming you're discussing a 'baby stay' just forward of the mast.. the answer, of course, is 'depends'...
Also not really helpful - to you - to post the same question in two forums.. it dilutes the responses and makes it harder to keep up.
Also not really helpful - to you - to post the same question in two forums.. it dilutes the responses and makes it harder to keep up.
What do you mean by "mid stay" and "main stay"? A picture would be nice.
My guess is that you are concerned about a large headsail, attached to the forestay (or headstay), hanging up on an "inner forestay" when tacking or gybing. If it's easy to remove, I'd just detach it while sailing with the genny. More imortantly (the reason for the picture request) we need to know how close to the forestay is the inner forestay. If the gap is a few feet or more between the two wires then you can leave everything in place, but just change your tacking technique. Instead of tossing off the sheet at first and letting the wind push the sail across the foredeck, you should hold off and just release a foot or so until you can see a bubble in the luff section push into the gap. Keeping tension on the sheet will force the wind forward to the front of the sail. Once the bubble expands and starts pulling the sail forward you control the release of the sheet until you can feel the entire sail rushing towards the gap, It's very important that you don't pull the new sheet harder than it takes to just remove the slack. The wind will do all the work. This move requires practice, but is a very satisfying accomplishment.
Boats with adequate crew wil often send one forward to help the sail through the gap. Very large genoas will often need help getting the saill around the MAST, not just a tight gap created by an inner forestay. So if you have people confindent in going forward to handle sails, this is a good time to put them to work. Easy.
For shorthanded situations, there is another method but it requires making alterations. That would be to install a cringle (grommet reinforced hole) in the foot of the sail midway along its foot. You would attach a line to this mid point, run it forward to a small block anchored near the tack and back to a convenient cleat. The purpose of this line is to pull the center of the sail forward to the gap between forestay and innerforestay to assist formation of the "bubble" that will pull the sail through. I have used this method and it is quite effective.
Okay.... what if the inner forestay is extremely close to the headstay.... this is seen most commonly with roller furling equipped headsails, where there is a large furled reaching sail on the stem or sprit and another stay for an upwind sail right behind it There are two solutions. It can be a "gybe only" sail... where the sheets would be run outside like a gennaker. Or.... and this would be more practical... you would simply roll up the sail, change direction, and roll it out on the other side. If you are using both sails at the same time this method would work also. Questions? good luck,
@TAJ Welcome to SBO And welcome to owning a Catalina 30! There's a lot of fine knowledgeable people here who are glad to help you with your questions.
First,
The Catalina 30 has a “fore stay” that runs from the masthead to the bow and an “aft stay” that runs from the masthead to the aft end of the boat.
Wires running from the masthead to the side decks of the boat are called “upper shrouds”. The wires running from the mast under the spreaders to the side decks are called “lower shrouds” , one foreword and aft.
Unless your boat was modified for some reason I believe you are asking about the forward lower shrouds.
I would say no. Non of the shrouds or stays should be removed. They all work as a system to hold the mast upright in the proper position to support the sails in most wind strengths.
As@joe says, tacking so the sail clew doesn’t hang up on a shroud is more about technique. He explains it well in his post above.
How the sheets are attached to the clew of the sail is also important. A large knot will get caught on a shroud faster and harder than a cow hitch/ luggage tag knot. The cow hitch may hang up for a second but the shaking of the sail will free it.
I have a furler and 135 genny on my C30 tall rig. When I used the cow hitch to attach my sheets, it would catch on the foreword shrouds for a few seconds then fly free with no problem.
First,
The Catalina 30 has a “fore stay” that runs from the masthead to the bow and an “aft stay” that runs from the masthead to the aft end of the boat.
Wires running from the masthead to the side decks of the boat are called “upper shrouds”. The wires running from the mast under the spreaders to the side decks are called “lower shrouds” , one foreword and aft.
Unless your boat was modified for some reason I believe you are asking about the forward lower shrouds.
I would say no. Non of the shrouds or stays should be removed. They all work as a system to hold the mast upright in the proper position to support the sails in most wind strengths.
As@joe says, tacking so the sail clew doesn’t hang up on a shroud is more about technique. He explains it well in his post above.
How the sheets are attached to the clew of the sail is also important. A large knot will get caught on a shroud faster and harder than a cow hitch/ luggage tag knot. The cow hitch may hang up for a second but the shaking of the sail will free it.
I have a furler and 135 genny on my C30 tall rig. When I used the cow hitch to attach my sheets, it would catch on the foreword shrouds for a few seconds then fly free with no problem.
Thanks for repling.
As per pic. Its 1.5 meters from the main and 1 meter from the top of the mast. Its rope too.
As per pic. Its 1.5 meters from the main and 1 meter from the top of the mast. Its rope too.
Attachments
Taj... what you're calling the 'main' is your forestay or headstay. The 'baby stay' (mid) in your picture was most likely added to prevent mast pumping in heavier conditions and I would guess is not strictly required, and it certainly will complicate tacking and gybing. It's not a standard Catalina 30 setup.
The babystay is rigged with a quick disconnect snap shackle so you could easily stow it out of the way until it was deemed a good idea
(.. maybe never)
Please buy a book and learn the terminology, everyone needs to understand what you're asking about!
The babystay is rigged with a quick disconnect snap shackle so you could easily stow it out of the way until it was deemed a good idea
(.. maybe never)
Please buy a book and learn the terminology, everyone needs to understand what you're asking about!
Cheers Hollyberry.
I`m watching a lot of popeye videos to get the lingo correct.
It's not a standard Catalina 30 setup. Ok, will remove it { let it remain but get it out the way } for tacking and gybing.
The rigger recommended a Profurl 350 ABOUT, AU 4K ALL UP INSTALLED BUT WITHOUT SAIL.
Thanks to Ward H and Joe too.
I`m watching a lot of popeye videos to get the lingo correct.
It's not a standard Catalina 30 setup. Ok, will remove it { let it remain but get it out the way } for tacking and gybing.
The rigger recommended a Profurl 350 ABOUT, AU 4K ALL UP INSTALLED BUT WITHOUT SAIL.
Thanks to Ward H and Joe too.
The inner forestay is not original and not required for normal conditions. That is why it has a quick connect. I have had my C30 tall rig with bow sprit for 25 years and have never found any issues with the factory rigging.Cheers Hollyberry.
I`m watching a lot of popeye videos to get the lingo correct.
It's not a standard Catalina 30 setup. Ok, will remove it { let it remain but get it out the way } for tacking and gybing.
The rigger recommended a Profurl 350 ABOUT, AU 4K ALL UP INSTALLED BUT WITHOUT SAIL.
Thanks to Ward H and Joe too.
I suspect that the inner forestay was added to make the rig a cutter rather than sloop rig and allow the addition of an inner foresail for use in heavy weather. If this is the case, to be properly done, there should be some form of reinforcement added to the underside of the fore deck to take the load from that stay down to the hull. It is also likely that running backstays were added at the attachement height of the inner forestay to resist that load. If the inner forestay is attached near the height of the spreader, no running backs would be needed.
All of this would only be needed for serious off-shore work. I have sailed my C30 many times in +40 and one in the high 50-knot range and was able to keep everything reasonably comfortable with a double reef and roller furled 135%.
I had found a list of changes made to the C30 over the years that was posted on the Catalina 30 Association web site.
I was looking at it this morning for other reasons and saw this note for 1979:
"Change to larger mast section with flat sides".
Maybe the earlier mast was prone to mast pumping and CTY changed to the larger mast section to eliminate the pumping. Interesting
I was looking at it this morning for other reasons and saw this note for 1979:
"Change to larger mast section with flat sides".
Maybe the earlier mast was prone to mast pumping and CTY changed to the larger mast section to eliminate the pumping. Interesting
The earlier mast was an oval section and did not have an extruded mast. The mail was attached with an externally attached stainless steel track.
Thanks all for your help.
Watching popeye vids to learn the lingo
Thanks again Hollyberry , Ward H and Joe
Watching popeye vids to learn the lingo
Thanks again Hollyberry , Ward H and Joe