What do you tow your Mac with?

[Sail123]

Towing Nightmare:

My toter home was (WAS) equipped with a 10,000 pound rated receiver hitch, that I was pulling a 2000 pound empty flatbed trailer when the receiver hitch welds broke free. We figured out a 30 mile area the trailer came off during a heavy rain storm. However, we have yet to find the trailer. Someone stole it, or the weeded Earth swallowed it up.

Lesson learned, additional safety chains somewhere to the frame on the truck, not just in the receiver hitch.

The hitch will be rebuilt, with something rated to pull mobile homes. That nightmare is never happening to me again.

Lucky no one was killed or injured. Happened just yesterday.

Toter home has a 80,000 pound fifth wheel, a class 5 gooseneck ball

and it had (had) a class 4 trailer hitch.

Will be replacing that failed hitch with something big boys move mobile homes with.

 

[timebandit]

It's been about 40 years since I sold them "trailer toter" but as I recall you are not supposed to weld to the frame rails.

I even think it is stamped in the frames rails.

Towing Nightmare:

My toter home was (WAS) equipped with a 10,000 pound rated receiver hitch, that I was pulling a 2000 pound empty flatbed trailer when the receiver hitch welds broke free. We figured out a 30 mile area the trailer came off during a heavy rain storm. However, we have yet to find the trailer. Someone stole it, or the weeded Earth swallowed it up.

Lesson learned, additional safety chains somewhere to the frame on the truck, not just in the receiver hitch.

The hitch will be rebuilt, with something rated to pull mobile homes. That nightmare is never happening to me again.

Lucky no one was killed or injured. Happened just yesterday.

Toter home has a 80,000 pound fifth wheel, a class 5 gooseneck ball

and it had (had) a class 4 trailer hitch.

Will be replacing that failed hitch with something big boys move mobile homes with.

 

[Sail123]

The hitch had bolted attachment points. They are still in place. It is the hitch welds that separated.

People do weld frames but it is best done by a very skilled frame shop. Every motor home conversion that started off as a semi has extended welded frames.

It's been about 40 years since I sold them "trailer toter" but as I recall you are not supposed to weld to the frame rails.

I even think it is stamped in the frames rails.

 

[walt]

What do you guys think about manual vs. auto transmissions for towing a 3 to 4 thousand pound boat/trailer?

Ive been towing with a 5 speed manual (including going over Colorado mountain passes to 11.5K elevation - they were in the way of where I needed to go), so far this seems to be a better option than an auto (but harder to find used). However, I dont have the equivalent experience with an auto transmission to make a reasonable comparison.

 

[timebandit]

I told you it had been a long time.

The last large motor homes I looked at were bus chaisis with pusher motors.

What do they do with the drive shaft when they convert a semi??

The hitch had bolted attachment points. They are still in place. It is the hitch welds that separated.

People do weld frames but it is best done by a very skilled frame shop. Every motor home conversion that started off as a semi has extended welded frames.

 

[Sumner]

What do you guys think about manual vs. auto transmissions for towing a 3 to 4 thousand pound boat/trailer?.

I guess it depends on the vehicle and what the engine is, but in most cases with domestic vans, pickups, and vehicles like suburbans the autos are stronger. That wasn't the case in the 50'-60's.

Most all of the drag guys use autos except for the really fast cars and the manuals in those are not the same as any manual you can buy in a street car.

I'd just look at the tow rating for what you are interested in. Our Suburban has an auto that is plenty heavy duty enough, but the one-ton vans and pickups and such have an even stronger auto available.

Which vehicle are you interested in Walt?

Sum

Our Endeavour 37

Our Trips to Utah, Idaho, Canada, Florida

Our MacGregor S Pages

Mac-Venture Links

 

[walt]

Sumner, thanks for posting on this. My 2002 Dodge Dakota 4x4 with 4.7l has something like 115K miles and is still working mostly well so hopefully I get at least a few more years out of it.

With the Denver- Havasu connection, I end up driving there at least a few times a year now and with gas going nowhere but up, next vehicle is going to be as fuel efficient as possible - but still be able to safely tow the Mac (with the brakes working FINALLY). So I’m somewhat thinking that the 5 speed would allow a slightly "smaller" and more fuel efficient vehicle..

I do like the idea of the Suburban however..

 

[Sumner]

Sumner, thanks for posting on this. My 2002 Dodge Dakato 4x4 with 4.7l has something like 115K miles and is still working mostly well so hopefully I get at least a few more years out of it.

With the Denver- Havasu connection, I end up driving there at least a few times a year now and with gas going nowhere but up, next vehicle is going to be as fuel efficient as possible - but still be able to safetly tow the Mac (with the brakes working FINALLY). So Im somewhat thinking that the 5 speed would allow a slightly "smaller" and more fuel efficient vehicle..

I do like the idea of the Suberban however..

If the main use is to tow the boat between Den and Hav I don't think a smaller vehicle will get much if any or maybe worst mileage due to the fact you are really working it. Now if you are also using the vehicle at home and are putting high non-towing mileage on it then something with a smaller engine might be the way to go as you would get better mileage in non-towing situations.

Our Suburban is used over 90% only to tow with. We will use it going back to Florida after the first of the year without the Mac, but will still have a utility trailer behind it for that trip. Our '99 Buick gets 28-30 mpg on the highway, but with that trailer about 16-17 mpg. I'll bet the Sub gets 14-15 with the same trailer, so not much difference and since the Sub will also be filled inside the Buick is out of the question.

I like the '96 to '99 Suburbans and Pickups as they have the Vortec engine that I know well and can service and replace, I even have another engine now out of a wrecked van. If I wasn't going to do the work myself then I'd look for the next generation with the 5.3 LS type motor. As much or more power than our 5.7 V-8 and with a little better fuel mileage. With any of these GM options I'd get the auto as it is stronger and has the lockup converter and overdrive, when not towing.

I really didn't think I'd like the Suburban, but we love it. Really comfortable on the highway for long trips. With all the seats, ours actually has the 3rd seat which we removed, we can take a number of people out in 4 wheel conditions here in comfort. Max seating in our jeep is 3 people. On trips if we don't have it filled we can and have slept in it. With the rear seats folded flat, just takes seconds, it will swallow a ton of gear, lumber, etc.. The outboard our dinghy and all of our other items are inside locked up on trips. It will spoil you, but if we also used it on a daily basis at home I might look at what other options are out there,

Sum

Our Endeavour 37

Our Trips to Utah, Idaho, Canada, Florida

Our MacGregor S Pages

Mac-Venture Links

 

[timebandit]

Automatics are easier to pull the boat up the ramp.

 

[Sail123]

Mine is a toter home. They pull the load rather than push the load.

Last trip, a weigh station asked me to come inside and bring my load papers. I walk inside with my motor home registration and the lady was not very happy about letting me go without log books, DOT stickers, and all the DOT garbage. I feel sorry for the truckers. When she finally figured out I really was just a motor home, she let me go and told me to drive safely.

I told you it had been a long time.

The last large motor homes I looked at were bus chassis with pusher motors.

What do they do with the drive shaft when they convert a semi??

 

[walt]

Data point Im not real proud off..

Sumner, you had what sounds like a slight issue with the auto tranny on the down hill grade in Canada before you put the trailer brakes on.

Ive done the following mountain passes towing close to the same boat/trailer (I think this was before you modified the trailer) and without trailer brakes but with a 5 speed manual..

Hoosier Pass CO elevation 11.5 thousand feet - gone over this pass 5 times
Wolf Creek pass CO elevation 10.85 thousand feet - over this pass once
Vail pass CO elevation 10.6 thousand feet - gone over this pass 9 times
Raton pass NM - a mere 7.8 thousand feet - gone over once

Im not legal without the brakes (would need something like a 7000 pound vehicle) but Ive pretty much felt like I had no drama going over all the mountain passes with the 5 speed manual tranny.

 

[Sumner]

Data point Im not real proud off..

Sumner, you had what sounds like a slight issue with the auto tranny on the down hill grade in Canada before you put the trailer brakes on.

Ive done the following mountain passes towing close to the same boat/trailer (I think this was before you modified the trailer) and without trailer brakes but with a 5 speed manual..

Hoosier Pass CO elevation 11.5 thousand feet - gone over this pass 5 times
Wolf Creek pass CO elevation 10.85 thousand feet - over this pass once
Vail pass CO elevation 10.6 thousand feet - gone over this pass 9 times
Raton pass NM - a mere 7.8 thousand feet - gone over once

Im not legal without the brakes (would need something like a 7000 pound vehicle) but Ive pretty much felt like I had no drama going over all the mountain passes with the 5 speed manual tranny.

Yep I've been over all those passes also, but not towing the Mac . Over Wolf Creek a lot with the teardrop. I mentioned the auto problem on the one pass to alert someone that it isn't just going up that can cause a problem with an auto overheat, but down can also be an issue. The auto has the torque converter and lots of clutches in it and is almost all hydraulic in nature, so if the fluid builds heat then problems can arise. I was using the transmission in 2nd for braking and caused heat to build. Your manual has no fluid, so no problem.

I should of just used the brakes and pulled over and cooled them if needed. I did that later in the trip dropping down the really bad grade into Lewiston, ID. From being over the passes you mentioned and comparing them to Lewiston and the one on Highway 3 in Canada I'd rate the drop into Lewiston and the Canada pass worst. They say that the pass on 3 in Canada is the highest all weather pass in Canada. It is only about 6,000 ft, but drops about 3,000 feet in a short distance on both sides. The one dropping down into Lewiston has 3 or 4 truck runoffs if I remember right. The overall elevation of these isn't as high as the CO ones, but the continuous steep grade seems worst.

I had manual transmissions most of my life and don't have anything against them, just saying that the automatics now are strong, just use them right. Once again I'd just look at the vehicles 'you' like and compare the tow ratings and the mileage figures and consumer reports.

I had a Dakota with the V-8 and liked it, but started to worry about 100,000 miles when I read that a lot of those automatics didn't make it to 150,000 miles. I'd have no problem thought buying a GM that had 150,000 on it with an auto. The newer Dakota autos might go well past 150,000 for all I know. Just do your research like you do and you will be happy. Is there a reason you don't just keep what you have? 115,000 miles shouldn't be that much.

Sum

Our Endeavour 37

Our Trips to Utah, Idaho, Canada, Florida

Our MacGregor S Pages

Mac-Venture Links

 

[patrickfarley]

I have a Chevy Suburban 6.5 turbo diesel to tow.

Fun fact about the Chev 6.5 turbo diesel. When the injection pump goes out it can mimic a transmission problem. I now have a rebuilt transmission and a new injection pump.

Another funny thing. Before the new injection pump I was getting 22mpg towing. Now I only get 18. The last year before replacing the injection pump I was getting 25 mpg.

The engine is computer controlled and even the dealerships have trouble diagnosing them. I had to become my own expert.

I am getting ready to tow my Macgregor 25 on my new to me trailer for the first time. Just having a bit of trouble getting the parts I need to finish up.

 

[walt]

Is there a reason you don't just keep what you have? 115,000 miles shouldn't be that much.

The Dakota is overall fine (and I’m working on the trailer brakes again now) - however.. the Dakota is the model with the little cab/small back seats. This worked fine when I bought it 9 or 10 years ago but its getting to be a space problem with the two kids getting older (one over 6 foot, the other approaching that). But.. It would be cheaper for me to just pay the kids to not complain for the several times a year when they travel in the truck. It will be few years before I replace it but thinking about options now.

Off topic ... We were just sort of in your area (Southern Utah) - attached picture is of the 14yo throwing the dog into the ice cold Virgin River. Nice kid

 

[Sumner]

... the Dakota is the model with the little cab/small back seats. This worked fine when I bought it 9 or 10 years ago but its getting to be a space problem with the two kids getting older (one over 6 foot, the other approaching that). But.. It would be cheaper for me to just pay the kids to not complain for the several times a year when they travel in the truck...

I forgot about the boys , tell them hi, and yes something like the 'burb would be nice for the family. It sure has spoiled just the two of us on the road,

Sum

Our Endeavour 37

Our Trips to Utah, Idaho, Canada, Florida

Our MacGregor S Pages

Mac-Venture Links

 

[doehunter]

I've been due for a tow vehicle for a while. My Explorer has 220K miles on it.
Been shopping the last few days, (craigs list)
Almost bought a 2001 4x4 gmc Jimmy with a 6 cyl. then I drove a 2001 Expedition. Man, what a difference. Now it's a toss up between 2 Expeditions.
They have 2 different size V8's. The one with the smaller one (4.6ltr.) I'm told gets 20-21 mpg on the highway. (no trailer) and the bigger one (5.4ltr) 12-15 or so.
Does anyone have experience with a 2000-2001 era Expedition?
I'm kinda wondering how much more life they should have in them if they are good now.
Jim

 

[Sumner]

....Almost bought a 2001 4x4 gmc Jimmy with a 6 cyl. then I drove a 2001 Expedition. Man, what a difference. Now it's a toss up between 2 Expeditions.....Jim

For a better comparison maybe you should also try a GM with a V-8. I'll bet they have better mpg than the bigger V-8 Ford and I'll bet you won't be disappointed in the power either,

Sum

 

[doehunter]

It's funny, I grew up liking Chevrolet's and not Ford's cause my dad did.
I've only had 1 Ford, and that's the Explorer I'm driving now. Bought from a sleazy small time used car lot on a whim. It went from 113K to 220K miles with very little upkeep so that gave me confidence in them despite the weak tranny reputation.
I started out looking for something bigger so it would be more stable on the road towing the Mac. I looked at the Jimmy cause it was 4x4, and I thought it would be handy at the boat ramp. It actually felt smaller than my Explorer.The front tires were worn out on the outer edges, and the motorized mirrors wouldn't adjust right. I noticed one new headlight lens and the guy said it had been in a wreck before he bought it.
I think the Expeditions felt more like something to tow a Mac with!
Haven't looked at any other brands yet.

 

[Madelon]

towing

Initially a 2003 Toyota Tacoma V-6, 4x4, 3.4; now a 2009 Tacoma, V-6 4x4, 4.0 and towing package. With both happily pulled my Mac 26S from Sacramento, CA to the Puget Sound and across the Mohave over to lake Havasu in Arizona (easier and steadier over the hills with the newer model).
Cheers,
Albert, s/v Madelon

I tow with my Chevy Duramax 2500HD and you would never know the boat was behind you. I posted the photo of my VW diesel pickup with the boat hooked up to it as a joke a couple months ago but only use it to move the boat around in the yard.

 

[justsomeguy]

Initially a 2003 Toyota Tacoma V-6, 4x4, 3.4; now a 2009 Tacoma, V-6 4x4, 4.0 and towing package. With both happily pulled my Mac 26S from Sacramento, CA to the Puget Sound and across the Mohave over to lake Havasu in Arizona (easier and steadier over the hills with the newer model).
Cheers,
Albert, s/v Madelon

Thanks, Albert. I no longer feel so alone! My older 4x4 Taco has been weathering the miles reasonably well. Just keep an eye on the brakes and the traffic. Tomorrow, Lake Pleasant! It should be a less hilly route.