Reefing technique on selden in-mast furling system

[sandiegosailor99]

I'm new to the world of in-mast furling and could use some advice. I just bought a Hunter 380 with an in-mast furling system and took her out for her maiden voyage last weekend in San Diego. I transported the boat from the east coast. The sails are like new and the boat was just re-commissioned and tuned by the finest rigger in San Diego. On Thursday, winds were light and my son and I took the main out with the outhaul, after slackening the Main In/Main Out lines. The main deployed beautifully with the power winch. Had a great sail and then pulled the main back in with the Main In, while the outhaul was slackened.
The next day we were going along nicely with the main fully deployed and just past Point Loma were hit with 30 knot winds. We struggled a bit with the lines to get the boat under control efficiently. Is the proper reefing technique to slacken the outhaul, reel in the main-in to an acceptable reef point, then adjust and tighten the outhaul? It's a bit confusing with the Main-in Main-out continuous loop.
Any help would be appreciated. I know it's just a matter of playing with it, but I'd like to know what other sailors with this rig do to reef.

 

[Rick486]

I have marks on the foot of the sail for reef points. We ease the main until it luffs then crank in the sail with the furling line until the desired mark is up to the mast. I do the furling while my crew maintains a light tension on the outhaul. BTW, we NEVER use the power winch to do anything with the furling main. Why? In the event it gets stuck one could seriously damage the rig before realizing it.

 

[uncledom]

I'm assuming this is a Selden furling main. First thing I do when the wind whips up is go forward and "lock" the furling drum. This allows the main to be furled in but not out. Then follow Rick's instructions, ease outhaul and furl.

 

[Stu Jackson]

The Selden system handbook has been linked to here on this and on other boating forums many times. If you don't have it, with a little work on your part you should be able to find it, it's very good.

IIRC, tension on the outhaul is required when furling, doesn't sound like you did that.

 

[HernandoBeacher]

Good advice from uncledom! I also keep the furling drum on "locked" if the wind might kick up. The tricky part for me is to partially deploy the main in heavy winds where you are winching the outhaul and maintaining tension of the continuous loop line so that the full main doesn't self deploy. Definitely easier with two crew members on board.

 

[dehler25]

I have a Selde'n as well and do not have marks, how did you determine where the appropriate reefs go. I have a new laminate on order and would like to make that determination.

 

[shemandr]

So far as I remember my sail on the 356, the marks were just a reference. I don't think there was any re-enforcement at each. You can roll up whatever amount makes your boat handle well. But, like a furling jib there is a point at which the sail deepens to a point that it isn't really depowered anymore. I'd say that's somewhere around 2/3 deployed.

 

[seadaddler]

When sailing and need to reef I quick point into the wind furl in the main to where I know is a good reef point for the wind speed and than wrap the continous line around the winch real tight and I am good to go.
After many times of sailing out in different wind speed I reef and say 15 knots or 20 knots and mark
the boom for different wind speed and usually don't reef until after 15 and at at 20 knots I have a mark on the boom for that.
Nick

 

[Dan_Y]

There are two reef marks on the foot of my main as well and I have wondered if they match up to the percentages typically used for the first and second reef points in a slab reefing system (75 & 50% ?). Our dealer stressed to move the furling winch from the free position to the ratchet position when reefing and when sailing reefed, and to keep the rope clutches on the continuous line engaged to help take up the load since it's on the gear train an bearings at the head and tack. When not reefed, the foil is allowed to bend in against the mast slot for support over most of the luff. Being on about a 5-10 degree starboard tack helps with reefing due to the slot obstruction.

Earlier this month I had the boom (clew) a little to high I think now, trying to get nice even wrap when reefing and furling. It looked good and was not hard to do. But the next time out the main jammed with about 1/3 of the sail out in 15-20. Part of the furled sail wraps were trying to get out of the mast opening along with the sail. I spent about 15 minutes finally getting the excess sail wraps back in the slot and the main fully out.

Now I completely ease the topping lift and let the boom sit on the boom kicker (no gas shock in the kicker) to maintain better leech tension during reefing and furling. That seems to eliminate the jamming. BTW- That was our 4th sail and I did not have a plan for "jammed mast furler". I used the mast winch to gently take up the excess wraps while changing the boom angle and outhaul tension. Would have taken less time if the admiral could have helped but we need a helmsman to steer dead to wind and 10deg starboard tack and dodge freighters and markers. It really sucked for a few minutes there. My plan is on a calm day in the slip to pull out the main and experiment with boom angle and leech tension until I find a reliable combination for this sail. The slip holder next to me said he once had to go partway up the mast while at sea to clear a jam. The furling foil is properly tensioned per the excellent Selden book that Stu cited, and the main halyard was properly tensioned too. I know sailors swear by in-mast furling... it's just my inexperience showing!

 

[seadaddler]

I don't use the topping lift to support the boom and let the boom rest on the rod kicker no gas
and so the topping lift is there maybe in light air to lift if needed.
My boom is always resting on the selden boom kicker and was adjusted like that from dealer when brand new and never have a jam unless 1 or 2 times got sloppy and did not make sure I kept
tension on the outhaul when furling in.
Nick

 

[uncledom]

Dan, call Selden and order a piston for that vang. Then you can set up the old topping lift to be a spare halyard and use the vang as more than a kick stand for the boom.

 

[seadaddler]

$$$$$$ for that gas shock and the amount of times really need in light wind maybe.
Nick

 

[Dan_Y]

Have been considering the piston for the vang but haven't priced it yet. Sounds like I'm in for sticker shock. BTW, I did not have the vertical batten in when it jammed. I'm also wondering if the sail could be blown out a bit and increasing the chance of not getting it furled correctly. The Dacron seems to be much lighter it seems on in mast furling than a traditional rig. I had to have about 10 inches of the leech removed (leech now cut like the leech on a Genoa) due to sun damage. Apparently PO moored with a southern exposure on mast slot and sail wasn't ever dropped for the winter. Sail maker said this was somewhat common then mumbled something about lazy owners...haha. You could tear the sun damaged sail with your fingers! New sails are near the top of the list.

 

[seadaddler]

I have UK sails and recently had the sail repaired due to stitching coming a part
and did also have a little recut.
My boat is a 2007 and never really had any jamming problems and also do not have battens.
I have been racing the last few years and feel while racing put much more pressure on my sails
and most likely added to the sails needing repairs but have been very happy with the sails.
Nick

 

[Rick486]

I'm assuming this is a Selden furling main. First thing I do when the wind whips up is go forward and "lock" the furling drum. This allows the main to be furled in but not out. Then follow Rick's instructions, ease outhaul and furl.

Yes. I forgot that step. We also lock it in Rachet first.

 

[Rick486]

I have a Selde'n as well and do not have marks, how did you determine where the appropriate reefs go. I have a new laminate on order and would like to make that determination.

Just experimentation. I did a rough calc based on sail dimensions and just placed adhesive tape on the foot in those locations.

 

[sandiegosailor99]

This is all great information. I'm starting to get more comfortable with this rig. Thanks for all your posts.

 

[artboas]

On my 49, I'm very cautious about furling when the wind spikes up. I never like to furl with load on the sail. For the extra few minutes it takes, I bring the boat up to wind, depower the main, and furl.

 

[planoron]

Well I will chime in a bit. I had to have my old main recut due to some jamming but believe part of the problem was the boom angle. When ordering my new sail I checked the specs on the owners manual and it called for an angle on the mast of 83 degrees. The previous owner had reworked the topping lift and it was basically worthless. I reworked it with a new line and included the 2:1 single block on the end of the boom. The angle we had been trying to work with was way off after I had somebody work on it and had the boom almost resting on the arch. I have marked the topping line at the cleat for easy reference. I honestly do not find any reason to make an adjustment but should somebody want to really do some sail tuning for a race we would know where the lift needs to be for reefing in.

When it comes to reefing the sail in, personally, rather than having the sail flogging free and just using the outhaul for tension, have somebody maintain the helm so that there is a slight angle of backpreasure against the sail pinning it to the roll inside the mast. This helps make a nice pack and keeps the sail from dragging over the starboard slot.

Other items: Grease annually and be careful of the tension on your main halyard. The tack loop just needs to rest in the hook. By pulling it in tight you are just stressing the rig and adding resistance.

 

[Sailm8]

I have an older sail and need to use the leech line sometimes to reduce flapping. If I forget to ease the leach before furling I have a better than even chance of a jam. The upper part of the main will fold over going in and cause a jam. FWIW