Arrgh, M25 Engine Alternator Bracket Upgrade Craziness

Feb 26, 2004
22,775
Catalina 34 224 Maple Bay, BC, Canada
So, I read this on another forum today
M-18 M-25 Alternator bracket changeout
I've read numerous articles regarding the faulty bracket which secures the alternator to the engine. Ours is a 1987 M-25 which has the old bracket. I've since purchased the replacement parts which did not come with any instructions. I found a procedure on-line with photos to follow how to do the changeout. It seems a bit tedious. I'd like some input from some owners here. This seems to be rather important considering the potential damage which can occur. Should I proceed with this or ignore it and hope it doesn't happen to me? Some words of wisdom would be appreciated. We've had our boat for 14 yrs. The current bracket seems fine...SO FAR!

****************************
I couldn't help myself ---
Yes, do it. What's your entire engine worth to you?
This includes a link to Maine Sail's excellent article, as well as to one I wrote back in 1999, when I had the bracket replacement ON MY BOAT, as yet uninstalled, and the old bracket broke!
Alignment is critical.
So is getting the correct pivot bolt and arm bolts for your alternator.
http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,7917.0.html
In my case, I did NOT have to remove the entire manifold, plus my studs were short but still long enough to hold the new bracket.
If you don't have to remove the manifold, it's a rather simple task.
I helped a good friend do his on his M25 on his E32. We had to remove the old studs on his, they were too short, but MS's article explains how to do that. URBAN MYTH: many say that you have to take off the manifold if you have to remove the old studs. Not true.

HERE'S ANOTHER REASON TO DO THIS:
I have a good friend with an M25XP. He neglected his raw water pump and it leaked all over his engine. He had to replace his oil pan. He also just learned his timing gear cover is shot, rusted though. Now here's the part that oughta interest you: they don't make these engines anymore. The timing belt cover is no longer available.
They are difficult, if not impossible to find.

So, WHEN, not if, your alternator bracket fails catastrophically because it is a casting, and it RUINS your timing cover, you will have $7,000 to $12,000 to spend on a new engine.

All because it was too "tedious" to do four hours of work for a $200 replacement bracket.
Why people ask...
But, you and another Ericson owner have figured: "It's been working so far, why bother?"

Yeah, right...

Why ask?

For the past 25 years many, many skippers have been URGING other skippers to DO THIS.
We're not doing it 'cuz we feel better that you DON'T.
C'mon...
Please excuse me for my exuberance about this issue, but we have seen altogether too many skippers who have lost their entire engines because they didn't know about this issue. Now we're "exposed" to one who KNOWS it exists and is asking whether he should do it.
NAHHH, why bother???
 
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Feb 6, 1998
11,669
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
It is pretty amazing that someone would buy the bracket then choose not do the upgrade. That mounting ear suffers from fatigue and when, not if, it finally fails the engine may be scrap metal.

The timing gear case for the M-25 is NO LONGER AVAILABLE.... So many of them broke they simply ran out of parts stock and are not making any more.

If it breaks your engine is now junk......

The actual engine in my article suffered a broken timing gear case, but the boat yard that fixed it, for 3K, still used the old bracket.......:doh:


Universal M-18 & M-25 Alternator Bracket Upgrade (LINK)


BTW Universal/Westerbeke published the service bulletin on this major problem back in April of 1991. How there are any of these engines still out there that have ignored this is beyond me but I still come across two to three per year....:doh:
 
Aug 31, 2007
296
Catalina 30 Petoskey, Mich.
I waited to long :(

I also heard of this upgrade and never did it till I had to. I was very lucky to be able to repair the timing cover, a chunk broke out of it, but a nice clean break left me able to JB weld it back into place. The new bracket mounts in a different spot so no further stress will be placed on the break.
I did have to pull the manifold and struggled with a couple of the studs but I stepped back a couple times and won the battle. Here are a couple pics of the the hole in the timing cover and the piece still on the bracket. Sorry no pics of the repairs and alternate mounting locations used in the repair.

Dean
blowinganddrifting@yahoo.com
 

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Feb 6, 1998
11,669
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
I also heard of this upgrade and never did it till I had to. I was very lucky to be able to repair the timing cover, a chunk broke out of it, but a nice clean break left me able to JB weld it back into place. The new bracket mounts in a different spot so no further stress will be placed on the break.
I did have to pull the manifold and struggled with a couple of the studs but I stepped back a couple times and won the battle. Here are a couple pics of the the hole in the timing cover and the piece still on the bracket. Sorry no pics of the repairs and alternate mounting locations used in the repair.

Dean
blowinganddrifting@yahoo.com
Dean,

Those pictures are the gold mine!!!!

Would you mind if I used the image of your broken timing gear case in my article to help drive the point home?

The only pictures I have were taken at 34F and my camera lens fogged after I pulled it from my warm pocket. I did not know it until I got home & by then the timing gear case was in the dumpster and long gone. I also never through to snap a shot of the old alt and bracket with the timing gear ear in its mouth!!!

A full res image would be great if you would not mind.;)

compassmarineservices at gmail dot com

As always I will give you full photo credit, or not, if you don't want that...
 
Feb 26, 2004
22,775
Catalina 34 224 Maple Bay, BC, Canada
Re: Arrgh, M25 engine alternator bracket replacement stupidi

Josh, if you click on the link in my initial post, you'll find a link to my original alternator bracket repair topic. What the heck, here it is: http://www.c34.org/wiki/index.php?title=M-25_Alternator_Mount_Conversion_Kit_"B/M_256891"

It includes pictures of the old bracket, broken in pieces.

If your bracket is ABOVE the alternator, then yes. The initial post's link shows the new bracket, as does Maine Sail's superb article.
 
Aug 31, 2007
296
Catalina 30 Petoskey, Mich.
Re: Arrgh, M25 engine alternator bracket replacement stupidi

hey mainsail, send me an email and I will return the photos there, feel free to use them all you want, I will go to your links and try to send themthere too.
Dean
 
Feb 26, 2004
22,775
Catalina 34 224 Maple Bay, BC, Canada
I shifted my alternator bracket mount based on Maine Sail's article (he used one of my pictures showing how bad it was before I did this).

Here's the followup picture, shows the shims on the connection to the engine, too.

Thanks, Maine Sail.
 

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Feb 6, 1998
11,669
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
I shifted my alternator bracket mount based on Maine Sail's article (he used one of my pictures showing how bad it was before I did this).

Here's the followup picture, shows the shims on the connection to the engine, too.

Thanks, Maine Sail.
Looks much better Stu! You should have less belt dust issues now...
 
Jan 10, 2015
130
. . Pensacola, FL
Stu, I tried to read the markings on the belt, but could you tell me what make/size of belt that is?
 
Jan 10, 2015
130
. . Pensacola, FL
Thanks much, Stu!

BTW, after I asked in my post above, I realized this thread was a year old, almost to the day...glad you still saw my question! (shoulda looked closer and saw the post dates were March 2014, not 15)
 
Oct 16, 2013
2
Catalina 36mk1 LaSalle,Mi
Have only owned my boat for three years and learned of this a short time ago on this forum. Just received upgrade kit and will start this project today. Thank you all for your advice and sharing.
 
May 20, 2016
3,014
Catalina 36 MK1 94 Everett, WA
The 36 (hull # 94 1983) I just acquired, did not have this mod yet (also only had half of the trailer disconnect replaced). The PO barely avoided the disaster, and his solution was to weld the timing cover back together and use the same alternator bracket that broke the cover in the first place. My studs are too short I'm hoping I can get enough kroil down the stud that I can get it off without pulling the manifold -- Does anyone know the correct torque values - I couldn't find anything specific... Thanks

Les
 
Sep 15, 2016
25
Catalina 30 Newport, RI
Is there any reason to drain the coolant if your studs are long enough to remove and replace with the new/longer studs?
 
Sep 15, 2016
25
Catalina 30 Newport, RI
So, to answer my own question: Yes, you have to drain the manifold if only removing the studs for the alternator bracket fix. I did not find this described elsewhere. It turns out that the studs actually provide a seal, preventing the coolant inside from escaping.

I learned this because I did empty the coolant before removing the studs but there was enough coolant leftover in the manifold that it still came out of the stud hole.

I an abundance of caution, I plan to turnover the engine with the decompression lever lifted before trying a full start.