Traveler Upgrade for Beneteau 311

[CapitalistSailor]

Capitalist Sailor,
I know you replaced the lines, but which size line did you install? I had a similar problem but used a slightly smalller line and it is so much better. Used a better quality line as well. Less friction.

Cymeyer, when I replaced the traveler lines, I used some good double braid polyester I had leftover from rigging up lazy jacks. The line is about 1 1/2 sizes smaller than what was on the traveler, so perhaps 1 size smaller than the original. Even so, the replacement line is a snug fit getting through the bottom sheave on the traveler ends. The line fits fine on the traveler car sheaves.

 

[cymeyer]

Cymeyer, when I replaced the traveler lines, I used some good double braid polyester I had leftover from rigging up lazy jacks. The line is about 1 1/2 sizes smaller than what was on the traveler, so perhaps 1 size smaller than the original. Even so, the replacement line is a snug fit getting through the bottom sheave on the traveler ends. The line fits fine on the traveler car sheaves.

Are these of good quality (ie bend easily)?

 

[CapitalistSailor]

Are these of good quality (ie bend easily)?

Yes, the lines were good quality and reasonably supple.

 

[CapitalistSailor]

I was able to visit the boat for a couple hours on Thursday between snow storms. After I replaced a number of snapped lines on the cover, I fooled around with the traveler lines and took a look at the sheaves as discovered and reported by stevemitchell on March 9. I found my sheaves to be in better shape than his, but with the 4:1 purchase there was too much resistance in both the line and in the sheaves. The old line line appeared to have been a 3/8" line that had swollen to about 7/16" with age, and the replacement line I installed was about 3/8" double braid polyester, something like Sta-Set. But it looks like the sheaves are really made for 1/4" line (or perhaps 5 mm, 1 mm smaller). I tried some 1/4" line I had on hand, and it seems to be the maximum size that will comfortably fit the sheaves. Also, the line needs to be very flexible, as the sheaves are small with a tight turning radius for the line (as alluded to by cymeyer above).

Some of the sheaves spun fairly freely, and others turned easily but would not spin, even in the 40 degree weather. I found some replacement sheaves and bushings on eBay (size 2 Lewmar), but I'd really like to upgrade to ball bearing sheaves. The 2014 and 2015 Lewmar catalogs for spares show an option for size 2 NTR traveler parts that have ball bearings, but I have not yet located a source. I will have to call Lewmar and see what they suggest (see Lewmar parts 29432372BK and 29472076BK). The Lewmar traveler upgrade kit contains only roller bearings. Lewmar part 29472012BK appears to be something like the original sheaves.

I think Lewmar upgraded to the ball bearing sheaves a couple years after my boat was made in 2000. The 323 was the next model and its parts catalog shows a picture of a traveler with ball bearings, although the parts numbers are not listed.

Thank you everyone for your help on this project. We're getting there.

 

[CapitalistSailor]

Greetings all. I ended up buying two upgraded traveler ends from Lewmar via APS (Annapolis Performance Sailing) for 20% off list. I'll buy some new, smaller line also and see how it all works. If there is too much friction still, I'll replace the sheaves on the traveler car. The Lewmar ends come with beckets, so I have the option to go to 5:1 (from 4:1) if I can move the beckets to the traveler car.

Here's a link to the new cars: https://www.lewmar.com/node/11973?v=26108

 

[Jackdaw]

I'm sure it would work better with new rope, which it had at one point, but it still is woefully undersized purchase for such a gigantic mainsail. Two hands won't really solve the issue. I suspect that is why a similar sail-planned boat, the 323, has a better purchase system.

Its interesting to note that all these boats suffer much larger minsheet/traveler loads due to the mid-boom sheeting. The loads are almost DOUBLE what they would be with end-boom sheeting.

It complicated the cockpit when cruising, but that is where God intended it.

 

[JRT]

Its interesting to note that all these boats suffer much larger minsheet/traveler loads due to the mid-boom sheeting. The loads are almost DOUBLE what they would be with end-boom sheeting.

It complicated the cockpit when cruising, but that is where God intended it.

This are great nuggets I really appreciate picking up on as I learn and try improve my sailing and future boat shopping options.

 

[Gunni]

The becket is for a block that turns the traveler line and sends it to the cabin top where you can clutch it. Very convenient upgrade.

 

[CapitalistSailor]

The becket is for a block that turns the traveler line and sends it to the cabin top where you can clutch it. Very convenient upgrade.

Gunni, the traveler lines now originate at the traveler ends. The lines are now anchored to one of the mounting screws for the traveler ends and track. I was thinking of using the beckets on the new traveler ends to tie off the ends of the (replacement) lines, or possibly move the beckets to the traveler car (if they fit) and tie the lines off there. I have cam cleats at the traveler ends, which are on the cabin top at the front of the companionway.

 

[CapitalistSailor]

APS failed me. I received just 1 traveler end from APS-Lewmar, and after a few calls they are telling me that the $155 is just for 1 traveler end and not 2, despite getting the quotes from 2 different people at APS. I'm sending it all back. $300+ is too much to pay when I can replace the whole system for $500. I may just buy some replacement sheaves for <$50 and see what that gets me.

The APS guy put me onto guy who hand makes replacement sheaves for all kinds of hard to find items, like mast and boom sheaves: zephyrwerks.com

 

[Gunni]

nice source for custom sheaves! Titanium marlinspikes!

 

[CapitalistSailor]

I was out at the boat on Friday and took off one of the traveler ends and removed one of the sheaves. I compared the traveler end to the new one I bought (see above postings). It seems that the existing traveler is smaller than size 2, probably size 1 based on measuring the sheaves and the track and comparing the measurements to those in a 2014 catalog. The new size 2 traveler fits loosely over the track with no need to slide it in from the end. I also notice that the fit of the bushing in the existing sheave was pretty sloppy, so I will look into ordering replacement sheaves and bushings.

Another possibility is that Lewmar changed the sizing and numbering of its travelers after my boat was built in 2000.

I also noticed that the stainless steel mounting screws were hard to back out of the aluminum traveler track and car. I didn't detect anything there to prevent galvanic corrosion, such as Tef-Gel, but probability whatever was there at installation has withered away. One the other hand I didn't observe any corrosion. I will reinstall with Tef-Gel or similar.

It seems that spring will never arrive. We had two warm, windy days. but it's getting cold again and just north of us and they got hammered with snow again. Flint, 120 miles north of here, had the most snow this winter ever recorded. The Lake Erie shore flooded this weekend due to high lake levels caused by gale winds from the northeast. Some local highways around Sandusky Bay were shut down, as well as my yacht club. We have rain and snow flurries forecast for the next two days.

 

[stevemitchell]

Somehow I stopped getting notifications for this thread...anyhow, I have been doing my own measurements and sleuthing and found some interesting things.

As far as I can tell, my boat has a size 1 Lewmar system - 23mm track is the only thing I am going on. I can find various spare or slightly upgraded parts at APS and Maui Sail but I am not 100% sure I want to go that way.

The main reason is the specs. A size 1 says its max sail size mid-boom is 226 square feet. My 311 has 277 square feet of mainsail according to the specs, so we're already over that spec.

I am contemplating replacing the entire setup with a size 2 system which says it can handle 410 square foot of mainsail at mid-boom.

The other irritating thing I found is that the PO for some reason sacrificed one of the three blocks under the boom that go to the traveler/mainsheet assembly. Why he did this was beyond me, but you add that up plus the undersized traveler, and it is no wonder I have a devil of a time controlling this big mainsail.

For that mess, I will likely just add the block back, and change out the traveler car assembly, but if I find a better overall solution with the size 2 system, that could change.

 

[CapitalistSailor]

I have ordered a set of replacement sheaves and bushings from an eBay seller in the UK. I’ll disassemble and clean out the whole system, put in the new sheaves, add new, smaller lines, and see what happens.

I wonder what lubricant I should use on the sheaves and bushings?

 

[Jackdaw]

I wonder what lubricant I should use on the sheaves and bushings?

Any thing with rolling bearings, One Drop. You want the the bearings to ROLL, not SLIDE.

http://www.harken.com/productdetail.aspx?id=5480&taxid=372

 

[CapitalistSailor]

Jackdaw, just to be clear, do you mean One Drop for non-ball bearing sheaves? I’ve heard of using that lubricant for something like my traveler car with about 40 Torlon ball bearings in the track, but not roller bearings.