The New Hunter Experiernce

[Franklin]

$150,000. Um....wow....here is a 2010 model for 109,990 and it's already in Florida Now I bet HunterBlows is really upset :cussing:

http://www.boats.com/boat-details/Hunter-33/18084701

 

[Steve Walsh]

Long time lurker here, this situation was enough to get me to register. IMHO, the boat should have been commissioned by a FL Hunter dealer and I suspect Hunter has a program to handle such a situation when more than one dealer is involved. The result is one dealer pocketed all the revenues, in spite of the inevitable warranty claims a new boat seems to generate. As a national sales manager for industrial machinery, I know how hard it is in these times to share some of the revenue or pass a sale onto someone more capable of handling the after-sale support locally. Additionallly, I found it interesting that the dealer response was to paint the buyer as the bad guy, after they sold him 3 boats. Picky customer or not, he is the customer and has been dealing with this for months, instead of enjoying his new boat. The missing promotional payments seem to be a red flag. If the mfg was not making the payments as promised due the tough economy, that makes me wonder how much longer they can survive. At the very least, it should not take the Attorney General's office to get the checks moving. I can't imagine how the frustrated the buyer must feel, the thrill of buying a new boat must be long gone. I hope he can get it resolved before it ends up in the courts.

Steve W.

 

[Scott B]

$150,000. Um....wow....here is a 2010 model for 109,990 and it's already in Florida Now I bet HunterBlows is really upset :cussing:

http://www.boats.com/boat-details/Hunter-33/18084701

Franklin, read the rest of your link....



Price shown above is 2010 base price FOB factory. Model shown has a sailaway list price of $155,243 with additional Massey and factory options. Almost all Hunters can be viewed at our New Yacht Model Center just for current models on display and our Best Buy Pricing

 

[Franklin]

Yeah, you are right...I did miss that. But what options cost $35,000?

Not even sure these are options but I'll list them anyway:
AC - 2gs
frig - 1g
water header = .3gs

now for real options:

autopilot - .8 gs
anomiter - 1g
depth - .8gs
speed - .4gs
spinacker - 2gs
radar - 2gs
generator - 8gs (and I don't think that's included on his boat)

so now we are talking about a total of about 19-20Gs and I'm pretty sure we can eliminate 8 of that...so we are talking about 11-12 Gs.

 

[Scott B]

The Mariner package is around $ 8,300

In-Mast Furling, Refrigeration, Traveler on Arch, RayMarine ST-60 Upgrade, Helm Sheeting, Stereo System w/CD (incl. POD w/speakers), 29hp Engine Upgrade, Folding Wheel

 

[timvg]

Here's my take:

1. Anything that was on the boat when it left Hunter is Hunter's responsibility. Hopefully the owner of the new boat has a record of this.

2. If the new owner made a separate deal with the dealer for additional equipment, that's the dealer's responsibility.

3. If the above doesn't reach a satisfactory conculsion, Hunter would be nuts not to take care of ALL of the problems at their expense. I have a Hunter and have been satisfied with Hunter customer support, but this story alone would make me re-consider a new purchase if I was ever in the market. Bottom line, Hunter needs to stand behind its dealers and if a dealer messes up, Hunter should correct it.

4. If you actually think about this logically, it would be cheaper for Hunter to just give the guy a new boat. They will lose a lot more than $150,000 from bad publicity. Bad publicity will more than offset any dollars that Hunter puts into the fix. Hopefully, they'res mart enough to realize that.

 

[Scott B]

Tim, of all the new Hunters that are sold, I can only assume most would have problems to be dealt with after delivery, as any new boat from any manufacturer. The biggest issue I see here, IMHO, is a dealer trying to commission a new boat long distance. It's difficult to deal with problems when the boat is at a fair distance. It sounds to me like the dealer and Hunter are trying to resolve the issues.

 

[Franklin]

I agree with the fellow poster that pointed out that Hunter can't find the money to live up to make payments it promised on. That sounds like a cash flow problem which can lead to bankruptsy. We've lost enough manufactures already, don't need to lose another.

Then again, I'd have to re-think about that idea of building catamerans. I was considering building a 50' cat the way a live-aboard would want it (not designed to sleep 4 couples, but one couple very comfortable with a couple of crew mildly comfortable). I figured I'd put in about 80gs of material, and then sale it for 150gs. I'd also sail it from boat show to boat show and my motto would be "Not only do I build it, I sail it too before I sale it."

 

[seadaddler]

Who's the Blame

I am not pointing my finger at who dropped the ball but let me tell you that I am the owner of a brand new 2007 H-36 that I ordered in 2006 with plenty of options and also did buy a new 2001 290 Hunter in Virginia while living in NY and would still buy a new Hunter again because both dealers went above and beyond any complaints I had and yes things were not right but they did what it took to make every thing wright even when the dealer goofed with things he promised that were forgotten he made wright,when the boat reached NY from Virginia a salt water leak was found by me months later so I called the dealer and he called Hunter and they called me to have it hauled an fixed which Hunter paid for the repair.
I traded my 290 in for a2007 H-36 and just so you know the boat was shipped to CT.from Florida and it has no batteries the dealer adds them and the mast is wrapped in plastic and the dealer has to assembly all the parts because the mast is completely naked and the arch is not mounted and the dealer had a lot of things to put together and than check it all out and do test every thing to make sure all is wright.
How do I know all this because I was there when it was delivered in Jan 07 and than went back to the dealer when it was being commissioned in April,I stayed on the boat when it went into the water,my step son lives in CT.and I was retired so it was easy to see how every thing went together,I was at the Marina of the dealer to also watch a lot of Hunters of all sizes get commissioned I even got a chance to go sailing on some of these other Hunters bigger and smaller that were being commissioned,it was a great experience and learned a lot watching the riggers set these boats up and seeing what go's into getting these boats ready for the new owners.
The dealers job is to correct any mistakes that are made at the factory by the workers,I also went to the factory in Florida and got a tour of how new boats are made from making the hull to adding every thing else,I got to see first hand how the workers build and put together all the parts that make these boats from 33 to 49 and what another experience that was walking through that amazing factory.
Yes mistakes are made some times but most are corrected by the dealer which I believe Hunter pays them to make every thing wright.
All I know is some things had to be corrected by the dealer and when my boat was ready to take her home they the dealer walked me through a pre delivery check list 82 lines of things to check plus we went through every piece of equipment test it it all worked correctly and all doors and knobs worked correctly,it took about 5 hours or more we even stopped for lunch it was so long as we checked every thing on the both,one copy for me and one for Hunter and one for the dealers record all signed by me and the dealer,what else can they Hunter do to make sure the customer is completely happy,plus a 90 day service checkup no charge.
I would buy a hunter again.
Nick

 

[petersea]

Just some of my thoughts

Customer Complaint;

8.The air conditioning has very little airflow and does not cool the cabin (77deg with a 79deg outside temp, 81 with an 88 deg outside temp)
Dealer response:

"Just before July 4 Mr. Lindou had another problem with the air conditioning, Racine Riverside again called SGP Yacht Care to fix and he did. After 4 of July Mr. Lindou’s air problem returned. One thing that needs to be said is that Tom tends to like it very cold in his house car and boat. "
Angelica M. Vasquez
Consumer Specialist
RE: FILE 516827

Ms. Vasquez,
Not sure where you were going with that response but to blame the customer because he like it cold! Your response is insulting to every one who took the time to read it. It also just put your credibility to zero, the customer complaint would appear very valid if that is your reply. Either it works correctly or it does not ! Just as info for you my boats a/c will hold 70 degrees on a 98 degree day ! !



SEADADDLER,

" I bought my 2007 H-36 in CT and would buy again from them and Hunter,my boat never left the dealers slips until I was completely happy with everything."



Just as info, Seadaddler, your dealer is out of business. ! ! I know you bought your boat from the previous owners but just recently the new owners of SS shut the doors ! BIG BIG discounts on all the bank owned new models !! Just as info.........


This almost sounds like it would be a good boat for Hunter to "purchase" back and repair to resell in its certified "used " boat models ( I forget the name of the factory program ). Refund the money to the original purchaser and get away from this customer service, reputation destroying nightmare.


Edited 10/07/09

I will stand corrected on my comments and redirect them to the Racine Riverside Marine owners...with my appoligies to Ms. Vasquez.

Peter, Angela Vasquez is the person the letter is addressed TO, by the dealership, Brad Strand Mark Hetzel Mark Monroe
Owners, Racine Riverside Marine

 

[Scott B]

Customer Complaint;

8.The air conditioning has very little airflow and does not cool the cabin (77deg with a 79deg outside temp, 81 with an 88 deg outside temp)
Dealer response:

"Just before July 4 Mr. Lindou had another problem with the air conditioning, Racine Riverside again called SGP Yacht Care to fix and he did. After 4 of July Mr. Lindou’s air problem returned. One thing that needs to be said is that Tom tends to like it very cold in his house car and boat. "
Angelica M. Vasquez
Consumer Specialist
RE: FILE 516827

Ms. Vasquez,
Not sure where you were going with that response but to blame the customer because he like it cold! Your response is insulting to every one who took the time to read it. It also just put your credibility to zero, the customer complaint would appear very valid if that is your reply. Either it works correctly or it does not ! Just as info for you my boats a/c will hold 70 degrees on a 98 degree day ! !



SEADADDLER,

" I bought my 2007 H-36 in CT and would buy again from them and Hunter,my boat never left the dealers slips until I was completely happy with everything."



Just as info, Seadaddler, your dealer is out of business. ! ! I know you bought your boat from the previous owners but just recently the new owners of SS shut the doors ! BIG BIG discounts on all the bank owned new models !! Just as info.........


This almost sounds like it would be a good boat for Hunter to "purchase" back and repair to resell in its certified "used " boat models ( I forget the name of the factory program ). Refund the money to the original purchaser and get away from this customer service, reputation destroying nightmare.

Peter, Angela Vasquez is the person the letter is addressed TO, by the dealership, Brad Strand Mark Hetzel Mark Monroe
Owners, Racine Riverside Marine

I also do not understand what the closing of a dealership that Sedadaddler purchased his boat from, has to do with this discussion. Many dealers, good and bad have closed for various reasons. Has nothing to do with the service he recieved from the dealer or Hunter or the problems the OP is having.

 

[petersea]

Scott B

As far a Seadaddler's dealer going out of business I was just passing that info on to him, maybe not directly part of the discussion but I thought he may be interested in it. Especially since he would purchase a boat from them again but that will not happen. I stated twice it was just for info....

As far as Ms. Vasquez, maybe I mis-read it as it started out "dear hunter owners" and her name was below that, she did not identify her signature as being with Hunter Marine. It also appears to be a defense of how this situation was handled by the corporation and dealer. There were several reference to the owner and almost making it sounds like it was his demands that were wrong. Either things work correctly or not ! Either way both are at fault and should hang their heads in shame for how this situation has been handled. Certainly she can't put all the blame on the dealer ! ! And if she does it is their dealer !! The dealer represents them ! Not real sure to include the dealers letter was appropriate. It did not help Hunter's position in my opinion.
Could all the service people/vendors who went to work on the boat be wrong in that Hunter will only pay a certain amount for repairs ? This is not the first time I have heard that. Both Racine Marine and Hunter have egg on their faces on this one. Hunter needs to step up and solve this NOW !



Edited 10/07/09

I will stand corrected on my comments and redirect them to the Racine Riverside Marine owners...with my appoligies to Ms. Vasquez.

Peter, Angela Vasquez is the person the letter is addressed TO, by the dealership, Brad Strand Mark Hetzel Mark Monroe
Owners, Racine Riverside Marine

 

[seadaddler]

Too Bad

I am sorry to hear SS has closed and all the people working there are out of a job,I think they had just changed owners partners when my boat was purchased,the economy is hurting every one.
I think the dealer in this case most likely ran into trouble when the boat was shipped to Florida and had the commissioning done out side his dealership area
and not where his crew works,that's what it sounds like what happen I think because the customer purchased two other boats from them and he was happy with the work he did at the home dealer area or he would not have purchased another new boat from him.
When I purchased my new H-36 I new I would be in my dealers area for two years before sailing to Florida and any problems if any would be done before going to Florida where I now live.
My H-36 did a great job sailing from NY to Fort Pierce FL ,9 days with 2 days stop over in NC,the Autopilot did stop working after 5 days 24/7 in rough seas out in the ocean,Raymarine did replace it for me,I than sailed from Fort Pierce around the keys in 5 days with no problems to Punta Gorda.
People are always coming by at my Marina remarking what a beautiful boat I have and friends love going out sailing on her with us.
Nick

 

[Phil Herring]

I want to point out that the letter posted by the dealer was written to the Better Business Bureau in response to the buyer's complaint. It obviously was not written for public disclosure.

Also note: neither the dealer nor Hunter is refusing to resolve these problems, and in some cases they have gone above and beyond what they might be legally obligated to do.

I'm not saying the owner is wrong, and the boat clearly has problems, but there are always two sides to these stories. In my experience, people who file BBB complaints and post long rants to multiple web sites are not so likely to tell a fair and balanced tale.

The sad thing is, most of this could have been avoided if the boat was purchased in Florida. As suggested above, you don't take delivery until all these systems work properly and you have a local source of warranty service. IMHO, the customer and the dealer both made the same error by delivering the boat someplace they aren't.

 

[gmeyerga]

There have been repeated comments recently in this forum about inferior
quality of the NEW Hunters (see, for example, the discussion about changing from lead to steel keels). Many of the problems Mr.Lindou has encountered are
systemic and do not bode well for Hunter. Moreover, I find it almost callous to suggest to a repeat customer of Hunter he should have known to engage a surveyer before accepting a new boat from Hunter. Now, of course, we know
that.

 

[KD3PC]

I take exception to the reports of "inferior quality" of Hunter (and others makers) on the board. WHile the original poster certainly had/has his share of things to contend with, many have nothing to do with the inherent quality of the boat or the maker.

High expectations and misinformation lead many buyers to expect perfection. Perfection does not exist. The buyer should and could of, investigated many of these "issues" prior to purchase. For example, I am sure that any hunter dealer will allow a serious buyer to examine closely the anchor well, hatch, placement and such and will likely - for a fee - redo/replace/redesign or point you to another model of their boat.

This has been true whether one talks about the hull, the electronics, the keel, the appliances, etc. It is not really fair to pin on the manufacturer, especially one that produces mass market boats at a specific price point.

Were this a conversation about a custom builder, perhaps the critique has merit. But this is hunter, one of the largest builders and anyone can see the boats and their quality (or lack there of, in some opinions) and how well they hold up.

Sadly the comment about hiring a surveyor is a reality anyone who is buying a NEW boat must assess for himself. I used one in 1999 when buying a NEW Beneteau 36CC. When I was going to buy a catamaran, new, last year, I was told in NO uncertain terms that it would not be allowed, I took my business elsewhere and bought a used Hunter. Is the knowledge a surveyor has worth the $$ to you the buyer.

There are quality, commissioning, and expectation issues with any new boat. It is up to the dealer who sold the boat and behind him the manufacturer to make sure the customer has been treated fairly.

Given the information presented by the parties involved, there is more than one side of the story, and many expectations and emotions involved. If one thinks he can build a better boat and present a better delivered experience to a repeat customer, he is free to do so.

As a buyer of a new boat, it is truly caveat emptor whether that boat says Hunter, Swan, Beneteau, Tartan or any other maker on the paperwork...

all the best guys, heading to my ole' home away from home Hunter 42 for a few weeks R&R

 

[wundrbar]

kd3pc: I've never owned a large boat so I can't comment on your POV re whether or not it is reasonable to hire a surveyor when buying a new boat. However, a large number of us have purchased Hunter day sailors which mysteriously develop HUGE cracks when the temperature fluctuates. This is a defect in manufacturing that Hunter won't own up to. And when I now here of severe problems with their boats worth hundreds of thousands of dollars and missing promotional payments, I REALLY think people need to think long and hard before giving their business to Hunter Marine.

 

[KD3PC]

Wundr

hiring a surveyor has nothing to do with the size or cost of the boat.

you summed up my thoughts in your last sentence....I REALLY think people need to think long and hard before giving their business...to any one

even those of you who bought the 170s which use a new process, I guess, should have perhaps used a surveyor or at least researched the new technology.

I am currently doing that with West Systems to see FOR MYSELF, how it works (it does), what the support is like (awesome so far and I use it a lot - many mistakes so far). Education is not cheap, but they can not take it away from you. I have several hundred $$ in materials and even more in sand paper - all for a thousand dollar home made wooden skiff....but "I" will KNOW the details before I sink my money in a wooden boat that is encapsulated in west system...

hope this helps
dave

 

[Phil Herring]

Wunderbar, didn't they offer to fix your boat?

 

[wundrbar]

Yeah Phil: After telling the judge in small claims court that my boat was only worth $1,000 now (I think they wanted to minimize the limit of their damages) they later offered to fix my boat if I paid to ship it to Florida and back to my home. The cost would be $3,000 or more. I asked them if they thought it would be financially responsible for me to spend $3,000 to fix a boat they thought was worth only $1,000. They didn't respond to that question. And, BTW, having a Hunter representative tell a judge that my boat had depreciated over 90% in 9 years didn't sit well with me either!!