rudder removal while boat is in water

[qazvick]

Hey all,

First time poster here.

I have searched for a couple days now on this website and all through Google but I just cannot find a definitive answer on this.

It seems as if my rudder needs to be rebuilt. My question is, is it possible to remove it with the boat still in the water?

Any precautions I should take?

Thanks again for any help.

 

[Blaise]

It can be removed in the water but you are going to have to hang a ton of weight to it as it is very buoyant. It has been a long time since I did it, but I seem to remember about 30 pounds of dive weights and a couple of anchors.

 

[braol]

Don't do it. Your boat will fill with water so fast you won't know what happened. The only time I see this as feasible is if your rudder mounting tube (the part the rudder stock slides into) went all the way up to the deck above the water-line (like an old fashioned pump on a square-rigger). Such is not the case on our boats.

 

[ggrizzard]

Uh, the tube on my 30 goes up to the deck.

 

[Blaise]

I didn't take on any water.

 

[qazvick]

Anyone with a 33 cherub that has done this?

 

[qazvick]

Uh, the tube on my 30 goes up to the deck.

That doesn't look anything like my setup.

 

[Redbeard33]

the rudder configuration seems to vary quite a bit between years and models, your best bet is to upload a picture, it truly is worth a thousand words.....I have found that emailing a picture to yourself (via cell phone) and then uploading from your laptop to be the best way without involving a third device and related cords. But to the question, I would pull the boat if I had to rebuild the rudder as I believe my rudder set up is too close to the water line for me to feel ok leaving it out for a week, cant use the boat anyway so why not do it right?

 

[Jim Legere]

On the Hunter 37 cutter, the packing gland for the rudder stock is above the waterline. I suspect it is the same on most of the other Cherubini Hunters, but I think I would check first by loosening the packing and watching to see if any water comes in... The next issue is that rudders are generally designed to be neutrally buoyant, but rarely are in the real world. So its going to want to sink or float - each scenario presents different challenges. So, while it is probably possible to remove your rudder while afloat, hauling out to do rudder repairs is the best (although more expensive) option. If you are in a remote place with no facilities, it is likely that you can improvise and get the job done. It all comes down to risk management, IMHO.

 

[braol]

I would actually be more concerned with the installation. Anyone can loosen some bolts and manhandle something apart. The real challenge would be finessing the rudder back in...all while trying to maintain control...all while it is in the water. Oh, my kingdom for a pintle-mounted rudder and a full keel....

 

[fstbttms]

I would actually be more concerned with the installation. Anyone can loosen some bolts and manhandle something apart. The real challenge would be finessing the rudder back in...all while trying to maintain control...all while it is in the water.

Not a problem for a diver with a properly ballasted or bouyed rudder. Maybe a five minute job, really.

 

[qazvick]

Finally got some pics

 

[qazvick]

I have already begun periodically blasting it with PB Blaster.

 

[kloudie1]

Wow! That packing gland sure looks to be a smidge below the water level? You can figure it out by unhooking the seawater inlet at the pump and raising it or lowering it with the seacock open to find the level where the water comes out of the hose.. Use a level from that point to check if the top of the packing gland is above or below the water level with you back there.. Ya might have to put a drum of water on the bow to lift the packing gland? Pucker factor there is going to be 6-8 !

 

[Stephen Trapani]

Never removed my rudder, but I do know that the top of the tube is normally just above the waterline. This means that a variety of things can change that, wave action or an empty water tank (which is under the v-berth) for example, can push it below the waterline. If you weight down the bow significantly and stay away from heavy wave action, you should be enough above the waterline to not take on water.

When you get the nuts loosened you should be able to see how the boat is sitting and watch it taking on water over the top of the tube or not. The fun part will be doing all of this laying on your back in the quarterberth with your head upside down. Hopefully you're flexible! Get a cushion to lay on so the fiberglass lip of the bulkhead is not digging into your back the whole time! Have fun!

 

[qazvick]

Okie dokie! Finally got to it!

First off... After unbolting the steering and everything, The rudder fell right off and to the marina floor... like a rock. Guess it needs rebuilding.

Second... that rudder tube is absolutely NOT at or above the water line. It's more like 4 inches below and it gushed like all hell was breaking loose when the rudder dropped out. What I did do in the mean time is slide a radiator hose onto the rudder tube (hose clamped on), essentially raising the tube height to well above the water line.

Now I finally get to rebuild the rudder and install new rudder packing nuts. But, Im now out of town again for over a month. So, I'll see yall with an update in over 2 months! Ha!

But... figured yall would like to know that the rudder tube is well below the waterline.

 

[readerbill]

Thank you, very good to know

 

[braol]

I'd look for a good fiberglass worker at your yard and pay to have it foamed and glassed. It can take a LONG time and a lot of finesse to refoam a rudder and then glas it right. I'm not saying that you don't have the skills to do it...it's just the time involved is way off the scale.....unless you're done for the season. I cracked into my rudder this spring, thinking I'd need to refoam the majority of it. Lucky for me, once I ground down into a few of the cracks in the fiberglass I was able to reach virgin foam without too much difficulty. I simply filled the now-ground-down cracks with highly viscous epoxy, painted the areas with Interprotect, then heavy leveling primer and then Bottomkote. The area around the rudderpost was hard to get to, but I put some epoxy on there also with paint and such and then applied a healthy dose of sealant. I'll evaluate things this fall when she comes out of the water, but it'll be good to go. I wish you luck in your rudder adventure!

 

[Stephen Trapani]

And I'm not sure what's going on with his boat, but in my '79 H33, the rudder tube is definitely not below the water line. What could be causing his to be so low?

 

[MLampner]

A lot of large people sitting in the stern? Kidding aside a couple things are going to effect that how much fuel is aboard, has the boat had the engine replaced, in my case my new engine weighed slightly less than the original. Are there davits and even a dinghy hanging back there.

Over all loading to effects the waterline when we go out for a week the boat sits far lower than she will when we day sail. I think now that we are getting ready to turn her over to a new owner and have removed the stuff that collected over the 10 years we owned her she sits about an inch and a half higher. No one object accounts for that but a few screw drivers, a spare gusher extra lines etc all effects where in the water the boat sits.

That said still hard to believe there would be that much difference unless there was something truly heavy at the back. Hence the repower would be my first thought. It could go either way.