Recommended loft for sail inspection and recutting

thinwater · Oct 5, 2018

If it is a 1987 sail, the best bet for a re-cut is a good book and DIY. I seriously doubt the sail will justify any professional labor.

On the flip side, re-cutting a small sail it is very educational in terms of sewing and understanding sail shape. You may enjoy the process, and there is really nothing to lose. I've recut a number of smaller sails; the shape was better and I learned a lot. Mostly it was for the learning.

Gunni · Oct 5, 2018

Looks like you have an affiliated Neil Pryde agent in Cocoa Beach and Panama City, they could inspect the sail and give you some options. Ground shipping won't be a major factor for that size sail. But the good news is that NOW is the best time of the year to scope and price a new sail, they will be taking orders at best prices. I like working with a company rep for the measure and the install, then if there are any problems they will see them and can determine the best fix.

Joe · Oct 5, 2018

Don't rule out replacement. You can purchase an OEM quality mainsail for your boat for around $615 before extras.... check here for educational and comparative info

dlochner · Oct 6, 2018

Joe said:
Don't rule out replacement. You can purchase an OEM quality mainsail for your boat for around $615 before extras.... check here for educational and comparative info

For a boat your size, a new sail will not be that expensive especially when compared to the labor to recut the sail. Money spent on recutting is throwing good money after bad. A good job will likely take several hours and with shop hours running at $80+ it will be a several hundred dollar job. In the end you'll have a marginally better sail with cloth that is still old and soft.

Dacron sailcloth is coated with a resin to help the sail hold its shape. Over time that resin breaks down and the cloth become very soft and unable to hold it shape. A good source of information on sails is here: http://www.greatcirclesails.com/max-sail-blogs.html Brian Hancock has been making sails for a long time and is very knowledgeable about sails and sail making. Time spent reading his book is time well spent. His sails are also nicely built and reasonably priced, I just purchased a new jib from him this year.

Recutting a newer larger more expensive sail may make some sense, however, recutting a small 30 year old sail doesn't make sense to me. For a few hundred dollars more you'll have a new sail that will sail better and last longer.

If you are interested in building your own sail, take a look at Sailrite.com https://www.sailrite.com/Oday-222-Sail-Data

Gunni · Oct 6, 2018

You will have to talk to the NP agent to see what they are capable of doing. Bruce Empey in Annapolis can do quite a bit of sail work, and he has a great eye for sail condition, fit and finish. My expectation is that the agent will be a good resource to you regarding best course of action. If your boat rig is still in OEM configuration NP has your measurements, they were the sailmaker for O’Day (as they are for Beneteau). That makes it easy to get a sail that fits and lasts.

dlochner · Oct 6, 2018

kveach said:
Thanks Joe and Dave,
I get the compromises and have not ruled out a new sail. I have a 1 year old jib from the p.o. and honestly the old main still seems pretty "crisp and crinkley" relative to that. I don't think the boat was used that much over its history. Anyway I'd feel it was money well spent to get a pro to look at the main and let me know the condition and cost/benefit of a recut and repair. If I think it's worth it then a restored sail would give me time to learn on an older sail while I figure what I might really want in a new sail. And then I'll have a spare. But you're right, if I can just sail a while with what I have, a $300 recut fee may be better put to a new sail.
Cheers and fair winds

There should be no charge from the Sailmaker to simply inspect the sail and make recommendations. Expect a sails pitch for a new sail.

Kings Gambit · Oct 6, 2018

I've had one sail "re-cut" in my lifetime of sailing. It was a genoa built by Johnson Sails in St. Pete/Clearwater, FL for my Pearson 30. Johnson Sails did the re-cutting. There was definite improvement and I kept it for probably another 4 years until replacing it with a new 155% genoa built by Ulman Sails in Long Beach. That said, I think it makes sense to consult the builder of the sail for a re-cut evaluation. Otherwise, there is/are (a)loft(s) that actually specialize in "sail repair", rather than in the building of them, although they may build some new sails.. A long way from you, but one such place is H2O Sails in Wilmington, CA. Or, if it doesn't work out with Pryde and you wish not to ship far, I would recommend an Ulman Sails loft near you. (Incidentally, I've bought new sails from Ulman, North, UK, & Quantum. The best overall customer service has been from North & Ulman although I don't have anything negative to say about the others.)

www.h2osails.com/
"Take a picture of the problem you feel is developing and text it to us. H2O Sails is always there to give advise and help you solve whatever sail or canvas issues you may have."

Jackdaw · Oct 6, 2018

Neil Pryde will have zero interest in referbing your sail. Maybe the agent as an independent entity, but don’t expect any magic due to them being the original manufacture.

dlochner · Oct 6, 2018

kveach said:
Thanks all for the new replies. Come Monday , I'll give one of the N.P. agents a call and have the discussion about what they can do. And I'll keep Ulman in mind if new is the route I choose to go.
Cheers and fair winds

Check out Great Circle Sails, their sails are built in the same loft as Ullman in South Africa at a much lower cost since Brian Hancock spends less on marketing. I have a jib from GCS and am about to order a new main.

JRT · Oct 6, 2018

www.precisionsailloft.com

Did great on my new jib this year. I made the same mistake thinking old sails are ok, they aren't.

Gene Neill · Oct 6, 2018

As far as lofts in general, I've heard good things about Masthead Enterprises, in St. Pete.

We live 15 miles south of you, BTW. We trailer sail a Catalina 22. If you ever want to show off that O'Day, I'm in Gainesville at least every other day.

jssailem · Oct 7, 2018

Congrats on getting the boat ready for sailing.
Do not know about you, but is always feels it takes way longer to get to the water then it did when I started the projects... Then you are on the water and you start looking at more ways to work on the boat.
Sails are the power source for a sail boat. So it is only natural to see them as an upgrade spot.
If I read your story correctly you are at the least seeking an outside (possible professional) opinion on the status of your main sail that you think is original equipment (as @dlochner identifies 30plus years) but not used much by previous owner.
Being a project loving guy with a 1974 vintage boat, I think I can relate. My sails were original vintage.
My suggestion. Unless you plan on competing in the 222 ODay class races (not even sure they exist). Recognize you’ll be chasing the latest and greatest sails and gear in the competing world. Kind of like the amateur golfer can not wait to see the new golf clubs that debut right before the season begins.
I would spend some sailing time getting to know your new to you larger boat. Sail the hull out of her. As you have already know many of us are either collectors (have more than one boat on the property or at a marina) or transition boat owners (this is my boat, until I go to the boat show and see what I can get for just a foot or two bigger boat).
If racing is in your blood and you have been bitten by the passion, then by all means buy a new sail. It may yield you a few more spots up in the pack. Then take lessons. These will be the best money spent.
If money is the driving force, then conserve the boat bucks till you are ready and maybe need to spend it on a new sail. Note that sails while important are not a big factor in the eyes of the person who is about to buy your old boat when you are ready to transition. They are a bit like the tires on our car. You spend $500 for new tires then try to sell the car and they may help with the sale but your not getting $500 more for the car.

Then there is I want a new sail, I have the money for a new sail. I got a new sail. Who can argue with that. It is your boat and your choice....

Kings Gambit · Oct 7, 2018

I had a friend who owned a 30-ft sailboat and ended up "wearing out" and replacing the diesel (Volvo) before any of the sails. In fact, I don't remember new sails ever being bought for that boat of > 20 yr use. I'd say most folks pay little attention to the condition of their sails unless racing a lot every season. Although, one big impetus for buying new sails is when the old ones are dirty & stained, and cannot be cleaned. New sails, in addition to making the boat sail better, are much prettier than the old ones!!

The comparison with golfing is a good one. The newest version of the golf clubs probably won't serve to lower your handicap if you're basically an average golfer. New sails probably won't improve your time much on the race course if you don't how to use them. A dirty bottom will still slow you down. Poor coursemanship will still put you in the wrong place on the course for current and wind oscillations, etc., that can make a difference. Crossing the start line half-a-minute later than everyone else still loses in a short, competitive race, etc. I've seen more than a few skippers in last or next to last place boats remain there even with the addition of expensive new sails.

dlochner · Oct 7, 2018

One clue that the sails about to become toast is to hoist them with the sun behind the sails. If you can see the needles holes it is a sail that should be repurposed as a drop cloth or landfill.