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MOB for Real

Discussion in 'Ask All Sailors' started by Will Gilmore, Jan 9, 2018. Add this thread to a FAQ

  1. Will Gilmore

    Will Gilmore

    Joined Oct 19, 2017
    2,397 posts, 977 likes
    O'Day 19
    US Littleton, NH
    There have been a couple of situations recently regarding Man Overboard accidents. A crewman in the Volvo race died and three men received recognition for rescuing a Capitan who went over the side, leaving his inexperienced crew member alone.
    I've just review a few, mostly disappointing, videos on Man Overboard Drills that left me feeling like they were missing something. There is no attempt to address the man overboard in a situation that might actually cause a man overboard.

    The ones I thought were the most useful were the ones that addressed maneuvering the boat, bringing her up into irons and which side to approach the MOB. None, however, gave practicable advice about getting the MOB back in the boat or, the situation was so controlled that they might as well have videoed a guy taking a dip with friends or family.
    There was an interesting self-rescue video that, if you were the only one on board and had everything pre-arranged, this could be a useful system.

    *What would you, as captain, like to stress in an MOB drill when going over things with a non-sailing crew?
    *how would you handle higher winds and keeping track of the MOB?
    *What if the crew and the MOB were taken by surprise when incident occurred? How long would it really take to react and what should each member's roll be?
    *How do you handle a MOB who can't climb the ladder on his own?
    Has anyone found a useful video that they think teaches a realistic MOB drill?

    - Will (Dragonfly)
     


  2. LeslieTroyer

    LeslieTroyer

    Joined May 20, 2016
    1,518 posts, 473 likes
    Catalina 36 MK1
    US Everett, WA
    My dad went OB on a race and was caught by the harness. He cracked a rib and was very bruised.

    I’ve also done extended cpr on a diver until the CG dropped someone one the boat. Getting over the puke smell in the mouth is tough. Also it’s hard not to inflate the stomach. He died - adrenal glam stuck open and had a massive heart attack.


    Enough to make a believer out of you for wearing harnesses and learning CPR ( only now they don’t do the breathing)

    Mahalo
     


    Last edited: Jan 9, 2018
    Will Gilmore likes this.
  3. Will Gilmore

    Will Gilmore

    Joined Oct 19, 2017
    2,397 posts, 977 likes
    O'Day 19
    US Littleton, NH
    I failed my Water Rescue Class because I couldn't remember the name of the 'cross arm hold', or is it 'cross chest hold', on the written part of the test.
    :(

    - Will (Dragonfly)
     


  4. AlastairLC

    AlastairLC

    Joined Jan 2, 2017
    246 posts, 49 likes
    O'Day 322
    US Lake Pleasant
    Do you mean the Clipper Around the World race? No one died in the current Volvo race as far as I know.
     


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  5. ggrizzard

    ggrizzard

    Joined May 27, 2004
    964 posts, 65 likes
    Hunter 30_74-83
    US Ponce Inlet FL
    Could someone provide a product name or website address of the self rescue device?
     


  6. Will Gilmore

    Will Gilmore

    Joined Oct 19, 2017
    2,397 posts, 977 likes
    O'Day 19
    US Littleton, NH
    I guess I did. The Clipped isn't sponsored by Volvo?
    :redface:

    - Will (Dragonfly)
     


  7. Will Gilmore

    Will Gilmore

    Joined Oct 19, 2017
    2,397 posts, 977 likes
    O'Day 19
    US Littleton, NH
    That video is all I got on it.

    - Will (Dragonfly)
     


  8. JimInPB

    JimInPB

    Joined Aug 22, 2017
    783 posts, 221 likes
    Hunter 212 & 170
    us West Palm Beach
    I've personally been involved in 2 sailboat MOBs so far. The first was a few years ago during a race, as about 50 boats were barreling towards the finish line. I was in a mark boat, taking back up finish calls from a vantage point forward of the line & off to the side, past the pin end. We had to make an emergency maneuver to avoid getting torpedoed by an out of control boat. Shortly after that we picked up an MOB call on the VHF & realized that the out of control boat was missing it's skipper. Less than 3 minutes later I had the overboard skipper in sight & a type IV in hand. He was able to climb into our boat with little assistance.

    The second instance was only a couple of months ago. I was out in a boat that I was not familiar with & I had inexperienced crew with me. During a significant heel, she went over. I was able to round up & get near her, but I could not get into irons. On a second pass, I was able to luff up long enough to pull her back aboard. She had a partial bladder failure in an inflatable PFD that had not been opened & inspected in a few years, contrary to the manufacturer's instructions.

    In both cases, all ended well.

    I also had one close call. I nearly became an MOB when I was racing on a J-boat several years ago. I got washed under the lifelines during a tack in heavy seas, after slipping on some loose lines that were on the deck. I was able to pull myself back aboard while the boat was still underway because I managed to grab a lifeline post before the boat was out of reach. I think that we may have dropped back one or two spots in the standings, but other than that, a bruised knee & a bruised ego, there was no harm done.
     


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  9. Will Gilmore

    Will Gilmore

    Joined Oct 19, 2017
    2,397 posts, 977 likes
    O'Day 19
    US Littleton, NH
    Try this link. It is interesting. Not what you wanted but interesting.
    http://www.google.com/patents/US5192238

    - Will (Dragonfly)
     


  10. Captain Larry-DH

    Captain Larry-DH

    Joined Jun 14, 2010
    325 posts, 115 likes
    Quorning Dragonfly 1200
    US home
    When I’m not clipped on, I don’t leave the cockpit while underway unless I’m wearing a PFD with handheld VHF and AIS MOB beacon. http://oceansignal.com/products/mob1/ (effective coastal in well traveled waters). These are most likely to bring a fast local response, and if my wife is aboard I can (hopefully) talk her through my recovery on the radio.
    I also keep a PLB on my PFD belt but wouldn’t deploy it unless I was in a remote area and local recovery seems less likely.
     


  11. Jackdaw

    Jackdaw

    Joined Nov 8, 2010
    8,657 posts, 2,029 likes
    Beneteau First 36.7 & 260
    US Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
    A million things would have to go right for that retrieval system to work. I'd rather spend money on staying on the boat.

    In every MOB we have done (practice or real), getting the casualty back ON the boat is the biggest problem. Even in the light of day with flat seas and an able bodied crew. Combine high freeboard, seastate, and a person with limited ability to help, and you can have a nightmare scenario unfold three feet away from you. These 'net based' systems for MOB became popular in the UK and now are making there way over. An MOB can climb up, or be parbuckled on board. Recommended.

    20150907_120012-ladder-lift-1-900x900.png
     


    Last edited: Jan 10, 2018
    Dennis Kitchen and Will Gilmore like this.
  12. kappykaplan

    kappykaplan

    Joined May 1, 2011
    743 posts, 104 likes
    Pearson 37
    US Lusby MD
    @Jackdaw, do you know who carries these in the U.S.? I'm intrigued.
     


  13. Jackdaw

    Jackdaw

    Joined Nov 8, 2010
    8,657 posts, 2,029 likes
    Beneteau First 36.7 & 260
    US Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI


  14. Gunni

    Gunni

    Joined Mar 16, 2010
    4,994 posts, 905 likes
    Beneteau 411 Oceanis
    US Annapolis
    Whatever you do make sure you drill on the procedure don’t just read about it or watch videos. Getting the boat into position for a recovery can be challenging with a panicked crew. We use a LifeSling to get the MOB and have a provision to send a second crew member into the water for an injured MOB. With a properly positioned LifeSling a MOB can be brought to the rail or swim platform independent of any self assistance. A recent addition is a block and tackle which is attached to a positioned halyard shackle. That allows recovery control at the point of recovery.
     


  15. Simon Sexton

    Simon Sexton

    Joined Nov 1, 2017
    234 posts, 76 likes
    Catalina 25 Tall Rig
    Valiant US Watergate Marina, Kemah, TX
    Mr. Gilmore,

    Good morning! Oddly enough, we experienced an MOB on one of our scout vessels just yesterday! This was interesting, as I have found it quite difficult to fall off the freeboard of a Tartan 30, but of course a young Girl Scout somehow managed. The water was frigid, probably around 55-60 degrees Fahrenheit, so we had to take action very quickly before hypothermia could set in. We were under sail and on a beam reach when she went over, so we took action by marking our position at the time of emergency as a waypoint and began an MOB alert on our GPS; after jibing around and heading back up to her, we were able to drop the swim ladder and she climbed aboard all on her own. Also, it is of the utmost importance that at least one crew member points at the victim and shouts, "MAN OVERBOARD" loud enough for the entire crew to hear, and keeps pointing until recovery. When I was working as a sailing instructor at Sea Star Base Galveston, we stressed man overboard emergencies to our crew before they even learned anything about sail trim or points of sail, and told them what to do in the situation. In the case that a crew member falls overboard who isn't able to climb up the rescue or swim ladder theirself, I would most likely utilize the spinnaker halyard on my, as it is longer than the main and jib halyards.
     


  16. Jackdaw

    Jackdaw

    Joined Nov 8, 2010
    8,657 posts, 2,029 likes
    Beneteau First 36.7 & 260
    US Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
    Interesting, your established MOB protocol involves potentially ordering a crewmember into the water?
     


  17. Gunni

    Gunni

    Joined Mar 16, 2010
    4,994 posts, 905 likes
    Beneteau 411 Oceanis
    US Annapolis
    Absolutely.
     


  18. JimInPB

    JimInPB

    Joined Aug 22, 2017
    783 posts, 221 likes
    Hunter 212 & 170
    us West Palm Beach
    If it's dark out & you loose someone while underway, unless they have a light or a beacon, you are not likely to find them. I can't overstate the value of even the smallest waterproof light during an after dark MOB.
     


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  19. thinwater

    thinwater

    Joined Mar 26, 2011
    1,843 posts, 300 likes
    Corsair F-24 MK I
    US Deale, MD
    Do you believe the cracked rib was from the harness or other impacts? What brand and length tether? Was it on a jackline or hard point? Was he at the bow or elsewhere? Can I assume there wee no leg loops?

    Yes, lots of questions. I write for several magazines, am investigating several other accidents, and am constantly collecting data. The underlying question is whether PPE standards need to change.
     


  20. LeslieTroyer

    LeslieTroyer

    Joined May 20, 2016
    1,518 posts, 473 likes
    Catalina 36 MK1
    US Everett, WA
    I believe he was at the mast when washed off. Unfortunately it was over 40 yrs ago and he is not around any more
     



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