Mast step removal

Jul 25, 2016
197
Catalina 22 Sacramento
Hi All,
I'm having trouble removing the mast step. The bolts come out fine, but it is also glued to the cabin to top as well. Any secrets to getting the adhesive to loosen in order to remove the mast step?

Any advice for securing the new halyard plate and mast step - "glued" or no "glue" to the cabin top?

Thanks!
Kevin
 
May 23, 2016
1,024
Catalina 22 #12502 BSC
can't help w/removal if "glued", but my install once removed was simply butyl tape per mainsail's method...
 
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Nov 19, 2008
2,129
Catalina C-22 MK-II Parrish, FL
The mast step is where I want super adhesion as well as water sealing. 3M5200 is definitely my choice for this job. I don't worry about the permanent bond, as a trailer-sailor it's what I want because of the stresses on the mast step from routinely rigging and de-rigging my boat. So I ensure the job is done right the first time, which means also preparing the mounting holes with warmed epoxy resin to lower the viscosity to allow it to saturate the wood coring better. Should you need to remove the mast step years down the road, there are several de-bonding agents that break the tenacious bond 3M5200 gives you, so that argument is moot. Here is the debonding agent I've used for years, and it doesn't harm the gelcoat.

RELEASING AGENT.jpg


Several years ago I was refurbishing a little P-15 and I had to rebuild the compression post and installed a new mast step and halyard plate. Everyone was raving about butyl tape, so I tried it. Just didn't care for the continued oozing as the material required repeated tightening and trimming, and it didn't add anything to secure the mast step to the cabin top. I ended up striping off the hardware and the butyl tape and reinstalled the mast step and halyard plate with 3M5200.

IMG_3024.JPG


Different applications require different approaches. Many boat manufactures use 3M5200 to bond and seal the deck to hull joint, and the hull to keel joints. I always wondered why they haven't discovered the superiority of butyl tape?

Contrary to the popular opinion, butyl tape on my boat is at the bottom of my list.
 
Last edited:
Jul 25, 2016
197
Catalina 22 Sacramento
How do you use a de-bonding agent? Do I start with spraying it on the edges and continue to try to work it under the rest of the step as it loosens? A putty knife will probably help as well.
 
May 23, 2016
1,024
Catalina 22 #12502 BSC
I'm not one to argue w/Capt. Don for sure....defer to him! (although still a believer in butyl for most other deck penetrations)...
 
Sep 30, 2013
3,538
1988 Catalina 22 North Florida
Don, have you REALLY used Debond to remove a mast step, or equally large-surface fitting?? 'Cause I'm curious about how long it took the product to penetrate up underneath, and how much physical labor was still involved. It seems impossible/miraculous to me. It's one thing to remove residue from a surface, it's quite another to remove a mast step.

For my part, I loathe "Satan's Glue", and would never recommend its use for any boat repair under any circumstances. But I'd be happy to learn that I am mistaken!


The mast step is where I want super adhesion as well as water sealing. 3M5200 is definitely my choice for this job. I don't worry about the permanent bond, as a trailer-sailor it's what I want because of the stresses on the mast step from routinely rigging and de-rigging my boat. So I ensure the job is done right the first time, which means also preparing the mounting holes with warmed epoxy resin to lower the viscosity to allow it to saturate the wood coring better. Should you need to remove the mast step years down the road, there are several de-bonding agents that break the tenacious bond 3M5200 gives you, so that argument is moot. Here is the debonding agent I've used for years, and it doesn't harm the gelcoat.

View attachment 144161

Several years ago I was refurbishing a little P-15 and I had to rebuild the compression post and installed a new mast step and halyard plate. Everyone was raving about butyl tape, so I tried it. Just didn't care for the continued oozing as the material required repeated tightening and trimming, and it didn't add anything to secure the mast step to the cabin top. I ended up striping off the hardware and the butyl tape and reinstalled the mast step and halyard plate with 3M5200.

View attachment 144169

Different applications require different approaches. Many boat manufactures use 3M5200 to bond and seal the deck to hull joint, and the hull to keel joints. I always wondered why they haven't discovered the superiority of butyl tape?

Contrary to the popular opinion, butyl tape on my boat is at the bottom of my list.
 
Jan 23, 2015
92
catalina catalina22 Trailer
I used 3M4000 for hard ware and made a mistake using 5200 years ago.But the mast step is understandable ,besides the strentgh of the bolts in wood and epoxy 5200 has great strength. i READ where it was applied between a 10,000 lb keel and a boat after the keel bolts were removed the keel had to be pryed apart from the bolt. Permenant stuff
 
Nov 19, 2008
2,129
Catalina C-22 MK-II Parrish, FL
The de-bond is very watery and I've just sprayed it very lightly on and let it set and do the work. The caulking gets soft and gooey, and is actually a bit messy. All I can say is read the manufactures instructions, maybe they're selling snake oil. Don't feel comfortable using 5200, don't use it. And no, I've never removed a mast step that I installed with 5200, and I don't know what the factory used when they installed the mast step. As I said in my posting, depends on the application. Must be a reason why there are so many different types of sealants. But, when I repair something, my usual plan is to make the repair once, and so far, that assumption seems to be working for me.
 
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Jul 25, 2016
197
Catalina 22 Sacramento
Don, have you REALLY used Debond to remove a mast step, or equally large-surface fitting?? 'Cause I'm curious about how long it took the product to penetrate up underneath, and how much physical labor was still involved. It seems impossible/miraculous to me. It's one thing to remove residue from a surface, it's quite another to remove a mast step.

For my part, I loathe "Satan's Glue", and would never recommend its use for any boat repair under any circumstances. But I'd be happy to learn that I am mistaken!
I plan to give Debond a try on removing my mast step. I will let you know how well it works and how long it takes.
 
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Sep 8, 2014
2,551
Catalina 22 Swing Keel San Diego
Whatever method you use, use several strips of blue tape in a big square around the mast step. Put on a few layers. Hopefully you will find out you are NOT dealing with 5200 and wont have to spray de-bond, but in any case you'll need a thin but stiff knife to pound under the mast step to scrape it off. The tape will prevent making a huge mess and scratching the heck out of the gel-coat or paint.
 
Jul 25, 2016
197
Catalina 22 Sacramento
Whatever method you use, use several strips of blue tape in a big square around the mast step. Put on a few layers. Hopefully you will find out you are NOT dealing with 5200 and wont have to spray de-bond, but in any case you'll need a thin but stiff knife to pound under the mast step to scrape it off. The tape will prevent making a huge mess and scratching the heck out of the gel-coat or paint.
Is there another product I should use if it it's not 5200? I am wondering if I should try using a knife first.
 
Nov 19, 2008
2,129
Catalina C-22 MK-II Parrish, FL
Here is what the manufacture of the releasing agent I've been using for years says:

"DeBond Corporation began business in 1999 with our first product, Marine Formula™ a patented chemical product to remove polyurethane adhesive/sealants such as 3M™ 5200. Prior to the introduction of this product, polyurethane adhesives were considered "permanent" and "irremovable"

Don't take my word, best thing would be to checkout their web site and see what they say, and follow the directions.

RELEASING AGENT.jpg
 
Sep 8, 2014
2,551
Catalina 22 Swing Keel San Diego
Is there another product I should use if it it's not 5200? I am wondering if I should try using a knife first.
If its anything besides 5200 you won't need chemicals, just the knife. I used 3M 4000 UV on mine and it would be 'scrapable' with a putty knife.
 
Sep 30, 2013
3,538
1988 Catalina 22 North Florida
Is there another product I should use if it it's not 5200?
The non-permanent equivalent is 3M 4200. I have never used it myself though. I opted for Sikaflex 291 on the C22 mast step, and Boatlife Caulk on the Albin Vega.

@CaptDon01 ... where did you find the best pricing on Marine Formula? I happen have a couple unused fittings bedded in 5200 by the PO that I'd like to be rid of. The first one actually tore the gelcoat off of the fiberglass when I tried to pry it off!
 
Jul 25, 2016
197
Catalina 22 Sacramento
Hi All, I wanted to report back that I was able to remove the mast step without the use of any adhesive remover. In fact, it was a lot easier than I thought it ever could have been. I think that I will return the favor to the next owner by not using 5200 as an adhesive!