Load range E or D tires

[shanester]

I am getting ready to buy a new set of tires. This time I am replacing the rusted white powder coated wheels with galvanized and also the spare tire/wheel. The first set of tires were 205/75/15 load range C and the tread wore out after 2 seasons. Since then I have bought several sets of 225/75/15 Load range D with better results (only 1 blow-out so far).We tow from Dayton OH to FT Myers FL and from Dayton to Wiarton ON every year (~3,500 miles). We have about 45K miles on our trailer. The curb weight is about 4K lbs and is a single 3,500 lb axle. I keep the tires inflated to the maximum rating of 65 psi. My question is would Load range E tires last longer or more likely to prevent a blow-out? They are only about $15 each extra. The D range is an 8 ply with capacity of 2540 lbs. The E range is a 10 ply with a capacity of 2830 lbs. Are there any disadvantages to going to a lager capacity tire other than cost? Apparently trailer tire are only rated for 65 MPH I am running them at or over their speed rating most of the time in hot temperatures.

 

[woodster]

Are you buying passenger car tires or trailer tires it makes a diff and y may need to slow down

 

[shanester]

The only tires that I buy are "ST" tires rated for trailer service. They have a much higher capacity than car tires and much stiffer sidewalls to prevent sway. Rarely do I go faster than the posted speed limit when towing. I feel safe going the speed limit on the interstate towing my boat with my long wheelbase truck as long as there is not much traffic. Towing through Atlanta I am the slowest vehicle on the road by 15-20 MPH because I actually go the speed limit. The tires on my wife's car are rated for 149 MPH, are weight rated way more than needed for the GVW, cost about the same, and are not made in China. Compare that to trailer tires that are used almost always close or over their capacity, close to or over their speed rating, and you can't get them made in any country other than China. I feel like I get ripped off when buying trailer tires.

 

[Gene Neill]

Where are you finding these tires?? I just finished shopping, and the best I could find in 15" was a load range D with 2150lb rating. I didn't even know you could get load range E in a 15" tire!

When loaded, my boat and trailer combined weigh 3660 lbs at the axles, so I feel like my combined rating of 4300 lbs should be plenty ... but we'll see.

 

[shanester]

I found them in stock at my local Discount Tire (not Tire Discounters). Carlisle Radial Trail RH Load range E. $109 ea plus $12 ea mounting/balancing. They have to order the galvanized wheels and are $65 ea. They are also Carlisle but made in the USA unlike the tires they sell (China).

 

[shanester]

I just looked up all of the Carlisle Radial Trail RH specs in the 225/75/15.
C-2150 lbs, 50 psi, 29.5 lbs tire weight
D-2540 lbs, 65 psi, 30.8 lbs tire weight
E-2830 lbs, 80 psi, 35.2 lbs tire weight

 

[twalker H260]

How did you determine curb weight? Boat specs list 2000# displacement, trailer ~800, motor, gas etc should be well under 4000#. If that's the case I would check other items for cause of tread wear/blow outs.

What is the tread wear pattern on the tires before they blow?

If curb weight is at/over 4000# axle at/near capacity may be flexing too much causing wear on inner tread of tire.- second axle would help with this.

Axle may not be square with hitch/trailer frame causing it to tow to one side with increased side pressure etc.

Do you have brakes on the axle? Perhaps something there could be increasing the rolling resistance causing premature tire failure.

Perhaps others with more experience in this type of thing will chime in. While I live in a more temperate climate I would be very concerned with tires only lasting a few years - ours have good tread, no sidewall deterioration etc even after more than 8 years of use. I'm getting ready to replace them due to advanced age rather than wear. - we have done in the order of 20k miles.

 

[Gene Neill]

I just looked up all of the Carlisle Radial Trail RH specs in the 225/75/15.
C-2150 lbs, 50 psi, 29.5 lbs tire weight
D-2540 lbs, 65 psi, 30.8 lbs tire weight
E-2830 lbs, 80 psi, 35.2 lbs tire weight

Well, dang. I would have gone with those E's if Google had found them for me. I was going for the heaviest I could find.

Thank goodness the "Kenda Loadstar" tires I bought are made in China, where they only make top quality stuff.

 

[John Nantz]

Avoid Sunlight exposure

To help the tires last longer it's a good idea to avoid exposure to sunlight as the UV degrades the tire material.

Besides tires, another thought is to take a look as to what loads the wheel bearing and axle loads are designed for.

 

[srust58]

I have the same boat and trailer and have been having wear issues with the tires. Mine wear badly on the inside of the tread leading me to think the axle is the problem. The tires are 205/75 14 load range C good for 1740 lbs. With the boat at 2000 and the trailer unknown but guessing 700-800 and misc stuff in the boat we should not be over 3100-3200 lbs. We tend to load the tow vehicle and not the boat. Our longest trip is usually 1500 miles round trip. Am thinking about replacing the axle. Have thought about going up to 15 inch tires too. We have had the boat since new and it has always had the 14 inch tires. We have had one blow out over the years. We keep the speed at 55-60 mph. How were your tires wearing?

 

[shanester]

My boat trailer weighed 3,800 lbs about 10 years ago at a local grain elevator scale. That was before I added a group 31 battery, porta-pottie plus filled, 10 gallons of water, bimini, food, motor, fuel. So I am sorta guessing on the 4,000. The trailer weighs in at 900. I would have to guess the boat as it came from the factory was closer to 2,400. 2,000 is not the displacement but the design weight. There is (now) access to every area in the hull and I have never found any water. I would be very interested if others have actually weighed theirs. Try parking only the trailer axle(s) on the scale and then unhitch and put the tongue jack on the scale. You could then determine the tongue weight. A few years ago I checked to tongue weight with a shipping scale and it was about 350 which is inline with the 5-10 percent rule. That would bring the axle load closer to 3,650 but is still over the 3,500 max. This is a 2000 model year "custom built" trailer Triad built for me and most things had to be modified, rebuilt, replaced, or rewired. Not a quality product.

The first set of tires wore badly (obviously undersized) but the second set lasted 8 years before I had the blow-out on the Carlisle tires. The tread was not worn out at all. The spare I had was the original size of 205/75/15 Load range C and now 10 years old. I put that on and drove until I found a decent tire shop. They sold me 2 new "Hi-Run" brand tires (the same size 225/75/15 D radials). Here we are four years later on those tires.

I just checked the tread depth and they are 6/32 on the shoulders and 7/32 in the center. I Think they are wearing evenly for having about 10K miles on them.

If the axle was not square to the frame then it would crab going down the road. Mine does not do that and I don't think it would affect tire wear. If the axle was overloaded it would cause negative camber but not affect toe. This might cause more wear on the tires and maybe mine are running hotter that normal because of this. Heat kills tires.

My tires have seen their share of sun but what about cars that never get garaged. I am sure they are affected also.

The entire brake system I installed about 10 years ago after the original drum brakes rusted from dipping in salt. They are now SS disks, SS lines, and a better actuator (after 10 years it now needs a master cylinder). I always jack the trailer up to make sure the tires rotate freely before heading out. My axles are made by Dexter and have a through axle lubing system making it easy to replace (by displacing) the grease every year. This year I am going to replace the seals again.

 

[srust58]

I have a Shoreline brand trailer that came with the boat. Whether this came from the builders or from the dealer I bought the boat new from I don't recall. Any tags as to the rating are long gone. The axle is a 2x3 rectangular tube and looking at a new square 3500 pound axles that are 2x2 by 1/4 thick I would guess the old one should have an adequate load rating. Both tires wear badly on the inside so I have to think that is has something to do with the camber of the old axle. It has never seemed to be out of square to the frame. I have never had the rig weighed. My guess would be we have 20,000 miles on the trailer. Still has the surge brakes and they have not given me much trouble, replaced the master cylinder assembly once and may do the same for the wheel assemblies if I change out the axle.
We are planning on a trip to Huron and hope to launch in Little Current at the end of July.

 

[twalker H260]

I had been under the impression your tire life was of shorter duration. -3 to 4 seasons. If you do a google search on trailer tire life expectancy you will get a ton of information on this subject. Most trailer tire manufacturers give a life expectancy of 3-5 years and needing definite replacement at the 7-8 year mark regardless of number of miles on the tire.

From what I've read online it appears that rv/boat and other trailer tires suffer longevity issues due to lack of use that causes chemicals in the rubber to not be redistributed as in a regular vehicle tire. This is also in part why trailer tires should be protected from sun etc. that essentially leads to the sidewalls cracking and rotting out long before the tread is worn out.

Here is some info from Carlisle which seems to put longevity at the shorter end of things.

http://www.carlisletransportationpr...iginal/Trailer_Tires__Tips_Best_Practices.pdf

If your trailer and boat are at the upper end of axle rating I would likely consider a second axle just to reduce the risk/amount and type of damage that could occur do to a blow out.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

 

[shanester]

I have a Shoreline brand trailer that came with the boat. Whether this came from the builders or from the dealer I bought the boat new from I don't recall. Any tags as to the rating are long gone. The axle is a 2x3 rectangular tube and looking at a new square 3500 pound axles that are 2x2 by 1/4 thick I would guess the old one should have an adequate load rating. Both tires wear badly on the inside so I have to think that is has something to do with the camber of the old axle. It has never seemed to be out of square to the frame. I have never had the rig weighed. My guess would be we have 20,000 miles on the trailer. Still has the surge brakes and they have not given me much trouble, replaced the master cylinder assembly once and may do the same for the wheel assemblies if I change out the axle.
We are planning on a trip to Huron and hope to launch in Little Current at the end of July.

I can't remember if my original undersized tires wore exactly like that but I remember that they wore uneven. Have all your sets of tires worn the same way through the years or is this something new?

 

[shanester]

I had been under the impression your tire life was of shorter duration. -3 to 4 seasons. If you do a google search on trailer tire life expectancy you will get a ton of information on this subject. Most trailer tire manufacturers give a life expectancy of 3-5 years and needing definite replacement at the 7-8 year mark regardless of number of miles on the tire.

From what I've read online it appears that rv/boat and other trailer tires suffer longevity issues due to lack of use that causes chemicals in the rubber to not be redistributed as in a regular vehicle tire. This is also in part why trailer tires should be protected from sun etc. that essentially leads to the sidewalls cracking and rotting out long before the tread is worn out.

Here is some info from Carlisle which seems to put longevity at the shorter end of things.

That is some good info and learned most of that the last time I bought tires. I am now at the four year mark and ready to buy tires.

If your trailer and boat are at the upper end of axle rating I would likely consider a second axle just to reduce the risk/amount and type of damage that could occur do to a blow out.

I agree having two axles would help but I have not had a bearing/spring/brake failure yet from being overloaded. The tires I bought the last two times were rated for a total of 5080 lbs. Going to E range would be 5660 lbs.

 

[srust58]

I can't remember if my original undersized tires wore exactly like that but I remember that they wore uneven. Have all your sets of tires worn the same way through the years or is this something new?

They have always worn on the inside faster than the outside but it seems worse now. I put new tires on last year and we went to Huron and back 1500 miles...I feel if I did it again the tires would be shot by the time I got back..after a total of 3000 miles.

 

[CaptDon01]

A couple years ago after having a blow-out towing our C-22 MK-II version, I decided to have it weighed. I suspected the load range-C tires, and it was comfirmed when the scale reported our boat and trailer came in at almost 4,600 Lb's. So I went up to a load range-D tire, which also required me to increase the wheel size to 15". You can't normally find a load range-D tire in a 14" size. Last year we towed the boat over 6,000 miles without an incident. However, heading to the C-22 National's a couple weeks ago, 40 miles from home the left tire blew and by the time I could get over, the rim was destroyed also. The trailer store installed a load range-E tire of the same size. 400 miles further down the road, the other tire started coming apart. I caught it before it blew, and had the tire shop replace it with another load range-E tire. I was surprised how much cooler the tires ran, and I was cruising at 70 going across the desert in 100+ degrees. The tires were warm, the same as the tires on the truck. No further problems.....

One note, I HIGHLY recommend the Boat US trailer towing coverage. I think it's like $24. a year. My blow-out happened at 4:30 AM, and I called the 800 number for the Boat US service, a tow truck was dispatched and was helping me out within 20 minutes! The tire wrapped around the axle and there was no way I could've removed it myself.

For what it's worth, my Trail-Rite C-22 trailer with a spare tire installed came in at 1020 Lb's.

A couple photos of the experience are attached.

 

[Apex]

axle alignment?

 

[shanester]

the scale reported our boat and trailer came in at almost 4,600 Lb's

I think most people would be surprised by their rig's weight. I know I was.

 

[dem45133]

Ok... lots of good info for the most part... but

I tend to come from the heavy end of equipment, (semi-truck, etc). My boat alone is 9600 lbs, and the trailer is another 4.5k or so triple axle. Total is 14,200... combined gross 23000. My flat bed trailer can gross 12k (tandem axle). Back in the day (80s) the semi grossed just under 80k lbs usually. I now have ~2.7 million miles under my belt... and learned a couple things along the way.

Being this is the case, I have some strong feelings about what the industry does to recreational use applications. Most of the light trailers are scary light built. There is almost no excess capacity built in.

One thing not mentioned is axle flex... any axle that gets to 75% of capacity is flexed, and if you measure you'll see that... or even your eye can see it in worst case. New axles have a down angle built in to the spindle set so they run true at capacity. But when they get seriously over loaded, they can bend and lose this set. When this happens your weight is not carried evenly across the width of the tire... and yes you will eat the inner portion of the tread even if the toe in is true. Combine a curb hit and bend the tube or the spindle out of toe... and you'll also shred em.

Now the industry knows this... but they need to stay competitive... so they go as cheap as they can. For most mfgrs, if its rated at 3500... it really means about 2800 true... to allow for a safety margin. Something you all need to remember when buying. One ALWAYS buys excess capacity... its money in the bank.

If your only wearing one tire mostly (it will effect the other too)... then the axle is sprung and or the spindle bent. No good fix to this, other than a replacement. Some shops can straighten them... but it would cost more than a new one in your weight class. I truely suspect this is the case... keep in mine you are running a continuously over loaded axle, fully flexed... only takes one curb hit to bend it in this state. It only takes a degree or two to start eating tires.

If you do not convert the trailer to a tandem... I'd suggest a 5k axle. Match your spring capacities too (you've been overloading them too). Cheap insurance all the way around.

TIRES:

Regardless of the capacity... always and I mean it, ALWAYS go with the best you can buy. Again, its money in the bank down the road. Here again the mfgrs need to stay competitive... and they do not install quality tires when new... at least most don't. Yes many of them use a radial car design... because they are cheap and plentiful. BUT... consider this... the tire is generally at design capacity... which leads to increased side wall flex. Thus heat and wear. This is not the situation you want, but is what most get, especially running across a desert with 140 degree pavement heat.

So here again... buy excess capacity, and NEVER a load range C or D on a fully grossed axle. Buy at least an E. I run a 100 psi G load rating on my flatbed. Also, especially on a single axle... you want to minimize side wall lateral flex (including the tow vehilcle, think about that). The vehicle will be much easier to control without added sway due to side wall flex.

BTW, I scratch designed and built both of my trailers... like I mentioned one has a 14000 lb capacity for the sailboat (spring limited, has triple 7k axles as I wanted the 7k brakes)... the other an 18000 lb capacity frame and bed that was supposed to go triples but is currently tandem because that's all my 3/4 ton would pull then. I've pulled it all over the country since 1996. I now tow with a 1 ton dually set up with a few extras... the most important for towing is a retarder (like a semi's jake brake sorta) in my weight classes. Factory built simply did not have the capacity or features I wanted... and many I looked at were just scarry built. So I built my own.

Have fun.

Dave