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Lazy Jacks and racing

Discussion in 'Catalina 30' started by Jimski, Jun 27, 2018. Add this thread to a FAQ

  1. Jimski

    Jimski

    Joined May 20, 2015
    16 posts, 2 likes
    Catalina 30
    US Seabrook
    About 70% of the sailing I do is racing. I currently do not have lazy jacks. I know my crew would appreciate the benefit of lazy jacks after a race and its time to flake the main. Sometimes on leisure sails we do not bother with the main because we dont want to hassle with flaking it.

    So my question is do lazy jacks interfere or otherwise impede performance from a racing perspective? I'd like to hear some opinions.

    Yeah I k now its not often you hear racing and Catalina 30 used in the same sentence.
     


  2. Jackdaw

    Jackdaw

    Joined Nov 8, 2010
    9,222 posts, 2,415 likes
    Beneteau First 36.7 & 260
    US Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
    The majority of racer-cruisers in Europe use lazy-jacks, most often with stack-pack bags. Like the Elan S5 below. The Pogo 12.5 I race on has jacks. I have them for BlueJ, and would mount them if I ever got organized enough to have my sail-maker mod my cover. The best systems use thin light dyneema lines, with ceramic thimbles in place of blocks. Unless your system has thick cable for lines, it will not effect performance. The biggest issues are normally that you cannot slack it enough so it does not effect sail shape, but that is a solvable problem.

    Pure pure racers don't like them because they take the sail off the boom after racing anyway.

    IMG_7259.jpg

    79557C43-677D-4793-AA92-F9D1C8239322.jpeg
     


    Last edited: Jun 27, 2018
  3. Maine Sail

    Maine Sail Moderator

    Joined Feb 6, 1998
    10,713 posts, 542 likes
    Canadian Sailcraft 36T
    US Casco Bay, ME
    I just designed & built our lazy jacks to be collapsible. We have a four yoke system that can be collapsed or deployed in about 30 seconds.

    If you want to make your own use a cheap spool of twine to get it dialed in then remove it, measure the lengths you need and buy the correct line.. I use small Harken blocks & buntline hitches rather than splices.
     


  4. Calif. Ted

    Calif. Ted

    Joined Jun 8, 2004
    2,146 posts, 152 likes
    Catalina 320
    US Dana Point
    I crew on a Jeanneau 36i that has a factory installed stack pack/ lazy jack system, it's designed so we can slack the jack line and roll up the pack alongside the boom, nothing interferes with the sail. When just out for lunch we don't bother rolling up the pack it just lays along the foot. Sometimes with full battens the batten ends can catch the lazy jack lines while raising, just got to keep an eye on it.
     


    All U Get likes this.
  5. weinie

    weinie

    Joined Sep 6, 2010
    1,217 posts, 205 likes
    Jeanneau 349
    US port washington, ny
    I have lazy jacks with a sail pack thingy with dyneema line on a 34 boat that I race occasionally.
    Makes putting the sail away super fast... no flaking or rolling necessary... just a quick tidying up and zip the bag.
    I raise the sail at the mast and guide the sail through the lazy jack lines the first few feet. Then I 'jump' the rest up the mast as I take up the slack on the bitter end which has one turn around the winch.
     


  6. JRacer

    JRacer

    Joined Aug 9, 2011
    760 posts, 192 likes
    Beneteau 310
    US Cheney KS (Wichita)
    I have lazyjacks rigged on my B310 and keep enough slack in them that they don't interfere with sail shape yet they are taut enough to function. Biggest PITA with carrying them a little loose is making sure you don't snag the battens in them as you raise the main. Not a problem if you are dead into the wind but get off a little and not quick enough on the uptake and we sometimes catch the tail of a batten and have to lower a little and get closer to the wind to continue the hoist.
     


  7. thinwater

    thinwater

    Joined Mar 26, 2011
    1,999 posts, 394 likes
    Corsair F-24 MK I
    US Deale, MD
    It's easy to design LJs that pull forward and tuck in behind the mast. They will be in the turbulence and contribute no drag.

    Though as Mainesail says, I doubt you could measure it. Do you scrub the bottom before every race? Has the keel and rudder been faired? Do you remove every item that is not required by the rule book? Do you lock the head and empty the potable water and holding tank? Then it doesn't matter much.
     


  8. Jimski

    Jimski

    Joined May 20, 2015
    16 posts, 2 likes
    Catalina 30
    US Seabrook
    Thanks for all the info. I think lazy jacks are in my future.
    Points about superfluous stuff on board during are race are well taken. I do keep the bottom clean and have removed a lot of stuff I dont use such as microwave, pots, etc.. My mast has steps that should probably come off. But I draw the line at the mini fridge - it stays!
     


    All U Get likes this.
  9. All U Get

    All U Get

    Joined Oct 2, 2008
    2,659 posts, 359 likes
    Pearson/ 530
    US Strafford, NH
    :cowbell:
     


  10. weinie

    weinie

    Joined Sep 6, 2010
    1,217 posts, 205 likes
    Jeanneau 349
    US port washington, ny
    One nice thing...
    Was racing singlehanded last year and got blasted with a 35+ knot thunderstorm that rolled in super fast. It would have been real tough trying to flake a big ass sail over the boom in those conditions by myself. It was easy enough to drop it into the bag (though pulling it down the mast with the wind flogging it to death was brutal).
     


    JRacer likes this.
  11. jon hansen

    jon hansen

    Joined May 25, 2012
    1,025 posts, 489 likes
    john alden caravelle 42
    us sturgeon bay, wis
    next time try rigging a down haul. easy peezee
     


  12. Justin_NSA

    Justin_NSA

    Joined Jul 7, 2004
    4,689 posts, 728 likes
    Hunter 30T
    US Cheney, KS
    We had lazy jacks on the first boat we owned. Bella came with a Dutchman system. I kinda prefer the Dutchman. Easy to slack off. Almost no added weight. No way to snag the battens. Only downside is the mainsail has to be modded for the 2 filament lines to pass thru
     


  13. weinie

    weinie

    Joined Sep 6, 2010
    1,217 posts, 205 likes
    Jeanneau 349
    US port washington, ny
    that goes all the way to the head of the sail?o_O
     


  14. jon hansen

    jon hansen

    Joined May 25, 2012
    1,025 posts, 489 likes
    john alden caravelle 42
    us sturgeon bay, wis
    yes, line goes from head of sail to gooseneck then to cockpit. or where ever you release your halyard from
     


  15. jon hansen

    jon hansen

    Joined May 25, 2012
    1,025 posts, 489 likes
    john alden caravelle 42
    us sturgeon bay, wis
    for single handed racing you can rig this temporary setup
     


  16. smokey73

    smokey73

    Joined Oct 26, 2010
    628 posts, 129 likes
    Hunter 40.5
    US Beaufort, SC
    Jon, did you intend to post a pic or link? "this temporary setup"
     


  17. Jackdaw

    Jackdaw

    Joined Nov 8, 2010
    9,222 posts, 2,415 likes
    Beneteau First 36.7 & 260
    US Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
    Yep that, or get a track/car system.
     


  18. weinie

    weinie

    Joined Sep 6, 2010
    1,217 posts, 205 likes
    Jeanneau 349
    US port washington, ny
    my sail has cars where the battens are. the rest are slugs. If it were all cars I'd have to get a new stack bag because the cars would stack up too high. Those cars are expensive too.
     


  19. Jackdaw

    Jackdaw

    Joined Nov 8, 2010
    9,222 posts, 2,415 likes
    Beneteau First 36.7 & 260
    US Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
    They DO stack high. And are costly. I have two sets, and therefore only have two 'active' mainsails. When I get a new main, I take the cars off the oldest of the two sails and have them put on the new sail. The old one goes into mothballs.
     


  20. jon hansen

    jon hansen

    Joined May 25, 2012
    1,025 posts, 489 likes
    john alden caravelle 42
    us sturgeon bay, wis
    smokey, no. i never single hand. that said. it is very simple. tie a line to the head of sail. let it free hang down the mast. tie off to control it while sailing. when you need to drop sail release halyard then pull down line. if your halyard is controlled aft rig some snatch blocks to run it aft.

    i can fly 5 sails off the wind on my yawl. i carry 21 extra snatch blocks to run lines where i need them. my yawl instructor taught me to be creative for sail control. Bjorn Johansson, vice president of sailboats at palmer johnson's back when they where creating some of the greatest sailing vessels on the globe. he was also mr. haggerty's race captain.
     



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