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keel is coming up through the floor is this normal?

Discussion in 'Ask A Hunter Owner' started by cuttysark, Dec 16, 2017. Add this thread to a FAQ

  1. cuttysark

    cuttysark

    Joined Dec 16, 2017
    4 posts, 1 likes
    hunter 23
    us cle
    I just purchased an H23 I thought for a great price. I hauled her 550 miles and when I got home I noticed the floor was pushed up. I also noticed the boat was only bobing in between the bunks. Not really being supported at all. So I am wondering since all the weight is on the keel would that cause this mis shaping of the floor? Is this to much weight on the keel? And is this fixable? And the floor has a little frozen water on it. That couldn't be helped, it snowed as I was driving. It also looks just a little pushed in from the hull side also. I lifted her about 3 inches with some 2x4's. Please any helpful advise. Even if it's to save for a funeral pyre. thumbnail.jpg thumbnail (1).jpg thumbnail (2).jpg thumbnail (3).jpg
     


  2. Ted

    Ted

    Joined Jan 26, 2005
    1,009 posts, 145 likes
    C&C 110
    US Bay Shore, Long Island, NY
    Welcome. Sorry that the responses to your first post here might not be what you want to hear. It's a bit difficult to see what is actually going on from those photos. Looking at the interior photo, it looks like there was an attempt at making a repair to the hull on the port (left) side. The repair appears to be very amateurish. There appears to be significant structural issues. The hull should not deflect like that. Repairs can probably be made but it may not be worth the time, effort and money to correct this problem. Additional photos would be helpful.
     


    Last edited: Dec 16, 2017
  3. cuttysark

    cuttysark

    Joined Dec 16, 2017
    4 posts, 1 likes
    hunter 23
    us cle
    Thanks for the reply Ted. These are about the best pic/angles I could get. Im not sure how this would effect the performance. Previous owner said he had a little water in the bottom approx. 1-2 cups each time he went out. So he put the seal on it and said that stopped it. Unfortunately I didn't notice the bulge on the left. If all else fails I only paid $1200. Even if I scrap her I can get some return on the trailer. How much is lead going for???? Also I have my eye on a solid hull a few miles from here for $800. (no sails, no motor) just the hull and coushions. Your and other opinions count. Im still not sure whether to keep her or scrap and get the other hull?
     


  4. Will Gilmore

    Will Gilmore

    Joined Oct 19, 2017
    1,920 posts, 740 likes
    O'Day 19
    US Littleton, NH
    Is the other hull the same boat? Get it and swap hardware. If not, I take it this boat came with all that stuff you said the other boat doesn't come with. They have value. What kind of work are you comfortible doing and have resources for? Fiberglass? Woodwork? Metal: cutting, bending, welding? Shop tools and floor space? This looks like a sizable job but, just as Ted said, it can be done.
    If you don't want to take the time and want to get on the water (recommended) and live somewhere you can do that this time of year, then break it down for parts. Lead is worth a lot but it is also work to get to. Trailers are very sellable but find out what else is on the market for boats, the trailer might come in handy.
    This is a very interesting problem. If you decide to tackle it, keep posting. We are all interested in seeing how it goes.
    - Will (Dragonfly)
     


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  5. shemandr

    shemandr

    Joined Jan 1, 2006
    3,257 posts, 423 likes
    Marblehead Skiff 14'
    US Greenport, NY
    If you watch when a travel lift sets a boat on the hard, when the weight of the boat rests on the keel, as it should, the hull deforms a bit. Maybe it shouldn't but most boats do. I can't tell either what is going on inside the boat. But stay around, there is a former Hunter dealer who posts here and his opinion would be very useful. BTW generally when you think you got a great deal on a boat - you overpaid.
     


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  6. Crazy Dave Condon

    Crazy Dave Condon

    Joined Jun 8, 2004
    6,152 posts, 434 likes
    -na -NA
    US Anywhere USA
    Cuttysark
    You do not know me but I know the boat. First everyone knows this boat as a wing keel and you are correct the weight of the boat should rest on the keel; however, the first 10 of these boats had a swing keel version, some with winglets. I think only the first 10 boats were that way. There is a diagram of the swing keel version in the boat information. Go to that and pick hunter, then click on 23, the click on down loads and go to the bottom for the diagram for the download on that keel. As for the wing keel fixed version, the hull was beefed up; ;however, there are some things going on.
    Here is my take on this. First I do not know if this is a Hunter supplied trailer. See if it is a Kens Welding or KWS. If not that is the first mistake of the previous owner. Second, is the keel tray rotten or not, third does the keel tray fixed with a metal base and finally are the bunk boards rotten.
    However, the very first picture and description gives away what is wrong. The bunks should be designed to support the length of the hull. Second, the supports should be straight up and not at an angle. Then there should be no additional two layers of wood attached to the bunk boards. Then there are other things that make me wonder if this trailer was for storing a boat only.
    First you need to correct this now, not in the spring. You will need to buy longer supports and readjust to have them standing up and when you cut them have about 4 inches extending under for future adjustment. You may have to add side supports to the uprights so they will not allow the upright supports from leaning over. Rip those additional boards off. Check the original bunk board and if need replacing, replace it. Then check the keel tray boards to see if rotten and if so, replace. Then raise the bunk board to fit the contour of the hull. You may have to raise them a little higher to get the weight of the boat somewhat off the keel tray to allow the fiberglass to resettle. Then in the spring, recheck the hull as the biggest thing at this point is to allow the hull hopefully to reshape itself. Then we can talk again but get that water out of there and if means using a heater for a short while as long as you are there to get any ice out, do it. Do not leave any heater on unattended.
    Also I am not sure if the boat was strapped down during transport to allow this. You may also have some indentations of the hull where the bunk boards are as well so when fixing, make sure the bunk boards rest on the hull evenly both sides.
    I was a former dealer who was the top dealer selling this boat. Not bragging but just letting you know I still remember some things about this boat. I am retired.
     


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  7. Benny17441

    Benny17441

    Joined May 24, 2004
    5,300 posts, 290 likes
    CC 30
    US South Florida
    Can't tell from those pictures the nature of the damage; have someone test the keel bolts and survey the hull. Definitely get the trailer properly adjusted as per Crazy Daves advice. Disposing of a boat costs money.
     


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  8. Hunter Ad Bot

    Hunter Ad Bot

    Joined Oct 27, 2016
    0 posts, 10 likes
    US Seattle
    Hunter props, shafts, struts, and cutless bearings

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    See the product
     


  9. Jim 5757

    Jim 5757

    Joined Jun 19, 2004
    330 posts, 24 likes
    Morgan M28 O/I
    US Ocean Gate, NJ
    Yes Dave I totally agree. We had an H23 for some years; it has the fixed wing keel and is cast iron, not lead - Cuttysark's keel looks totally different to me. Was the swing keel version cast in lead? I'm also willing to bet that isn't the original trailer either...
     


  10. Crazy Dave Condon

    Crazy Dave Condon

    Joined Jun 8, 2004
    6,152 posts, 434 likes
    -na -NA
    US Anywhere USA
    No all cast iron. Hunter built boats with a shoal draft swing keel, then added winglets and finally went to cast iron wing keels with a more substantial hull. The biggest problem is the trailer and I can see what is causing this, bouncing around on the trailer plus the weight at the back of the shoal keel version pushing in because the right height of the bunk supports is not there. Personally, I would take the boat off, remove the supports or stalks as mentioned by some for longer ones, make the bases for the supports straight up and down adding side supports, checking and replacing any wood and raise that hull with emphasis on the back. This problem should have been seen with the new owner walking away. Why, I see some new white caulking in the bilge area not knowing who put it there which would be indicative something was going on.
     


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  11. cuttysark

    cuttysark

    Joined Dec 16, 2017
    4 posts, 1 likes
    hunter 23
    us cle

    Crazy Dave, thank you for the advise. Just from lifting it with the 2x4's I can see some improvements inside and out. I think it is the origional trailer since it is stamped 1985 and it has a faded fl. sticker on it. The keel tray board is solid and has a metal base. And the bunk boards are not rotton but the surface is soft with water from the melting snow. About 1/8". Also the biggest thing is see is that YES the bunk support post are way off on the port side and leaning heavily at the rear on the starboard side. I have some help coming next week to lift her up and fix the bunk post. I guess my ? is could this correct the problem or will there be more work such as digging in there and reinforceing things. I guess what I am asking is if she doesnt straighten out, thumbnail (2).jpg thumbnail (2).jpg thumbnail (3).jpg thumbnail.jpg thumbnail (1).jpg what is the process for fixing her. Here are some fresh pics.
     


    Last edited: Dec 18, 2017
  12. Crazy Dave Condon

    Crazy Dave Condon

    Joined Jun 8, 2004
    6,152 posts, 434 likes
    -na -NA
    US Anywhere USA
    Until you fix the problems with the trailer as I mentioned, lets take one step at a time and I will be glad to assist in information. You may also contact me via forum email and never put your personal email, phone, address and such information on this site for security reasons. Any information I do not share with anyone and once an issue is resolved or no contact from the other person, I remove all contact information plus I have both up to date virus and malware protection.
     


  13. isaksp00

    isaksp00

    Joined Apr 27, 2010
    865 posts, 41 likes
    Hunter 23
    US Lake Wallenpaupack
    Once you sort out the trailer support issues and see if the hull deformation resolves, I'd get all that caulk or whatever it is out of the floor pan and thoroughly clean the area. Then see if the glass there is structurally cracked and inspect the bolts. Depending on what you find, you may need to apply epoxy with glass cloth; I would not use any kind of caulk or silicone.
     


  14. cuttysark

    cuttysark

    Joined Dec 16, 2017
    4 posts, 1 likes
    hunter 23
    us cle
    Thank you that sounds very helpful. I was thinking about scraping the caulk out before it got pinched in there. Assuming that the hull will go back into shape. And I have been watching videos on fiberglass repair. (Just in case) which is usually my luck.
    Also just from the little bit I have lifted her the keel has already dropped about 1.5". Wish me luck that that is the fix. If not I will keep everyone updated either way.
     


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  15. Crazy Dave Condon

    Crazy Dave Condon

    Joined Jun 8, 2004
    6,152 posts, 434 likes
    -na -NA
    US Anywhere USA
    Cuttysark;
    In the spring, we will need to recontact with one another and see what you have. Then the second bit of work for repair of fiberglass will begin. That I do know and would not worry about any caulk in holes, cracks, etc. at this time other than make sure no water is getting into the boat and if so, cover the companionway or whatever needs to be done but never put a tarp over the mast without support or you will damage the mast. Until then keep me informed on the trailer and send me photos. I believe I sent you my phone number so feel free to call. I am in the eastern time zone but no calls on Sunday please.
     


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  16. Crazy Dave Condon

    Crazy Dave Condon

    Joined Jun 8, 2004
    6,152 posts, 434 likes
    -na -NA
    US Anywhere USA
    I have a planned call with Cuttysark on this Tuesday, January 2
     


  17. justsomeguy

    justsomeguy

    Joined Feb 20, 2011
    6,095 posts, 711 likes
    Island Packet 35
    US Tucson, AZ/San Carlos, MX
    Tell him to take smaller photos. :biggrin:

    Thank goodness for this Mexican internet speed. Much faster than the Ranch in the states.
     


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  18. Will Gilmore

    Will Gilmore

    Joined Oct 19, 2017
    1,920 posts, 740 likes
    O'Day 19
    US Littleton, NH
    Now, if only my calling plan came with Mexico coverage.
    - Will (Dragonfly)