KAP (kite aerial photography) ideas and a cool video

RussC

.
Sep 11, 2015
1,578
Merit 22- Oregon lakes
I'm on my bi-anual aerial photography research kick again ;) the concept of a drone is just so appealing, but also has so many drawbacks for use under sail that it's still hard for me to justify. I see a couple drones on the market now that even I might justify financially, but the logistics of using one under sail are still pretty daunting to me. The KAP system still looks interesting also, and seems to minimise a lot of the problems associated with drones like launching and landing under sail etc., but by the time one buys a kite, camera, 3 axis gimbal, electronics, etc, it's as much or more than a high end drone. huummmm. I'm interested in any ideas from those who came before me on this.
I do have an interesting idea of my own in mind, but during my research I ran across this old video and just had to share in the meantime. it was obviously made with low tech electronics, but also inspiring in so many ways, even beyond the actual KAP. enjoy:
 
Last edited:
Aug 3, 2012
2,542
Performance Cruising Telstar 28 302 Watkins Glen
Meh... one angle of view seems boring. I get to do “sail by” shots at low level, chase cam, panoramic, fly over shots...

You can attach floats to the drone to prevent it from sinking if you crash land it.
 
Feb 17, 2006
5,274
Lancer 27PS MCB Camp Pendleton KF6BL
Sometimes simple is better. I enjoyed the video and Enya. Thanks for sharing.
 
  • Like
Likes: RussC
Oct 19, 2017
7,733
O'Day 19 Littleton, NH
That looks cool.:pimp:
In one of the other threads that have just popped up about drones, someone pointed out that there are drones that can be roboticized to focus on following the masthead. A transom arch for solar panels could also act as a landing pad. Maybe a built-in electromagnet to hold the drone steady until take-off or retrieval.

With a programmed focus/tracking point on the boat, preprogrammed maneuvers could be executed, such as circling, pendulum fly-bys, etc.

Maybe soon, there will be a flying submarine drone that can take video of the keel cutting through the water, then break the surface to spiral around the boat to get the deck, crew and sail.

-Will (Dragonfly)
 

DArcy

.
Feb 11, 2017
1,691
Islander Freeport 36 Ottawa
For some fun you can buy today, how about a Seabreacher? Why not sell your boat (and your house) so you can enjoy a semi submersible joy ride.
 
  • Like
Likes: Will Gilmore

RussC

.
Sep 11, 2015
1,578
Merit 22- Oregon lakes
Meh... one angle of view seems boring.
Sorry you're not impressed. [shrug] I thought a guy sailing single handed, sometimes with spinnaker set, and simultaneously launching and retrieving a KAP would at least raise an eyebrow. I guess not. ;)

How much wind can you fly your drone in wile sailing? no problem launching or landing in sailing winds?
 
Aug 3, 2012
2,542
Performance Cruising Telstar 28 302 Watkins Glen
Sorry you're not impressed. [shrug] I thought a guy sailing single handed, sometimes with spinnaker set, and simultaneously launching and retrieving a KAP would at least raise an eyebrow. I guess not. ;)

How much wind can you fly your drone in wile sailing? no problem launching or landing in sailing winds?
I thought it was attractive, and he definitely gets high points for single handing it! So, yes, he raised my eyebrows! I don’t think I would do it singlehanded. I would definitely make a rod and reel part of my kit. Then, he could just ease the drag to let the kite up, and reel it in.

I have done mine 5 or 6 knots so far. It will fly in up to 20 knots. The tough thing about flying where I sail is we tack often in our narrow lake. Last season was our first with the drone and the boat, so we focused on learning the boat. The Mavic Pro drone is easy to fly, but my wife is not ready with this boat to have me let her sail it for long while I fly! I have flown the drone off my motorboat in higher winds and while chasing the boat at higher speeds. It was cool, but we stop to launch and land.
This is the video.
 

hewebb

.
Oct 8, 2011
329
Catalina Catalina 25 Joe Pool Lake
If you buy a drone be careful what you get. I bought one that carries a GO Pro camera and have made some good videos. I have not launched it from the boat because it will not fly within 8' to 12' of the controller and I may not be able to bring it back to the boat. I have not tried yet. That feature has caused me to crash it once while walking around while flying. Guess I need to try while at the marina and can land on the dock away from the boat.
 

RussC

.
Sep 11, 2015
1,578
Merit 22- Oregon lakes
If you buy a drone be careful what you get. I bought one that carries a GO Pro camera and have made some good videos. I have not launched it from the boat because it will not fly within 8' to 12' of the controller and I may not be able to bring it back to the boat. I have not tried yet. That feature has caused me to crash it once while walking around while flying. Guess I need to try while at the marina and can land on the dock away from the boat.
I'm looking at the second generation UpAir one drone at ~$300. less than that and it's pure junk. if I spend much more on one I'd have to move in with the dog if it went in the lake ;) . for one thing I like the big dedicated screen that comes with the UpAir , as I've never even owned a smart phone etc.
One of our two main sailing lakes has a couple swim platforms out in the lake, so I'm wondering how it would work out to set the drone in the middle of that, launch from there as we go by, once under sail. send it home after filming and drop sail to pick it up again.
DSCN0596.jpg
If it was too windy for the drone to fly on it's own, I might try taking it up under a kite ;)
 
Last edited:

RussC

.
Sep 11, 2015
1,578
Merit 22- Oregon lakes
I thought it was attractive, and he definitely gets high points for single handing it! So, yes, he raised my eyebrows! I don’t think I would do it singlehanded. I would definitely make a rod and reel part of my kit. Then, he could just ease the drag to let the kite up, and reel it in.

I have done mine 5 or 6 knots so far. It will fly in up to 20 knots. The tough thing about flying where I sail is we tack often in our narrow lake. Last season was our first with the drone and the boat, so we focused on learning the boat. The Mavic Pro drone is easy to fly, but my wife is not ready with this boat to have me let her sail it for long while I fly! I have flown the drone off my motorboat in higher winds and while chasing the boat at higher speeds. It was cool, but we stop to launch and land.
I also thought about using an off-shore fishing reel for the kite. sure would add an extra hand to all that would be going on.
interesting song choice on your video ;)
 
Feb 17, 2006
5,274
Lancer 27PS MCB Camp Pendleton KF6BL
...
interesting song choice on your video ;)
Better that Christopher Cross' Sailing. I know, a lot of people like that song, but everyone plays it and I am sick of it. LOL (I actually do like it, but in moderation).
 
  • Like
Likes: Will Gilmore
Oct 22, 2014
20,995
CAL 35 Cruiser #21 moored EVERETT WA
Russ Perhaps you need a drone pilot to do the video filming of you solo sailing on the lake. Then you can edit it later. You should be able to find a kid to fly it. Saves having to learn.
 
  • Like
Likes: Kermit
Oct 19, 2017
7,733
O'Day 19 Littleton, NH
Better that Christopher Cross' Sailing. I know, a lot of people like that song, but everyone plays it and I am sick of it. LOL (I actually do like it, but in moderation).
I feel that way about Stairway To Heaven and a few other great classics. Great songs but, enough already:deadhorse:

- Will (Dragonfly)
 
Aug 2, 2005
1,155
Pearson 33-2 & Typhoon 18 Seneca Lake
Interesting, fun, winter-time viewing. RE: fishing rod. We usually fly our kites with a fishing rod. My dad taught me that method when I was a little shaver (actually, before I was a shaver!). I do wonder about the lifting ability of the kite and the type of kite that would carry a camera aloft. Interestingly, we just gave our granddaughter a kite for her 7th birthday. I wonder whether she would let grandpa experiment with her birthday present?
 
  • Like
Likes: Kermit
Jul 1, 1998
3,062
Hunter Legend 35 Poulsbo/Semiahmoo WA
Russ - this is a good post thread and I wish there were more positive replies. Seems if a person wants input for ideas they have to post the finest and best solutions in the original post to avoid getting pot shots.

Anyway, great thought, and I've had the same one for some time. Several years ago I saw a kite flying cam video of a guy sailing his boat and it was awesome, something I'd like have for our boat. Tried to find it via a search but no luck. So many of the videos on-line now use "old technology" with a swinging cam hanging from the kite line but since the development of light weight gimbals the quality has increased immensely.

Here is a video of a J24 using a kite with a gimbal:

We have a number of videos of our boat but taken from on deck while sailing but it just isn't the same. It would be super to have some aerial shots, especially when out in a cruising destination as it would really add to the story line. I think that a gimbal setup will be a required item for ease of view.

Last year I got a Sony FDR-AX53 cam specifically for on-board shots while sailing. It has the BOSS lens gimbal system and really helps with keeping the video steady, not 100% perfect but almost. Looking at a Sony X3000 sport cam as a possible supplement for dealing with a wetter environment. It can also be controlled via an iPhone app, as can the AX53. Maybe the X3000 plus a kite and a gimbal will be the solution.
 

RussC

.
Sep 11, 2015
1,578
Merit 22- Oregon lakes
Russ - this is a good post thread and I wish there were more positive replies. Seems if a person wants input for ideas they have to post the finest and best solutions in the original post to avoid getting pot shots.
;) Well... ya, but it's just the nature of the beast these days John. just have to pick out the nuggets from the pyrite. it's all good ;)
Anyway, great thought, and I've had the same one for some time. Several years ago I saw a kite flying cam video of a guy sailing his boat and it was awesome, something I'd like have for our boat. Tried to find it via a search but no luck. So many of the videos on-line now use "old technology" with a swinging cam hanging from the kite line but since the development of light weight gimbals the quality has increased immensely.
Agreed! there is NO WAY that a drone would be able to get most of the shots in the video you shared. looked to be 15+ and gusty in some of it, besides being in the crowded cockpit etc. the best video would be when you could not fly a drone safely.
Your video does point out a complaint about most KAP setups I've seen so far however. wile viewing I felt compelled to reach out and raise the camera angle to show the top of the sail. the gimbal sure made the video much more steady than the typical picovet (sp) setup, but not having some panning control would make me crazy.
Which brought me to why I'd like to have the option to hang a drone under a kite in higher winds (propeller not turning of course). think about it: Many of the advantages of a drone, but the ability to fly it in just about any wind conditions you'd want to sail in. the best video is going to be in stronger conditions, not just loafing along in 5-6 kt smooth sunset breezes (IMHO). I'd love to get some video using the drone by itself when we get the spinnaker up in those sunset conditions, but I do like the big boy stuff also ;)
As to the kite itself. I'm looking at either the 78" (2M) Rokkaku or a power sled 24. both should lift a 2lb drone with no problem and be a pretty steady platform for the camera, as well as being fairly easy to launch and recover from the boat. I might be leaning a bit towards the sled, just because it would pack down smaller/quicker for transport.
We have a number of videos of our boat but taken from on deck while sailing but it just isn't the same. It would be super to have some aerial shots, especially when out in a cruising destination as it would really add to the story line.
Absolutely! I'm on it ;)
 
Last edited:
Oct 19, 2017
7,733
O'Day 19 Littleton, NH
wile viewing I felt compelled to reach out and raise the camera angle to show the top of the sail.
There is a video corrections algorithm developed and used with security surveillance 180 degree + fisheye lenses. It straightens out the distorted image into an easily panned frame. Thus, with no moving parts, a camera attendant can seemingly pan the area covered by the camera at will in live time. If your drone camera were using a wide angle lens, you could virtually tilt the camera up to show the top of the mast within the video editor.

- Will (Dragonfly)
 
Jul 1, 1998
3,062
Hunter Legend 35 Poulsbo/Semiahmoo WA
As to the kite itself. I'm looking at either the 78" (2M) Rokkaku or a power sled 24. both should lift a 2lb drone with no problem and be a pretty steady platform for the camera, as well as being fairly easy to launch and recover from the boat. I might be leaning a bit towards the sled, just because it would pack down smaller/quicker for transport.
The kite filming project has been on my back burner but this year it might be moved up. Still "winter" here so the projects are more indoor type.

After looking at the non-ginbal videos I'd much rather go the gimbal, albeit more expensive route. Haven't been through the system analysis to determine weights, capabilities, and kite requirements, but I think a gimbal system, for me, is a requirement.

Will mentioned an interesting aspect - the video correction algorithm that has been used by surveillance cams. This is a relatively new tech development and is also used in conjunction with VR (Virtual Reality) cam systems so that could be an option. My gut feel, without researching it, is I'd probably prefer to go with a regular cam setup. But there's definitely a time and a place for that technology.

There are a lot of new developments all the time so it is difficult to stay up to date with the changing "landscape". The YI 4K+ is another interesting low cost option to the Go Pro.