Hunter 356 heave to in heavy weather

[clmooring]

I would like to hear experiences of 356 owners (or similar vintage/design hunters) with heaving to as a heavy weather strategy. I understand that large main with small jib, high free board, and shoal fin keel will all work against her when it comes to heaving to as a storm tactic.... which was going to be my go to strategy, but i dont have real heavy weather experience yet. Thanks

 

[jssailem]

One way to deal with “heavy weather” is to avoid it.

That said, not all boats “heave to” and stay in that state of passive motion. It is a matter of trying to find the balance point for your boat. Take it out in moderate weather and see if you can configure your boat to stay in the magic neutral spot and slowly slid to leeward in it’s own slick. Once you find the spot in moderate conditions, then go out and try it under increasing weather environ.

You will be having to reef the main to find your balance point. If you have only 1 reef point you might not be successful. You may find that no main and a small jib (furled 80%) will be your magic zone.

When unsuccessful with “heave to” you can reach the same state of storm control by a drag. A small sea anchor attached to the bow and tensioned back to the winch so that the boat is positioned as it would be for “heave to” against the waves & wind but is being held by the drag (sea anchor).

Each boat is different. It is best to discover your best options before you have to use them.

 

[chuckwayne]

If you have in-mast furling, you should be able to find your balance point; I've practiced heaving to successfully with Escape but every boat will be different - experiment before you need it. You can use a sea anchor, or try fore reaching which also works well

 

[Terry Cox]

One way to deal with “heavy weather” is to avoid it.

That strategy has always worked here. Just hunker down until the unsettled weather passes. Of course it helps to cruise in protected waters, eh?

 

[jssailem]

Yes it does Terry. Like we learned earlier this spring.

 

[clmooring]

I do have in mast furling and i am practicing in fair conditions. But reading "sailing a serious ocean", the author doesn't seem too enthusiastic about heaving to in a boat with h356 design characteristics in heavy weather.

 

[Hayden Watson]

I have hove to hundreds of times. I heave usually at least once almost every time I sail. I do it to practice, eat lunch, hit the head. I have done it hundreds of times in all weather. I have also taught classes to our sailing club on the procedure. What I have found is that if the boat is properly setup for sailing upwind in balance, it will heave to with that same configuration. In 5-16 for me that is full main and genoa. 16-20 is reefed main and full genoa. 20-30 reefed main and roller reefed genoa. Over 30, 2nd reef and smaller area on the genoa.
Basically, if I am balanced upwind, it will be balanced hove to.

 

[Paul356]

Well, I have a 356 and it does heave to, in its own way, and very helpfully.
In heavy weather: Furl the jib. Head into the wind and waves at maybe 50 or 60 degrees (some experimentation required). Ease the boom until the main is just luffing. Lock the wheel so it is just bringing the bow slightly into the wind. Make slight adjustments until you reach a steady state. Stand back and admire how well the ship will round up slightly, back off slightly, take the waves easily, and probably make 2 or 3 K progress to wind. I've used this both with full and reefed main.

The best example of this technique came in a wild downwind ride, one reef, where the gps actually spiked to 14 mph on one surf, and we averaged an actual 9 mph, 5 hours on a 45 mile sail pierhead to pierhead. It was a handful the whole time. But halfway through, nature called. We rounded up, did what I just described, and the boat settled quietly into the 4-footers while we tended to business.
In lighter air, you can leave the jib up; you just don't want it grabbing a gust in heavy air and swinging the bow down and upsetting the balance.
I've hove-to like this to reef single-handed. (I have the full main.) That works swell, too.

 

[peacheykeen]

As heaving-too requires a balance between a back-winded jib and the rudder "trying to" drive the boat to windward, using the main is counter intuitive as a balanced boat should fore-reach slowly -1-1.5 knots, yes sliding sideways and creating a calming slick to windward. We use the heave-too for calming the boat for the galley crew and for a safe deck when reefing the main; thus the main is luffing, or secured and is not part of the 'active' sail power,
IN high winds a backwinded full genoa will unbalance any boat and probably drive it around to an accidental gybe especially with a fin keel -spade rudder underbody. On my heavy displacement, high sided cutter rig, I use 1/2 of a 130%, or the staysail and tiller to leeward to successfully balance the boat for trimming the main to it's third reef - so that is in 25-35knots- and it does balance.
A boat with a spade rudder - a dynamic foil compared to a full keel-slab rudder, should be able to balance with 1/2 genoa- equivalent to a #3 jib(?)- and no main.
As previously mentioned, it's a matter of experimenting to figure out what works best on your boat.
"All cars are basically the same, but all cars are different", Same with boats.

 

[Wsailing1]

I have a Hunter 340 and have hove-to hundreds of times, mostly while teaching sailing. I have been hove-to in the boat in 52 knots. The jib must be partially furled in those conditions and the main reefed and ON CENTERLINE. In other words, completely pulled in. Otherwise, the boat will fall off to broad reach and jibe - which is disastrous in those conditions. The boat should stay 60 degrees off the wind on A CLOSE REACH. This needs to be practiced in moderate conditions. Caution - the boat will make up to 1-2 knots leeway, so you'll need room.

 

[clmooring]

You completely furl your jib in heavy wind? I have only ever heaved to with jib back winded.

 

[jssailem]

@Paul356 You have calmed the boat, and this is a good thing. You are not really in a “hove-to” condition.
The Hove-to condition has the boat not sailing forward but actually sliding sideways down the wave and wind at about 1kt. The sliding down wind means as the seas roll under the boat they are calmed as the boat slides along with them in a stalled condition. If you move forward as described you will be sailing out of that calmed sea and back into the sea state you are trying to limit.

Interesting there were other tricks used to calm the waves so that they did not roll the boat. Sailors would pour oil onto the water, and then try to stay in the oil patch. They would point the boat down wind but throw out a 300 foot “long warp” as a sea anchor to slow the boat and have the seas break around the boat.

There is what is called a “Sea Drogue” or Ocean Brake. Don Jordon is identified as the inventor of the Ocean brake. It serves the same purpose as the 300 - 600 foot warp in a more efficient package. One of the issues is you need to have the drogue long enough so that it is in the waves at least 3 crest behind the boat. Otherwise the drogue fails and is just something else blowing in the wind as your boat goes careening down the waves at lightening speeds.

 

[Paul356]

You completely furl your jib in heavy wind? I have only ever heaved to with jib back winded.

As WS notes, backwinding a jib on a boat with a fin keel and spade rudder is most likely going to result in a quick and disastrous jib. Hence the jib is out of the equation. A fin/spade boat is not going to heave-to in the traditional sense of the word. Or, if you can heave to with a backwinded jib in a fin/spade boat, then that works for you, and great. What WS and I describe are essentially the same process, but you can see there are some differences for different boats. Yes, the boat will track, possibly upwind, possibly sideways, possibly to lee. Someone asked about heaving to in a 356 and I can relate first-hand 356 experience. WS experience in a 34 with similar underbody also would be very valid. Experiment. Enjoy the calm.

 

[jssailem]

Hence the jib is out of the equation

Not really. A small backwinded jib serves to push the bow down, a reefed main serves to push the bow up. The rudder is lashed to steer the boat into the wind. The balance stalls the boat in place. The wind on the boat’s freeboard and the stalled condition allow the boat to slide to the lee at about 1kt an hour. This is the hove-to condition.

Some boats do it better than others. You can create the same thing in heavy (50kt wind conditions) with less or no sail, but dragging a drogue in the water off the bow with a line to the stern. You position the drogue between the bow and stern to keep the boat bow 60 degrees into the on coming swell yet still drifting to the lee.

 

[chuckwayne]

What Paul is doing is really fore reaching, where the scalloping course keeps the boat slow and stable without enough power to cause heeling or erratic behavior. If that works for him, he should try reefing the main some to slow down even more

 

[jssailem]

Right you are Chuck. The fore reaching technique works to a point, and while similar in heavy weather it does not deal with big waves well. The whole benefit of being Hove-to is the side slip that helps reduce the impact of waves. If you sail out of your side slip you loose that benefit.

 

[clmooring]

I have so much to learn here. As i mentioned earlier, i read sailing serious ocean by john kretschmer. He seems to recommend heaving to and if conditions worsen to the point that heaving to is becoming in effective then resort to fore reaching as a last/best resort. Havent read up on exactly how to fore reach yet. However i did just get back from a little 3 day trip (stopping at marinas at night) around the southern chesapeake. Happy to report my roller furling main is a wonderful thing! Made taking sail in with 25 knot wind a breeze.

 

[Don Lucas]

One way to deal with “heavy weather” is to avoid it.

.

well that takes magic