ditching the kicker

May 3, 2018
28
macgregor 26S trailer sailed from Kitimat
I own a 93 26S and am looking to ditch the old broken unreliable outboard and all liquid fuel for it, looking for alternatives that won't break the yearly sailing budget. Does any owners of same or similar use a yuloh oar or similar device for movement to or from the dock. The other reason is to use the fuel storage area for other things than a explosion or fire source. Not willing to go electric at this time
 
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Sep 25, 2008
294
1970 Venture by Macgregor 21 Clayton, NC
The cheapest is call sails. Man moved all over the world before the engine was invented.
Yes it is slightly facetious, but you can do a lot under sail. The tendency today is if there is any skill required to use the sail the motor is started and used until the situation is passed. However, there are actually very few situation where the motor is required, but most of the time you just have to be patient.
 
May 3, 2018
28
macgregor 26S trailer sailed from Kitimat
At the local boat ramp there is a mostly nasty cross wind that has placed me on the rocks at the entrance to the marina before that I'd rather avoid that and the cross wind goes up or down the channel and is not pleasant on the return mostly I do sail mostly not motor any more than required. Gas in the tanks is very old but may work in my lawn mower, it was free with a bent crank shaft and I don't care if it works or not
 
Jan 5, 2017
2,263
Beneteau First 38 Lyall Harbour Saturna Island
Seen a bigger ( maybe 35’) come into Port McNeil with a yuloh. @Will Gilmore seems to be the expert on yulohs around here. Not far from Kitimat tonight (Hartley Bay)
 
Oct 19, 2017
7,732
O'Day 19 Littleton, NH
Thanks for the plug, but I'm far from an expert, just interested in building and installing one on Dragonfly. From what I've read, there is plenty of power in a well designed yuloh. 30'-35' is about the largest modern vessel I've heard of using one. There are ancient models of Chinese galleys (junks?) that show gang yulohs powering them.

Just google "Chinese Yuloh" and click on images. There is even a good video of someone maneuvering a sailboat of about 28' through a marina.
I have looked, but couldn't find a commercial source for yulohs. So, I've also been wondering if there is a business opportunity there.
You can check out my thread on them called "Yuloh What I'm Talking About"
https://forums.sailboatowners.com/index.php?threads/yuloh-what-im-talking-about.189784/

Good luck.

-Will (Dragonfly)
 
May 3, 2018
28
macgregor 26S trailer sailed from Kitimat
Thanks Will I'll check it out the link
 
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Joe

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Jun 1, 2004
7,999
Catalina 27 Mission Bay, San Diego
A set of "sweeps" would be easy to add.... these are long oars that you power while standing, facing forward in the cockpit. Oarlocks on the gunwhales, the sweeps are stored on deck or hanging from the lifelines. There 30 footer in our marina basin that uses them effectively.
 
Oct 19, 2017
7,732
O'Day 19 Littleton, NH
There 30 footer in our marina basin that uses them effectively.
This is interesting. I discounted oars because of their limitations for maneuverability in close quarters (extra wide sweeping room needed, in a marina). The yuloh is only off the stern, so I thought it had advantages when docking. If that can be over come with good technique and experience, I could get there with that. It also seemed like one sculling oar, even a bent one, would be easier to stow than two straight oars. I plan on making mine hollow with a bungy down the center so it could come apart and store in four foot sections.

-Will (Dragonfly)
 
Mar 26, 2011
3,399
Corsair F-24 MK I Deale, MD
26-foot boat? I strongly recommend you learn more about outboards and solve the gasoline storage problem. I doubt a person can ever produce more than ~ 0.2-0.3 hp through oars for more than a few moments, and most would consider 6hp to be the usual minimum. At best, oars will be like a motor at idle; useful ONLY if there is so little wind there is no use in going sailing!

(Yes, I have paddled a boat that size, several times. I'd get a smaller boat.)

Outboards can be very reliable. You just have to feed them right.

----

And then after watching this video (and similar) I take some of it back. Not for me, but plausible.
 
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May 3, 2018
28
macgregor 26S trailer sailed from Kitimat
A small bit of info here, I have 10 plus years as a mercury outboard mechanic and mercury certified, marine mechanic, small engine certified from BCVS Vancouver, auto and diesel truck mechanic. I personally have an unhealthy dislike for anything that stores fuel in a sealed locker and makes an awful noise and stink when running. I know it is not required after away from the dock and on the return to the dock but my experience with my P.O.S motor that you can no longer get any parts for has been a sore point for a while, there is nothing on it that I cannot fix but it breaks only when you need its best efforts, it failed me every time out last year, the straw was having to get a tow off the rocks just north of the marina entrance good cross wind and tidal flow south and sails down then a ride on the rocks with the wife's first sail we laugh today.
Motor is an old 8 hp Tohatsu long shaft, comes out of the water on a following sea I think the space used for fuel could carry other useful stuff for the 150 lbs of fuel in the back right corner of the boat and the 60 lbs motor to the rear of that.
 
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Oct 19, 2017
7,732
O'Day 19 Littleton, NH
I personally have an unhealthy dislike for anything that stores fuel in a sealed locker and makes an awful noise and stink when running.
:plus:
I'm going electric (86# thrust trolling motor) on my Mariner 19. The yuloh is to be my backup oar. I have a feeling it will become more of a primary aux once I get use to it. Also, I just want to try it out.
I have a few projects and jobs ahead of it, but if you're not in a hurry, I could be persuaded to make two. Mine is planned to be about 16' long. That would be minimal for a boat your size.

-Will (Dragonfly)
 
May 3, 2018
28
macgregor 26S trailer sailed from Kitimat
Thanks for the offer Will I think I'll go with the 10 dollar build, I'm leaving the motor mount as an external mount placement for the yuloh pivot point pin or an oar lock I have one somewhere, I wonder like skulling is it possible to reverse with a pitch change on the oar part in the water this might require a way to change the pitch angle to pull back instead of push another problem would be the lifting of the oar in reverse, skulling in the Bahamas use a loop of small rope over the oar shaft to lock the oar to a notch in the transom. Basic hold down
 
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Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
The cheapest is call sails. Man moved all over the world before the engine was invented.
Yes it is slightly facetious, but you can do a lot under sail. The tendency today is if there is any skill required to use the sail the motor is started and used until the situation is passed. However, there are actually very few situation where the motor is required, but most of the time you just have to be patient.
You forget that boats sometimes used to wait for days for favorable conditions to enter a harbor.
 
Oct 19, 2017
7,732
O'Day 19 Littleton, NH
You forget
Ha ha ha ha
Yeah, do you not remember? Good times. ;)

I wonder like skulling is it possible to reverse with a pitch change on the oar part in the water this might require a way to change the pitch angle to pull back instead of pus
Probably something like that. It is an issue I have been wondering about, but haven't found a good description of.

-Will (Dragonfly
 
Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
Probably something like that. It is an issue I have been wondering about, but haven't found a good description of.

-Will (Dragonfly
Guys. ;^)

The sculling oar depends on the end of sweep facing the direction of movement to be narrower then the downstream side. Just like the pitch of a prop. A prop can be reversed. On an oar that fundamentally cannot be turned around. Think about it!
 
Jan 1, 2006
7,039
Slickcraft 26 Sailfish
You forget that boats sometimes used to wait for days for favorable conditions to enter a harbor.
The English ships entered and left harbors on the tide. I assume so in New England.
Sweeps were tried by Gary Hoyt on the iconic Freedom 40. They eventually put an engine in it. You can maneuver in a marina with the sweeps - a bit awkward but possible. But if you have to move the boat upwind or against current, like approaching a mooring, not so good. I always wondered about storage. Maybe one sweep could double duty as a whisker pole?
 
Oct 19, 2017
7,732
O'Day 19 Littleton, NH
Guys. ;^)

The sculling oar depends on the end of sweep facing the direction of movement to be narrower then the downstream side. Just like the pitch of a prop. A prop can be reversed. On an oar that fundamentally cannot be turned around. Think about it!
The angle of the blade (pitch) as it is swept from side to side determines the direction of lift (propulsion). The bend in the loom of a yuloh helps make that angle (pitch). The basic movement is to have the end of the loom lead your pull and push.
If you reverse that so the end follows instead, wouldn't that reverse the pitch of the bladed to move you in reverse? It wouldn't be nearly as efficient, both because the angle of the blade is pulling up as well as back, and because the yuloh blade is often shaped like a symmetric wing in cross section (taperred at the edges and thick in the middle with the after face flatter than the forward face). There would still be some force generated in the reverse direction, I would think.

-Will (Dragonfly)
 
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Jim26m

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Apr 3, 2019
579
Macgregor 26M Mobile AL
At the local boat ramp there is a mostly nasty cross wind that has placed me on the rocks at the entrance to the marina before that I'd rather avoid that and the cross wind goes up or down the channel and is not pleasant on the return mostly I do sail mostly not motor any more than required.
There is something beautiful (to me) about the yuloh. I like the look of it. It's made of wood. The motion of the yuloh and the boat is rhythmic and pleasing. I can think of nothing more wonderful than sliding out of a quiet anchorage or marina, early in the morning under yuloh power. Almost need a cigarette just thinking about it.

But...

I've come into my usual ramp in a howling cross wind. The area is just barely big enough to accommodate a 26 ft boat, much less allow tacking. There is covered, in water, boat storage all around the ramp, and wooden bulkhead anywhere there isn't a boat. Granted, my boat has more windage than yours, (maybe more windage than a container ship), but I've gotten into some tight situations that just couldn't be dealt with using a yuloh. I was glad I had a running outboard to keep me from crashing into other boats, pilings, etc. Full disclosure: my kicker is a 60hp Etec. Yes, it's one of those later Macgregors.

I frequently sail with a friend on his Potter 19. He's got a vintage Yamaha kicker that we run a good bit from his house, downriver to the bay. We rarely use a quart of fuel per trip, and the tank is mounted in the power head.

I think the yuloh is going to be a fun, elegant, propulsion method. But I would be tempted to follow Will's lead and get some sort of reliable kicker for the days/situations when the yuloh might not be the tool for the job. I get it. Nothing is more exhausting than an auxiliary that doesn't run reliably. Sounds like you've got enough game to either fix it, or know when it's time to replace it.
 
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