C-27 Refit/Refurb

caguy

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Sep 22, 2006
4,004
Catalina, Luger C-27, Adventure 30 Marina del Rey
Phil, you are replacing the head with a portable toilet? The original head looks like it has a much smaller foot print. What are the demensiona of your bathroom closet it looks much wider than mine in the pictures. I plan on installing the Thetford 465 but I'm not sure that it will fit.
 
Dec 11, 2008
1,338
catalina C27 stillwater
Phil, you are replacing the head with a portable toilet? The original head looks like it has a much smaller foot print. What are the demensiona of your bathroom closet it looks much wider than mine in the pictures. I plan on installing the Thetford 465 but I'm not sure that it will fit.
The porta-potty was in there for test fitting only. It is out of my Stingray powerboat. I am using the porcelain head; it is a custom Vetus SMTO2. A boat company near me had a surplus, so I got one relatively cheap, for what it is. The Vetus is quite a bit larger than the porta potty.

The width of the head closet is 28.25. I am not recalling the distance from the hull wall to the compression post. Trust me, the head closet felt REAL small to me too, until I started actually fitting things in. It felt the smallest with just the tape up when I was working out where the countertop might be and how deep it should be. Once all the pieces are fitted, it seems MUCH larger. As heads go for boats this size, it feels rather spacious. I am not going to install a door; it woudl bang knees. Rather I am looking at curtains on a track that close off across between the head closet and the hanging locker.

The sink bowl is 13" diameter unit. I have a 10.5 " sink for the galley, and in hindsight, the 10.5" sink would be sufficient for the head as well.
 
Dec 11, 2008
1,338
catalina C27 stillwater
How about a set of double swinging louvered saloon doors? That would be sort of nautical, if done corectly... :D
 

caguy

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Sep 22, 2006
4,004
Catalina, Luger C-27, Adventure 30 Marina del Rey
What if the bathroom door was made to swing as a right hand door such that it closed off the head from the saloon. This would make the head really spacious. It could also give privacy to the forward birth. In the closed position it would be as originally designed.
 

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Dec 11, 2008
1,338
catalina C27 stillwater
What if the bathroom door was made to swing as a right hand door such that it closed off the head from the saloon. This would make the head really spacious. It could also give privacy to the forward birth. In the closed position it would be as originally designed.
It appears that this boat never had a door of any sort there, so the width of the two holes the door would occupy would be different. My thoughts about any closure would close off the head AND the v-berth from the saloon, in the same place you indicate a door.

I could install a stub wall on the head between the head opening and the v-berth to make the two openings the same size, but to me that makes the head seem smaller to my mind.

I will do some looking and measuring though to see if your proposal is doable. I have ALWAYS wanted a boat with a real door on the head, and despite my hesitation about shrinking the apparent space with the stub wall, if it worked I would be ALL over it!
 
Apr 5, 2010
565
Catalina 27- 1984 Grapevine
Phil, I appreciate the pic of the stern. I have owned my C27 for a little over a year and have never seen the bottom, your pic gives me a real good idea of why this beast backs so poorly. She goes in forward and will turn ballet moves but in reverse you really gotta give her a running start before trying to turn. For some reason the C30 people I know don't have the problem, but the C27s do.
 
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caguy

.
Sep 22, 2006
4,004
Catalina, Luger C-27, Adventure 30 Marina del Rey
I checked the boat and it is very doable. As is when the door is open it just clears the opposing closet. With a small jam on the closet and turning the door upside down and remounted on the existing stub wall. I opened the door as is and it really does make a huge difference. My Luger 30 head is laid out this way. It will be a winter project. For now I just want to get it into the water.
 

gdanza

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Sep 30, 2009
75
Catalina 22 Visalia, Ca
Regarding the Formica V. Trim question: Since you asked, I will tell you.... I can't picture Formica in anything but a tract house. Durable and easy to clean? - yes; cool custom? - not so much. I believe that inside every ugly oak tree, a dinette, hutch, headboard, mantle (etc) are just dying to get out. Trim is, in my humble opinion, trim... like wrapping paper on a gift, accents around useful items that make them more than functional, but attractive, ornate, or thoughtfully designed. It is the frame of the picture, and while not the picture, makes the picture more complete and appropriate for its' setting.
The work you are doing here is high-quality custom stuff, and again, in my humble opinion, is worthy of some fine wooden trim, and your skills deserve to be seen and appreciated.
Since you asked, I'm just sayin'....
 
Dec 11, 2008
1,338
catalina C27 stillwater
And for an almost unrelated post, Saturday was NOT spent on the boat. It was spent in the shop installing a new LP gas-fired infrared heater... This heater is supposed to put out 150,000 BTU... My hope is that this winter despite lack of insulation, working in the shop will be a t-shirt-only affair...
 

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Dec 11, 2008
1,338
catalina C27 stillwater
Regarding the Formica V. Trim question: Since you asked, I will tell you.... I can't picture Formica in anything but a tract house. Durable and easy to clean? - yes; cool custom? - not so much. I believe that inside every ugly oak tree, a dinette, hutch, headboard, mantle (etc) are just dying to get out. Trim is, in my humble opinion, trim... like wrapping paper on a gift, accents around useful items that make them more than functional, but attractive, ornate, or thoughtfully designed. It is the frame of the picture, and while not the picture, makes the picture more complete and appropriate for its' setting.
The work you are doing here is high-quality custom stuff, and again, in my humble opinion, is worthy of some fine wooden trim, and your skills deserve to be seen and appreciated.
Since you asked, I'm just sayin'....
Hmmm... I love wood too, to the point of fault... :) I already need to redo the brightwork on my 22...

I am literally and only talking about the walls in the head that are defined by the boat's bulkheads. My sensibilities say a white wall to the left and right of the head, (not in the salon) will brighten it up and make it feel bigger. ESPECIALLY since a previous owner replace the bulkhead under the mast already, but did it with some weird veneer plywod that does not look like teak, or oak or pine... I am not sure what it is, and the varnish on it is not up to my standards..

The two walls of the head are the only ones I am considering for Formica veneer. Does that change your opinion, or do you still feel strongly about these being a wood finish? There will still be tons of high-gloss varnished brightwork in there... :D
 
Feb 26, 2004
22,760
Catalina 34 224 Maple Bay, BC, Canada
Formica in the head. White DOES make it bigger. Also easier to clean. Do you have a shower in there?
 
Dec 11, 2008
1,338
catalina C27 stillwater
Formica in the head. White DOES make it bigger. Also easier to clean. Do you have a shower in there?
No shower... No plans for one either. :)

Thanks for the input Stu!

I got my first Mainsheet magazine the other day. Lots to digest. Glad to be a member!
 
Dec 11, 2008
1,338
catalina C27 stillwater
On a topic unrelated to the remodel, I was nervous about PO's claims to have run antifreeze through the A4 motor prior to last haulout. Last night, on a whim, I decided to carefuly crank the motor, with a helper first checking to make sure the prop shaft would not spin in a dry cutlass bearing during cranking. Upon satisfaction that I was not going to score the bearing, I cranked some more and with the choke on the motor quickly fired and quickly settled to a nice idle! I thought I was going to need to perform lots of work on th motor to get it running safely and reliably again, but that appears not to be the case. She spit out "some" green tinted water, likely mixed nasty green antifreeze, so at least the PO was partially correct in his statement. Tonight I am going to take 2 gallons of pink RV antifreeze home and suck them through the motor. Then the spark plugs come out and some Marvel is going in the cylinders. I may go ahead and change the oil, although it will be a bit slow, as I cannot run the engine long enough to warm the oil up.

Come commissioning time, I will be installing a fresh impeller, and probably a new thermostat, just in case.

I am real pleased to have heard such a smooth running motor!
 
Dec 11, 2008
1,338
catalina C27 stillwater
Been busy with the heater install in the shop, Thanksgiving, and the moving of a C&C Newport 27 I bought for parts. Not a lot of progress to show. the brightwork for the head had the old screw holes plugged, (nasty sloppy work by a previous installer in the Newport) has received a third coat of varnish in preparation for sanding flat. Hopefuly coat number 4 willl be a final gloss coat. Pics will follow after installation.

I have to share an endorsement. I usually research and set out to buy name brand product, and rarely buy the house brand. The C-27 came with a couple of quarts of West Marine - branded varnish. Now granted the stuff is made by Epiphanes, but still the stuff is a house brand. I am used to using Interlux jet speed and Schooner varnish, and use Sikkens Cetol often. Were I going to go buy products for finishing in varnish my instinct would be to go and get the Interlux stuff....

This West Marine varnish is wonderful stuff. It goes on markedly different from Schooner and differrent from Cetol for sure, but once you get the hang of it you will be impressed. The stuff is THICK! As a result it does not run or sag like the other stuff. You have to really push it to get it where you want it. It is slow to flow out flat after brushing but you gotta just trust that it will, and when it does, oh boy.... we are talking glass-smooth.

Additionally, the stuff seems to have a very high solids content. The build up is quick and impressive. I am used to needing 10 coats or so with other stuff to get to a point where I can get the surface sanding to a uniform flat that is not telegraphing wood grain. The West stuff is sanding flat in about 3 coats. Really amazing, and a lot quicker. It is really rewarding to be able to cut a varnishing schedule down by a third; this goes a long way towards removing the tedium of brightwork.



As a supplier to the marine industry, I am too familiar with the color white in all of its shades and the hassle the color white can give you. When doing something white you are virtually guaranteed to not match any white parts near your work or additions. I know of at least one manufacturer who has different white gelcoats for his cockpit liner and his hull... When color matching parts for the interior, you have to be sure you did not get gel samples from the hull. This is bearing truth in my head remodel as the white Formica is very bright compared to the boat's gelcoat liner and the bone color of the head. It is hard to tell in the attached pic, but there are three differing colors in there now. The walls will go to the Formica white and that will hopefully even things out, but I am counting on towels and carpet to pull the eye there... :D
Here is a quick dry fit of the cabinet in the head with the Formica in place and the varnished fiddle.

Enjoy!
 

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Feb 26, 2004
22,760
Catalina 34 224 Maple Bay, BC, Canada
Phil, you're right about the white. We have the same "multi-color" in our head, and I added even one more: used some plumber's silicone around the edges of the countertop to the formica and the countertop to the hull liner. I really don't think anyone would care. And we have a gray and a blue towel, plus a small picture, plus some bottles of hand cream (green). Think of it as a small, simple rainbow room!
 
Dec 11, 2008
1,338
catalina C27 stillwater
Those gaps on either side have got to go. Despite best efforts, they are still there. I have some thin fall-off from milling the mahogany, I guess I am going to have to varnish up a couple of strips and tab them in with a few dabs 0f 5200 after everything is installed.



Got that big Newport 27 home yesterday morning. It was a scary deal jacking her up in the mud to try and change a tire, then tugging on her sitting on a dual axle trailer with an axle missing.... We managed though, and after carefully bouncing out the rough alley behind the house we hauled her from, we managed up to 30 mph briefly running down a slight hill. Scary actually... We were over width, under lighted, under axled, over-weight, (not sure now much water remained in the hull) but we made it almost to exactly where I planned on parking her. The trip was short, only 4 miles, still... nerve-racking

I got to my shop, got turned around and started backing up. I was hearing this weird squeak that seemed to have a resonance, and seemed to be tied to the tires rolling. about 20 feet shy of where I intended to park here the last hub stud failed on the remaining right tire, (remember, I was towing a dual axle trailer on a single axle) and the trailer's fender dropped down onto the tire. Somehow coming home, the hub and wheel managed to slowly break all five studs off. All 5 neatly sheared off right at the hub-to-wheel mating surface.... That trailer is not moving for a little while....


Going to start stripping her of parts not already removed... The primary jib sheet winches from the Newport are going to the cabin top of the Catalina. The A4 was removed previously and disassembled for rebuild. I may put it back together and see what then, or I might sell it. The lead keel will be cut off and sold for scrap; I already have a buyer for 500 lbs of it. The trailer is sold. The brightwork drawers and doors for the Catalina head came from the Newport. I brought them home previously, about 3 weeks ago when I made the deal on the boat.

I bought the boat for less than the value of the parts I intend to use. I will come out ahead on the deal, less chainsaw sharpening bills.....
 
Apr 5, 2010
565
Catalina 27- 1984 Grapevine
This isn't by any chance that Newport that was for sale for so long on Texoma is it?
 
Dec 11, 2008
1,338
catalina C27 stillwater
I have been travelling the last few days, but had a chance to lay on some varnish before I left. I think I am close to being done with the brightwork for the head remodel. I am going to get fastening done for the door and the drawers, mounting them blind and from the rear so that the screws are not visible. Then I am going to probably get some very fine bronze wool and knock the sheen down some. Ths stuff is super smooth and glossy, but maybe too clossy for interior work.




A trick for anyone considering refinishing drawers or doors with recessed fingle holes such as these:

Sand and stain down in the hole as best as you can to get the color uniform just as you are doing with the rest of your refinishing work. On your first varnish coat, get a single coat of varnish in there, (it is a huge pain) to set the stain first, then varnish the rest of the workpiece. Do not varnish down in there on any subsequent coats. It is WAY too big a pain.

After you are finished with your final varnish coat for the surfaces of the drawer or door, clean out the recessed finger hole to remove any debris. Mix up a little epoxy and pour a thin coat in there, and roll the drawer around to get an even coat. Lay the drawer or door down so that the face and the bottom of the finger pull is horizontal. Pop any bubbles as necessary, and then just let the epoxy kick. Voila, smooth shiny flat finish down inside with about a minute's work.


See attached pics.
 

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