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Boat Trends

Discussion in 'Cruising Sailors' started by Craig Cook, Oct 12, 2017. Add this thread to a FAQ

  1. Craig Cook

    Craig Cook

    Joined Jun 3, 2010
    174 posts, 20 likes
    Hunter 27-3
    US Erie
    It has been an interesting few months, thought I would check in and update everyone.
    When we sold the IP we were getting out of boating. The Admiral talked me out of that and into a new boat with more up to date technology. We had a list of things that we based on our perceptions, talking with other boat owners and research. The current Hunter 27-3 checked every box with the exception of size for me, I wanted a 33' of the same vintage. Keeping in mind that the winter layup often means buying without trying, we have done that with the last three boats, all purchased when they were winterized.
    This past summer was a wild one for most everyone, no hurricanes for us but a series of cold fronts that continue to blow through and unreliable forecasts from the local guessers. We were caught out on the lake three times with winds well over our comfort level and learned the hard way just how tender this boat is (I have attached a video, boat is the same although we have in-mast furling which is a 3' taller mast and is 3 years newer).

    The last time out we were blown over a little quicker than I could react, the Admiral was tossed around and reinjured her back. After more discussion we decided again that it was time to sell.A couple in our club expressed interest but ultimately decided to purchase something older and bigger. We approached our favorite local broker to list it but I was shocked and disappointed to hear his answer. Basically, he said we have something that VERY few people are looking for, something newer but smaller. He said the trend is to take "X" number of dollars and do exactly what the other couple did, get a boat that is larger but older. He said he loves to list our boats because they are so well taken care of but we would have to "give it away" and likely lose $12-$15,000 or about 30% of what we paid for it two years ago (which was actually less than other 27-3's were going for at that time). Yes, we all know that boats don't appreciate in value but yikes! He had a 2006 h27-3 that had been for sale for four years, that owner finally donated it to a sailing school in Florida, unfortunately the week before Irma. We would also be paying for storage until it was sold. His advice was to keep it and sail it myself until such time as we were ready to just get rid if it.
    So we still have it, on the hard and covered for winter now. Come spring I guess we will re-evaluate things and figure out which direction to go.

    TomY and Rick D like this.
  2. Jackdaw


    Joined Nov 8, 2010
    8,780 posts, 2,113 likes
    Beneteau First 36.7 & 260
    US Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
    For sure, the market in the USA for full-on keelboats boats under 30 feet is very specialized. New they have to sell for US$100K+, and if you try and sell it used for over $50k you will be waiting a long time. Seems most people with $60k to spend want something in the 35 foot range, and are willing to go a few years older to get it.

  3. TomY

    TomY Alden Forum Moderator

    Joined Jun 22, 2004
    1,155 posts, 674 likes
    Alden 38' Challenger yawl
    US Rockport Harbor
    That is bleak, Craig. More and more free boats (projects) are showing up around here but I'm surprised by your brokers view on your boat (did he tell you this when you bought it 2 years ago?).

    Captain Larry-DH likes this.
  4. Skipper


    Joined Oct 9, 2008
    1,576 posts, 255 likes
    Bristol 29.9
    US Dana Point
    There are things you can do to improve the boat. Practice fast reefing for when the wind pipes up. Or just depart the harbor reefed. A light boat will still be fast when reefed in moderate wind. Set the reefing system up to be quick. There are systems.
    Also be fast on the mainsheet. I had a Catalina 250 wing keel years ago that was very twitchy and tender for ocean work. But I was able to control her in higher winds with practice.

    Also, you can add ballast. Get some lead/resin bricks to put in low parts of the bilge. They'd have to be secure of course.
    Good luck. :) It is what it is so you have to change the approach.

  5. Captain Larry-DH

    Captain Larry-DH

    Joined Jun 14, 2010
    351 posts, 122 likes
    Quorning Dragonfly 1200
    US home
    My reaction is similar to Tom's. Not to say anything negative about the broker, but it might be worthwhile to speak to others in your area to see if they offer the same perspective.

  6. Hayden Watson

    Hayden Watson

    Joined Apr 5, 2009
    526 posts, 105 likes
    Catalina '88 C30 tr/bs
    US Oak Harbor, WA
    The boat in that video looks really tender. Based on the waves there doesn't look to be more than 8-9 (edit) knt of wind (no white caps) and it is heeling 20º with up to 30º some of the time.

    Last edited: Oct 14, 2017
    Gene Neill likes this.
  7. Tally Ho

    Tally Ho

    Joined Jan 7, 2011
    983 posts, 124 likes
    Oday 322
    US East Chicago, IN
    That sounds rough. What year is the 27-3? Did you buy it new?

    I sail with some friends who own 2005-2007 H33's. Very nice boats, but over $100k new and probably in the $70k range for a used one today.

    I owned a 1996 Hunter 280. Sailed her for 5 years. Decent boat, but a little tender. Mine had a 5-foot keel and pointed very well, but heeled a fair amount.

    Bought it for $15k and sold it for $12 or $13 K after 5 years. I bought a bigger boat and wanted to get rid of the 280 before winter storage was due, so knocked $1000 off my asking price.


  8. uncledom


    Joined Jun 11, 2011
    990 posts, 184 likes
    Hunter 41
    US Lewes
    There should be a ton of buyers after this years round of storms. It can't hurt to list it.

  9. Ned Ludd

    Ned Ludd

    Joined Apr 4, 2016
    200 posts, 84 likes
    Newport 28
    US Richardson Marina
    She handles pretty good in a hurricane :kick:

  10. DaveEvans


    Joined Feb 11, 2017
    22 posts, 8 likes
    We chartered a 27-3 some years ago in the Keys. Guy had a fleet of them. May be where these go. Yours would have been in much better shape!

  11. Hayden Watson

    Hayden Watson

    Joined Apr 5, 2009
    526 posts, 105 likes
    Catalina '88 C30 tr/bs
    US Oak Harbor, WA
    D'oh! Where did that hyphen go? :doh:

  12. Calif. Ted

    Calif. Ted

    Joined Jun 8, 2004
    2,109 posts, 130 likes
    Catalina 320
    US Dana Point
    The video is shot in San Diego bay, I can't tell what the wind is but it would take a hurricane to raise whitecaps in there.

    Jackdaw likes this.
  13. Hayden Watson

    Hayden Watson

    Joined Apr 5, 2009
    526 posts, 105 likes
    Catalina '88 C30 tr/bs
    US Oak Harbor, WA
    We get whitecaps in Oak Harbor at 12 knots and it is only 1 mile across the longest dimension. Waves do not get very big given the small fetch but the wavelets still spill white off the tops.

  14. jssailem


    Joined Oct 22, 2014
    5,579 posts, 1,882 likes
    CAL 35 Cruiser
    US Salem, Moored Port Everett WA
    Hayden I have to think winds coming out of the South East (admittedly a rare condition), could make Oak harbor a bit sporty...

  15. Hayden Watson

    Hayden Watson

    Joined Apr 5, 2009
    526 posts, 105 likes
    Catalina '88 C30 tr/bs
    US Oak Harbor, WA
    Our trouble is always the west winds which have been recorded as high as 60 mph at the Harbormaster's office. Anything other than W to WSW is not a problem in Oak Harbor.

  16. Craig Cook

    Craig Cook

    Joined Jun 3, 2010
    174 posts, 20 likes
    Hunter 27-3
    US Erie
    Hi Tom, no, the broker didn't mention that two years ago. At that time he had two of these H27-3's listed, ours came on the market just as we started looking, it was 2 years newer than the others and priced less. Both of the others had been for sale for two years but were also "lightly maintained" as far as being prepped to sell. I think ours looked better because it had just been uncovered from winter storage.

  17. Craig Cook

    Craig Cook

    Joined Jun 3, 2010
    174 posts, 20 likes
    Hunter 27-3
    US Erie
    Larry, unfortunately this is the only broker within 100 miles. He has done a good job for us in the past and has been pretty straight up with previous sales and purchases.

  18. Craig Cook

    Craig Cook

    Joined Jun 3, 2010
    174 posts, 20 likes
    Hunter 27-3
    US Erie
    Greg, ours is a 2008, we did not buy it new but know the previous owner who ordered it from Hunter. He had never sailed before, checked every option box on the order form except the spinnaker gear. This is the deep draft 5' keel, weight is within a few hundred pounds of our old Island Packet so right around 8,000 pounds. I believe the issue is more physics than weight though. It has very high freeboard, a tall mast and as one of the lift crew said when we hauled for the season, "there really isn't much in the water is there?" It rides very high in the water which no doubt adds to the tenderness. The H33's you describe are exactly what I wanted, we have three couples with them in the club and they lover their boats. It was tough to justify another $30,000 in purchase price to the Admiral, at least at that time. There is currently one for sale here, asking is $76K.

  19. Simon Sexton

    Simon Sexton

    Joined Nov 1, 2017
    234 posts, 77 likes
    Catalina 25 Tall Rig
    Valiant US Watergate Marina, Kemah, TX
    The sail trim in that video was bothering me...........

  20. Will Gilmore

    Will Gilmore

    Joined Oct 19, 2017
    2,601 posts, 1,085 likes
    O'Day 19
    US Littleton, NH
    That last tac saw the main back winded by the staysail. As close hauled as she was I didn't get the impression she was pointing very high. Maybe the staysail could be let out just a bit more. Since the captain didn't adjust the sheets from tac to tac, I assume he was working his way up wind. With the deep roach so high up (full battens at the top) there is a lot of drive higher on the main. That would give it leverage to heel her more. The flat bottom helps but she doesn't look very wide either.
    Has anyone ever restepped the mast aft and converted to a cutter rig? A shallow roach and more headsail might put less effort into heeling and more into forward drive. She might even point higher.
    I'm just shooting in the dark. I don't know a thing about it, just wondering aloud.
    - Will (Dragonfly)

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