Backstay for a Hunter 216

Sep 22, 2018
1,869
Hunter 216 Kingston
Well just so your clear I’m upset and you were the first to know!

To be on receiving end of a comment that feels like I’m being scolded as a little child doesn’t feel very nice.

You have every right to participate as much or as little as you feel necessary. You don’t have the right to be derogatory in how you do that IMHO.

It’s childish for us to be going back and forth like this so I’m opting to stop.
 
Sep 22, 2018
1,869
Hunter 216 Kingston
With that comment I will not respond to either this thread or you in the future. That ends that.
First of all I would apologize to the other participants in this thread for my part in this exchange. I could go on about that but let’s leave it a simple I’m sorry.

Dave if you feel you no longer wish to interact with me that’s certainly your right. I would however ask that you reconsider withholding information about the wood block location if/when you acquire it as a means of punishing me as that hurts any or all 216 model owners that might need it to modify/repair their hull.
 
Jun 8, 2004
10,060
-na -NA Anywhere USA
Ron, You did not need to add wood to the fire. That was not needed.
Hunter216 asked for information about wood blocks which I asked SBO also in a private message to address to another individual which I did. I received a message why I was taking so long to get that information. It came from another owner, not Hunter216, which is why I said in this thread to hold your britches which many of us in my neck of the woods simply states give me time without naming that individual since he was following this thread. Then Hunter216 made comments which I addressed and now all the fuss. Heck damned if I do and damned if I don't. At that point I simply drop the subject and move on to others I am helping.

What the two of you do not realize, I have many who call, write or send me messages for help as well as traveling.. The other day, I drove 100 miles to help rewire a boat bringing the tools needed along with some supplies and got the job done. I did not ask for any reimbursement after a `12 hour day. Three months following triple by pass open heart surgery,, I helped a fellow to launch his 260 out of state as he was concerned with the overhead wires at the edge of the water. That was a two long day trip leaving at 4 am and returning at midnight the following day all on my nickle. The research I do sometimes is extensive leaving me little time for my train hobby. I go direct to those who know or where I can find that information some of whom are retired and out of friendship, they help.. When someone posts and does not respond, there are cases they never get back and to many of us that can be frustrating not knowing if an emergency or not. One time at Smith Mt. Lake, I was called in the middle of the night as the owner's boat was sinking. Got the boat out determing what caused the leak only to return the next day to repair it. Did not ask for any reimbursement. The list goes on and I have several major projects when the weather turns to help out fellow sailors. As to that reference of two days, yes I was trying to get the poster to respond because in some cases we do not know if an emergency and if the individual will respond back when I have a lot on my plate. Yesterday alone I spent all day regarding boats and not one second to myself or hobby.

I was asked for information which I was trying to get for an individual and this is the thanks I get which has gone too far. There is another old expression, Enough is enough. So with this I will be finishing up some responses and then like Jackdaw, take a break. I will accept private messages and calls to whom I gave out my phone number. Now to enjoy retirement spending more time with my wife and my train hobby.
 
Sep 22, 2018
1,869
Hunter 216 Kingston
Hi Dave, I appreciate your willingness to help, but with this boat, I'm not sure anything you could possibly do to the boat would be a mistake. I understand full well what the boat was designed for, but I'm looking to squeeze a little more performance out of this boat. I went ahead and ordered the new masthead with backstay attachment and have an extra set of shroud tangs with through bolt I was going to use as running back stay attachments. They'll both sit in my basement for a few more months until the spring when I start to get the boat ready.

The first project will be pulling the keel which I've had arranged to have pulled by a forklift. I'll replace the pin, and possibly fabricate a wedge to fit behind the keel when lowered to help with the banging when going upwind in waves. Next I'll make my mast and deck attachments, rig everything up and go sailing.

I plan on documenting everything with lots of pictures and perhaps some videos and post them here on this forum. This is the 8th sailboat I've owned ranging in sizes from 18' to 40' and just about every one required at least something to be rededded, repaired, or replaced. I don't consider myself a professional, but this ain't my first rodeo either.
H216sailor
I'm seriously considering adding running backstays as well as I don't think the flicker option would work with the "roachy" cut of the standard mainsail.

I have the stock Asym setup that obviously doesn't attach to the masthead so maybe this really wouldn't be applicable so asking for opinions.

My reason for considering the addition is the fact that the boat is 14 years old and perhaps not as sturdy now as it once was and the area where I sail is prone to rapid increases in overall wind strength or strong gusts. I might be flying the Asym and have it really load up the rig.

As a side note I'm not sure if you have found it but there is an "Owner Mod" section within "Boat info". I added the electric motor mast raising mod posted by Ranger Paul and it makes it really easy and safe to single hand that task.
 
Jun 26, 2018
40
Hunter 216 Branford
Hi All, Wow! tensions have run high since I last visited my thread!

Dave, I appreciate your wealth of knowledge and willingness to help fellow members as a very useful resource to the Hunter community. I will not be doing any drilling until mid March or so I've got a loooooong time to wait if you have a friend with the schematics of the mounting locations. I ask questions on the forum as it reaches many people in the hopes someone may know or done something before and may me able to share some AIR (advice, insight, or recommendations) in the subject. I am in no way requiring or obligating anyone to find information for me. I am not hiring anyone to provide me information. If you have taken on my question on as a burden I apologize as that was not my intention to you or anyone here on this forum. I also apologize about not PM'ing you as I'm trying to keep all that I do open to the forum for others for future reference.

Hunter216, no need to be offended. I truly believe that Crazy Dave didn't mean anything by it. I will keep you updated on how it work out my situation. I now have both shroud tangs I was going to use for running backstays and the new masthead with a 4" crane on the back for a backstay attachment. I'll install it and if the backstay doesn't work out, it won't hurt the boat to have that masthead up there. As for your situation, I'd sail the boat for a season and see if you'd like add running backstays or not. Its the stock configuration so it might be more robust then you think. I'll let you know how mine work out and if I'd recommend it or not.

I have also purchased Harken 57mm Carbo Air blocks for the spinnaker sheet blocks. Two ratcheting and two non ratcheting. I'll probably put the ratcheting ones up forward and the non-ratcheting ones aft. This as my setup on my J/24 and that seemed to work for me.
 
Sep 22, 2018
1,869
Hunter 216 Kingston
Just curious as to where on the mast are you considering mounting the tangs?

I think your advice about sailing for a while makes sense as I intend to start using the asym only when I feel confident that I have light consistent air and then work up from there.

If I try to add something to see if it makes a difference I would likely start by just tying a piece of non stretch line to the fitting of the the spin halyard block and run it to the dock cleat at the stern. No $ or holes to drill to experiment.
 
Jun 26, 2018
40
Hunter 216 Branford
For me, if I go with the running back stays, they’d be mounted 4’ above the upper shroud tangs. About 2’ below the top of the mast.

For you, because you have the stock spinnaker setup, I’d get another set of shroud tangs and a slightly longer through bolt, then just double the tangs up on the bolt. The inner tangs would attach to the upper shroud as before and the outer tang angled slightly aft would be the running back stay connection. $20 and no additional holes in the mast. This setup would be beneficial to upwind performance as well as the running back stay in this location will also be able to control for stay tension. There was a thread or at least a post about someone adding runners to a 216 before. I think it was Paul Walsh who owned the boat A Little Nauti but according to his last post in 2011, he sold the 216 and got an S2 7.9 and has not been active on this site since. He did a few good write ups about getting some good performance out of those boats.
 
Sep 22, 2018
1,869
Hunter 216 Kingston
I’ve not seen mast layout dimensions before so thought I would post this for reference.
262923E8-25E1-478F-9B76-10BB5C98F5D2.jpeg
 
Sep 22, 2018
1,869
Hunter 216 Kingston
This setup would be beneficial to upwind performance as well as the running back stay in this location will also be able to control for stay tension.
I wasn’t really thinking about them as a stay - sail tuning aid, just added support when flying the spin, if that is what you mean by ‘stay tension”. I’m used to using a masthead backstay to alter sail shape but I can’t visualize how I could induce any mast bend with the attachment point that far down??
 
Jun 26, 2018
40
Hunter 216 Branford
Runners at the location where the forestay meets the mast will help with head stay sag for better upwind performance in heavy air. I know their primary function will be for additional downwind support under spinnaker, but you might pickup some upwind performance as well.

I just ordered 100' of 3/16 amsteel blue rope for my runners. I probably could have gone with a smaller diameter line though.

I was also searching the forum and found someone who Turbo'ed a hunter 240.
https://forums.sailboatowners.com/index.php?threads/turbo-240.191503/
 
Sep 22, 2018
1,869
Hunter 216 Kingston
Runners at the location where the forestay meets the mast will help with head stay sag for better upwind performance in heavy air. I know their primary function will be for additional downwind support under spinnaker, but you might pickup some upwind performance as well.

I just ordered 100' of 3/16 amsteel blue rope for my runners. I probably could have gone with a smaller diameter line though.

I was also searching the forum and found someone who Turbo'ed a hunter 240.
https://forums.sailboatowners.com/index.php?threads/turbo-240.191503/
Doesn’t look like the rope will be the point of failure with those specs. That is a LOT of sail on that 240!!

AA6A8BD9-DF13-43C7-B8D9-FEF5E786CFE5.jpeg


As I said above I didn’t really get much of a chance to sail the boat before I put it away but the size of the headsail vs the mainsail makes me think the headsail isn’t much of a factor, however I’m wrong more often than right

I have a windsurfing background and the setup of the 216 makes me think of it as a REALLY big board with a retractable daggerboard. I can’t wait to bear off with the kite all powered up, retract the keel and see if it will plane!!
 
Jun 22, 2015
9
Hunter 18 Seneca, SC
Just saw your post from January so this might be a little late. I purchased a Hunter 216 this summer and it is fitted with a "Boomkicker" which supports the boom when the sail is down and negates the need for a back stay. Take a look at their website boomkicker.com for more info
 
Sep 22, 2018
1,869
Hunter 216 Kingston
Just saw your post from January so this might be a little late. I purchased a Hunter 216 this summer and it is fitted with a "Boomkicker" which supports the boom when the sail is down and negates the need for a back stay. Take a look at their website boomkicker.com for more info
@CharlieTodd
Welcome to 216 club!
The boomkicker is a nice upgrade, I added one late this fall although I didn’t get to sail with it much before end of season, however I don’t think it adds any additional support to the mast.

The reason @H216sailor wanted to add a backstay to the B&R rig was to provide additional support to the mast when he flies his big spinnaker.
 
Jun 22, 2015
9
Hunter 18 Seneca, SC
Guess I missed the detail about add support for your mast. Was thinking you were just going to support the boom, sorry
 
Apr 16, 2017
841
Federation NCC-1701 Riverside
Did that hydroturf get installed? How did that turn out?

I put that stuff all over the deck and benches of a 170 and it caused some extreme warping of the luran as the royal blue heated and expanded more than the white.
 
Jun 8, 2004
10,060
-na -NA Anywhere USA
Dark color covers produce heat. Cover should be a light color with vents. Some are made for the ACP plastic boats by a manufacturer I think out of Ohio