Anchor Decision

[MikeHoncho]

My 78 Hunter 30 came with a 14lb Delta Plow (for a 28ft) that is the primary and a approx 10lb Fortress Dansforth (32 ft) as a secondary. I have purchase a USED 35lb CQR as a new primary. I sail in the Puget Sound and plan to anchor routinely in San Juans and around in the Southern Sound.
I would like your input on which anchor to keep as a secondary, the Delta or Fortress. I would like to sell one of them but I guess I could be talked into keeping both with a good argument.

 

[LeslieTroyer]

Keep the fortress. Loose the other two. Your primary should be Mantus, Rocna, or Manson Surpream.

Les

 

[jssailem]

Mike,
Your anchor is a personal thing. It is what when the weather turns bad will hold you in place and allow you to sleep at night. This makes selection kind of an important issue. The 3 identified by @LeslieTroyer are great and modern. I would add the Spade anchor to that list. And in total openness, I own a Mantus. They provide an improvement in fixing a boat to the safe harbor.

The Fortress will be easier to store onboard. Both the Delta and Fortress are good mud anchors that have some problems with resetting at times. This can be an issue in our Northwest waters when tides and currents push boats around. This makes the ability of the anchor to reset when the tide changes the directions of the currents important to sleep with out having to run up on deck to stop the boat from dragging across the anchorage and into other boats.

The owner of SV Panope has taken on the task of testing various anchors and developed a way to video the anchor when the the boat changes location. Here is a link.

You can find on his youtube site various anchors and the video of the ability for the anchor to reset when the winds and currents try to unset the bower. I believe this will help you differenatiate the anchors and then help you find the one upon which you want to spend your money.

 

[Ron20324]

Mike, you probably could have gotten by with a CQR 25. I have the 35 on my B32 3 and it is larger than called for, and it has been great. My club does linear and circle rafts, and I am often called to be an anchor boat. I have a Fortress, but it is disassembled and strored below. With the CQR doing so well in the Chesapeake Bay, I sold my Danforth (1300?). I just have th two anchors now. If I were you, I'd store the Fortress (what size?), and keep the Delta(Benny OEM) fairly close by.

 

[MikeHoncho]

Mike, you probably could have gotten by with a CQR 25. I have the 35 on my B32 3 and it is larger than called for, and it has been great. My club does linear and circle rafts, and I am often called to be an anchor boat. I have a Fortress, but it is disassembled and strored below. With the CQR doing so well in the Chesapeake Bay, I sold my Danforth (1300?). I just have th two anchors now. If I were you, I'd store the Fortress (what size?), and keep the Delta(Benny OEM) fairly close by.

I’m getting it used for $100 so I think I’m coming out ahead. I have a bow sprit so storage of the larger size won’t be a issue. I didn’t think of breaking down the Fortress.

 

[Ron20324]

I’m getting it used for $100 so I think I’m coming out ahead. I have a bow sprit so storage of the larger size won’t be a issue. I didn’t think of breaking down the Fortress.

Fortress makes a bag for storage but they seem way everpriced.

 

[MikeHoncho]

I have a Sailrite. Gives me a good reason to use it. I have some left over trampoline cloth that will work great.

 

[LeslieTroyer]

Read “Rigging Modern Anchors” by Drew Frye (an occasional poster here). Free with Amazon Unlimited. Lots of current and popular anchors and test results.

Les

 

[Davidasailor26]

In any anchor question you'll get many answers on what's best. I'll side step those and look at your question specifically about the best backup to the CQR as a primary. The characteristics of the CQR (for example, the bottom conditions it does well in) are more similar to the Delta than the Fortress. For that reason I'd keep the Fortress. That way, if you find yourself in a spot that the CQR isn't working, you can use the Fortress and hopefully be in conditions where it excels.

Ok, now I'll editorialize on the choice of primary anchor. Modern anchor designs are generally thought to be superior, but if you have the space and are willing to carry a 35 pound anchor I think you'll be just fine with the CQR on that size boat. We had a CQR 25 on a 28' boat and slept very soundly.

 

[TomY]

I'd keep the Fortress. We use a 35 CQR as primary (38' sailboat) and find it's more than adequate for our coastal sailing. Our secondary anchor is a 35 Danforth Hi-tensile.

If you plan to do more extensive cruising, I'd keep all three.

 

[capta]

I can't for the life of me understand why you would purchase an old tech, past gen anchor when you already have two next-gen anchors on the boat.
I sailed the world for nearly half a century with the genuine CQR as my primary anchor on many, many vessels. However, one day a boat set his anchor in one of the coral "shoots" in Bequia, where no boat had ever stuck before, and did just that, first try. I was so impressed that I got in the dink and asked him what anchor he was using. It was a Rocna. As I continued to cruise the Eastern Caribbean, the Rocna anchor came up in conversations and in forums more and more.
But I still thought, "Next-gen anchor? Yeah, right." And they were EXPENSIVE! A huge hit to our cruising budget.
Well, as I've always been a pretty lucky guy, luck once again dropped an 88# Rocna in my lap for 25% of retail and I thought it would be a good time to test them out. If it wasn't what it was cracked up to be, we were only out a few hundred bucks and it might make a good mooring for a smaller boat.
For a year we dove on that Rocna and rarely if ever, did it drag it's own length before it dug in and set, and we NEVER back down on our anchor unless we are Med mooring or there is no wind.
So, after 5 years or so, we still have yet to drag anchor, even in some of the most difficult to anchor in places in the Eastern Caribbean. We have personally seen other experienced cruisers with other next gen anchors have a lot of difficulty getting their pick to set in these anchorages, so I sincerely believe that the Rona is a superior anchor for this area, though I have not personally used any other next-gen anchor.
However, I am not saying that a Rocna is the best anchor for the PNW, only that it has served us well in the Caribbean. But I personally would never again choose a genuine CQR over any next gen anchor. The only anchor I have experience with in the PNW is the Northill, which almost all the commercial fishing vessels used everywhere on the West Coast at the time I was out there. It did just fine, but we anchored rarely and on cable, not chain or line when we did.

 

[MikeHoncho]

I can't for the life of me understand why you would purchase an old tech, past gen anchor when you already have two next-gen anchors on the boat.
I sailed the world for nearly half a century with the genuine CQR as my primary anchor on many, many vessels. However, one day a boat set his anchor in one of the coral "shoots" in Bequia, where no boat had ever stuck before, and did just that, first try. I was so impressed that I got in the dink and asked him what anchor he was using. It was a Rocna. As I continued to cruise the Eastern Caribbean, the Rocna anchor came up in conversations and in forums more and more.
But I still thought, "Next-gen anchor? Yeah, right." And they were EXPENSIVE! A huge hit to our cruising budget.
Well, as I've always been a pretty lucky guy, luck once again dropped an 88# Rocna in my lap for 25% of retail and I thought it would be a good time to test them out. If it wasn't what it was cracked up to be, we were only out a few hundred bucks and it might make a good mooring for a smaller boat.
For a year we dove on that Rocna and rarely if ever, did it drag it's own length before it dug in and set, and we NEVER back down on our anchor unless we are Med mooring or there is no wind.
So, after 5 years or so, we still have yet to drag anchor, even in some of the most difficult to anchor in places in the Eastern Caribbean. We have personally seen other experienced cruisers with other next gen anchors have a lot of difficulty getting their pick to set in these anchorages, so I sincerely believe that the Rona is a superior anchor for this area, though I have not personally used any other next-gen anchor.
However, I am not saying that a Rocna is the best anchor for the PNW, only that it has served us well in the Caribbean. But I personally would never again choose a genuine CQR over any next gen anchor. The only anchor I have experience with in the PNW is the Northill, which almost all the commercial fishing vessels used everywhere on the West Coast at the time I was out there. It did just fine, but we anchored rarely and on cable, not chain or line when we did.

I get what you're saying but I also believe you have answered your own question. " you used one for centuries" Old doesn't always equate to outdated in all instances. I'm not cruising the world in my 30ft Hunter and do not anticipate needing a anchor for all conditions. Additionally the Delta is to small and if I can meet my needs with a applicable but older design at the tenth of the cost then that seems reasonable.

 

[TomY]

I assumed(I hope!) he must have bought the CQR used. I don't see why anyone would pay the new price for a 35CQR at (last I checked) about twice the amount of some of the newer designs (and get better performance).

But the CQR works, I can attest. If I lose mine I WON'T buy a new CQR ($700?), primarily for cost savings. I'd get a new gen - cheaper - anchor.

 

[MikeHoncho]

I assumed(I hope!) he must have bought the CQR used. I don't see why anyone would pay the new price for a 35CQR at (last I checked) about twice the amount of some of the newer designs (and get better performance).

But the CQR works, I can attest. If I lose mine I'll buy a new one, primarily for cost savings.

It's a original design I believe, with Scotland being its manuf location (its stated on the shank). The cheapest new I found was just under $800, most expensive $1200. Galvanized treatment is in great shape with no surface rust. I wouldn't buy one new for the reasons stated above but for $100 and being oversized, I think it will meet my needs. Back to the original inquiry.....

 

[capta]

oes

I get what you're saying but I also believe you have answered your own question. " you used one for centuries" Old doesn't always equate to outdated in all instances. I'm not cruising the world in my 30ft Hunter and do not anticipate needing a anchor for all conditions. Additionally the Delta is to small and if I can meet my needs with a applicable but older design at the tenth of the cost then that seems reasonable.

We live aboard at anchor nearly every day (sometimes anchoring several times a day in winds to 35 knots) so our priority is to have faith in our ground tackle, which we no longer had with the genuine CQR.
A vessel's ground tackle is its last defense against catastrophe. "Anybody can make a boat go, but it takes a sailor to stop one", are not idle words, but the best advice I've ever been given regarding boating.

 

[LeslieTroyer]

Unless you get very very good with the CQR you can expect about 60% failure to set. If it’s crowded like at Many of the San Juan hot spots you’ll find it difficult. I’ll sell you a genuine 15kg Bruce for the same price you quoted for the CQR. Much faster set. I replaced it with a 15kg Mantus for its ability to reset. Yes the CQR’s work once you’ve failed many times, but I want quick setting and quick resetting on wind/tide changes.

Canvas sails worked for centuries, but you don’t see many people using them because the new products sat so superior.


Les

 

[jssailem]

I think it will meet my needs.

I think you are correct. For $100 the weight alone will enough to hold you in place on a calm day.
Now that you have the anchor, what is the rest of the plan. Success at setting an anchor and staying I place is as much the rode and the amount of scope that you use based on the depth beneath the boat.

 

[MikeHoncho]

Unless you get very very good with the CQR you can expect about 60% failure to set. If it’s crowded like at Many of the San Juan hot spots you’ll find it difficult. I’ll sell you a genuine 15kg Bruce for the same price you quoted for the CQR. Much faster set. I replaced it with a 15kg Mantus for its ability to reset. Yes the CQR’s work once you’ve failed many times, but I want quick setting and quick resetting on wind/tide changes.

Canvas sails worked for centuries, but you don’t see many people using them because the new products sat so superior.


Les

Dang it, now your telling me I shouldn't have bought my canvas sails? Any references or insight to good technique with setting the CQR?

 

[jssailem]

Mike. Watch the videos developed by the Port Townsend guy on SV Panaope. I gave you the link in the first message. He shows his experience with he CRQ.
If I recall it is drop the anchor to the sea bed with a bit of chain and at least 3-1 scope. Then start to back away. The best shot is the anchor lands upright in sand/mud bottom and you get a proper set in 3-5 anchor lengths. Issue is at wind or tide change, be sure you are ready to check it as when the boats direction is moved the CRQ has shown events when it pulls out and does not promptly reset. No big deal if you are prepared to deal with the issue.

 

[LeslieTroyer]

Here is on thread from this site ymmv. https://forums.sailboatowners.com/index.php?threads/cqr-anchor-techinque-help.40534/