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27 for blue water?

Discussion in 'Mid-Size Boats' started by Family27, Dec 10, 2013. Add this thread to a FAQ

  1. Family27

    Family27

    Joined Nov 8, 2013
    12 posts, 0 likes
    Catalina 27
    US San Diego
    I all, I have a 27ft and was wondering if it would work to sail to Hawaii? Or should I upgrade before I plan that type of trip? Feedback?
     


  2. jrowan

    jrowan

    Joined Mar 5, 2011
    1,291 posts, 3 likes
    Catalina 30
    US N/A
    Someone just asked this same question, but at least they were talking about a C 30.
    But here is the advice I gave them, which I believe applies to most Catalinas out there:

    There have been a lot of discussions on this site about the merits & limitations of Catalina construction methods. At least you're talking about sailing to Hawaii in a C30 & not a C22! I have owned 3 Catalinas, C22, 25 & now a 30 & I personally don't think that the rigging, keel design & rudder post construction are beefy enough for Blue Water sailing. There is a measureable difference in how a blue water boat, such as a Valiant 40 is built versus a Catalina. Any boat can theoretically make to Hawaii & back, but is it prudent to push the limits of a coastal cruiser? Heck there is debris that floated all the way from Japan all the way to California after their earthquake. I would honestly be more concerned about a sailor's ability to sail the distances then the boat that they're on. If you ask the question, then perhaps you already know the answer. There was a decent film just released called "All Is Lost" with Robert Redford, who ship is lost at sea, even after a lot of ingenuity on the sailor's attempt to keep her floating. I would watch this before answering whether the C 30 is enough. But remember that once you're out there, its just you, your crew, & whatever you have in & on your boat. When you're out in the middle of the Pacific no one's coming to the rescue.
     


  3. The Garbone

    The Garbone

    Joined Nov 7, 2012
    673 posts, 16 likes
    1978 Catalina 30
    US Wilbur-by-the-Sea
    Have you taken it offshore before? Check out the 27 Yahoo group as they have a liist of upgrades to take a 27 blue water.

    My experience with my 27 tells me it is a bit on the rolly side for long passages. Even if made more solid structurally, in fairly good conditions there is a bunch of movement there. Just compensating for the movement of the boat you will be burning major calories, then again some people thrive on the unpleasant.
     


  4. Happy Dolphin

    Happy Dolphin

    Joined Nov 1, 2010
    100 posts, 0 likes
    Oday 272
    US Brownstown, MI - Lake Erie Metro Park Marina
    No do not sail the 27C to HI! Sell your near shore coastal Cruiser and buy a suitable vessel (32 to 42).
    BTW, My wife and I did go see "All is Lost" and Redford performed excellent as an actor; but, as an Ocean Sailor he made too many errors in judgment and did not employ a proper response to repair that even my wife was say'n WTH!!! Why not tie to the container (floating dock) make suitable hull repairs, Ect. Ect... But I did enjoy the movie...
     


  5. jrowan

    jrowan

    Joined Mar 5, 2011
    1,291 posts, 3 likes
    Catalina 30
    US N/A
    I agree with that assessment. I do remember when the container hit his yacht & I though to myself, why not jus tie up to the container & work from it as a floating platform. But when you're on your own out there & don't have anyone to bounce ideas off of, I expect that you can make some bad decisions when sleep deprived & exhausted. But that was a real blue water boat. Can you imagine the constant rolling motion on a C 27? Barf.
     


  6. 2sticks

    2sticks

    Joined Nov 18, 2013
    54 posts, 0 likes
    Oday 32 Ketch
    US North Fort Myers, FL
    Offshore vessels are judged on criteria that only considers overall length well down the list of essentials. A blue water boat is generally thought to be constructed to heavier scantlings with considerably upgraded equipment. Most experienced offshore sailors prefer a heavy displacement vessel usually with a full keel and considerable draft that would be prone to groundings inshore. Other needed gear; Offshore liferaft, safety lines and tethers, watermaker etc. would quickly overwhelm a lighter displacement inshore cruiser designed for lakes and protected waters. Please research the difference between a pleasant weekend or daysailing vessel and a boat designed for the rigors of 20 ft. seas and surfing down the face of waves which are an integral part of offshore sailing in all oceans and most particularly the Pacific and Southern oceans. Hope to NOT see you on the news.

    Highest regards, Darrell

    P.S. In the day of immediate gratification it becomes important to realize the skills for offshore passages come through experience and there simply is no shortcut!
     


  7. 2sticks

    2sticks

    Joined Nov 18, 2013
    54 posts, 0 likes
    Oday 32 Ketch
    US North Fort Myers, FL
    Kinda' hate to belabor the point I'm trying to make here but my significant other feels it's important to be fully understood on this subject. It, in my estimation, is the height of folly to go to sea un prepared, either as a seaman or with regard to the choice of vessel. Size is not paramount, as many successful voyages have been made in very small boats. I witnessed a landfall made by 2 young sailors who had departed Los Angeles and arrived in the Ala Wai Yacht basin in Honolulu. The boat looked good and the crew was happy and came through very well. The vessel they made the crossing in was only 20 ft. long. It was a Flicka, designed by Bruce Bingham ( actually drawn by his father) designed as a proper offshore boat and is kind of an exception to the rule that bigger is better. Many of us forget that this is not some sort of video game and we cannot reset the game after a disastrous result. The ocean is big, wide, has no conscience and doesn't know you're there. It is what it is and you need be prepared. This is real life!
     


  8. Calif. Ted

    Calif. Ted

    Joined Jun 8, 2004
    2,091 posts, 125 likes
    Catalina 320
    US Dana Point
    Go to Morro Bay and back, if you still want to go to Hawaii on a 27 you probably could.
     


    Gene Neill likes this.
  9. centerline

    centerline

    Joined Mar 20, 2012
    3,982 posts, 186 likes
    Cal 34-III, MacGregor 25
    US Salem, Oregon
    there have been way smaller boats that have made way longer passages... safely.
    some boats are stronger than others, but if you dont encounter storm force winds and waves, how strong of a boat do you need?.. and what if you do encounter storm force winds and waves... can YOU handle them?
    also, what kind of shape is your boat and rigging in? in top condition, im sure the boat would make it fine, if its handled right.

    if you can take your boat offshore for some coastal cruising in a storm and stay out for a couple of weeks or three without making port, and you can do this routinely and without worry or question, then I would say that you and your boat are more than ready for the trip to hawaii... but if you cant handle the coastal cruising in bad weather for a length of time, where you at least have the option of running to port, or calling the coastguard for assistance, then you arent quite ready to chance a trip to where you have no options other than to sail, sink or swim...

    and the boat is stronger than you are, but when you have something go wrong when sailing local, its really no big deal... you lose your relaxing fun day on the water cuz you have to go in and get it repaired, and all this change of events is a pain in the ass....
    the very same scenario out there, could very well be a life altering event.... maybe worse.


    and on the other hand, the trip to hawaii could be no more eventful than a trip to catalina island on a good day.... so you gotta plan for, and expect the worst, hope for the best, and pray that you will have some luck if you should need it...
     


  10. Family27

    Family27

    Joined Nov 8, 2013
    12 posts, 0 likes
    Catalina 27
    US San Diego
    I agree! I will upgrade soon, and look for something 30-40.
     


  11. azguy

    azguy

    Joined Aug 23, 2012
    337 posts, 2 likes
    Catalina 22
    US Lake Pleasant
    There are some great videos on YouTube about HI to CA crossings, watch em..
     


  12. Jon_E

    Jon_E

    Joined Mar 19, 2011
    119 posts, 1 likes
    Catalina 27
    US Marina del Rey
    Here is a link of itemizing the customization Patrick Childress did to his Catalina 27 before taking it around the world single handed. There are plenty of Catalina 27's that have made the trip to Hawaii.

    http://newsgroups.derkeiler.com/Archive/Rec/rec.boats.cruising/2006-06/msg00252.html

    Having said that, the Catalina 27 is a coastal cruiser. She wasn't designed for blue water sailing. Theoretically one could ride a 1970 Honda 70 motorcycle from New York City to Buenos Aires, but that doesn't mean it's a good idea.
     


    Janet_G likes this.
  13. PuraVida

    PuraVida

    Joined Sep 1, 2013
    8 posts, 0 likes
    Catalina 30
    US Omena, MI
    Just because you can does not make it a good idea.

    The overall length is not so much the issue,but rather the design. If it were I, I would sell the Cat 27 and buy a 28 Bristol Channel Cutter. Furthermore, the most important member of the crew will be your self-steering equipment. DO NOT assume that an electric auto pilot will suffice. A wind vane system is an absolute must on any boat making such a passage.

    Rob
     


  14. azguy

    azguy

    Joined Aug 23, 2012
    337 posts, 2 likes
    Catalina 22
    US Lake Pleasant
    I'm sure anything can be done with the right weather window and the grace of God.

    After being on a bunch of boats over the last 6 months, at least for me, mid 30 footers would be the bare minimum.
     


  15. PuraVida

    PuraVida

    Joined Sep 1, 2013
    8 posts, 0 likes
    Catalina 30
    US Omena, MI
    I agree

    Personally, i would prefer a boat like the Contest 38. This is a great blue water boat that can be acquired for a reasonable price. The c-27 is a great boat, but it is not designed to withstand the non-stop pounding of a 20 day blue water crossing.
     


  16. PuraVida

    PuraVida

    Joined Sep 1, 2013
    8 posts, 0 likes
    Catalina 30
    US Omena, MI
    My cousin sailed from L.A. To Fiji in a Nor'Sea 27 with no radio, no GPS; just a sextant and charts. That is just stupid. As i stated earlier.... Just because you can does not mean you should.
    R
     


  17. jrowan

    jrowan

    Joined Mar 5, 2011
    1,291 posts, 3 likes
    Catalina 30
    US N/A
    OMG these threads on whether to sail a C 27 to Tim Buck Tu never die!
    LOL. I think we need to build a section of this site with a collection of answers to: "Should I sail a coastal & lake sailboat around the world?"
    "What do I need to look for when buying a 30 year old boat?" or "Can I Trailer a C 30 across the country with an F150?"

    I tire of the questions, but the responses are entertaining.
    Besides, I feel obligated to answer just to potentially stop someone from killing themselves or their family with some ill conceived idea.
    But Happy New Year to all.
     


  18. mbeil53

    mbeil53

    Joined Nov 22, 2013
    20 posts, 0 likes
    macgregor m25
    US akron
    c 27

    A couple of years ago I read an article about a guy who sailed from Seattle to hawaii on a Wayne Potter 19. I guess conceptually it can be done. but having said that, one can also jump out of an airplane without a parachute.
     


  19. PuraVida

    PuraVida

    Joined Sep 1, 2013
    8 posts, 0 likes
    Catalina 30
    US Omena, MI
    Westwightpotter.com

    I think that you meant the West Wight Potter.
    Yes there are some lunatics who have crossed the Atlantic in them too.
    Some people make bad choices.
     


  20. Bill1565

    Bill1565

    Joined Jan 22, 2008
    1,483 posts, 1 likes
    Hunter 37 C sloop
    US Punta Gorda FL
    Not enuff storage or water tank for that. Also would need upgraded rigging, steering and a monster helping of good luck.
     



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