Who uses an ATN sock w/Asymmetrical Spinnaker on a h36?

[Dan_Y]

I have an asymmetrical spinnaker on order with an ATN sock for our ‘08 h36. The sailmaker said he would add a heavy duty pennant to the top of the sock (about 10” length) to help keep the sock hoop away from the mask/forestay when flying the sail. Someone told me that a gantry/crane might help with clearance. I’m wondering what issues anyone with the h36 spin setup has experienced when using the ATN sock. I don’t know if the h 365, 34, 38, etc. have this setup (retainer about 5-6” above forestay and about 3-4” below the internal spin halyard sheeve. The messenger line from Hunter is still in place.) As always, TIA for inputs.
Dan

 

[stuartsw]

We have that same set up for our asym on our ‘09 H36. Not had any problems with the halyard/deploying/furling. Love the ATM sock; it makes for a solid snuff. Curious about how you have the sheets and downhaul rigged. Our rigger used turning blocks on our aft cleats for the sheet and rigged a Harken block and clutch on the starboard arch support for the down haul. It’s a bit kluge-y.

 

[Dan_Y]

That’s good news! Thanks. It’s filling the trunk of my civic at the moment. Going to try to rig and at least raise the sock in the slip tomorrow, wind willing. Will post some photos of what the sailmaker suggested for rigging. Then I’m sure I’ll have another question or two...

 

[Dan_Y]

I took the spin and parts to the boat and installed the main blocks off the arch instead of on the aft cleats. I used those nifty arch clamps available from SBO. I think a soft shackle around the arch pipe might work better because the block will shift to where ever the sheet is pulling. With my setup I'll have to adjust the clamps for an average pull angle. Maybe not a big deal. The sailmaker told be tie some bungee through the block to keep it from being banged around by the sheet when deploying the asym. I included a photo of the pendant that the sailmaker added. The top halyard ring includes the sock bridle and the sock block used to hoist/lower the ring. You can see the shackle at the lower ring where it connects to the head of the asym. For now I'm simply leading a tack line through the spinnaker roller next to the anchor roller and tying it to the port bow cleat. I also added a spinlock clutch on the mast for the halyard. Will be interesting to see how much things change once I learn to fly this sail.

 

[Dan_Y]

stuartsw-
We finally “flew” the asymmetrical spinnaker. It was a little work getting the sock lines, sheets, and tack line “untangled “ but finally got it flying...now to learn how to keep it filled and flying!

 

[tfox2069]

Following with interest. Have been collecting the bits and pieces for an asym over the first year of owning the boat, and will probably pull the trigger on one for our 2009 H36 at the Fall Annapolis Boat Show. Decided to try soft shackles first around the arch supports. Had a rigger install a spin halyard which I ran through the turning block at the base of the mast, through the deck hardware, and installed a 4th clutch on the port side of the cockpit for it. Undoubtedly lots of lessons to learn. What do you do with the sock lines?

 

[Dan_Y]

I thought about the fourth clutch but the three existing clutches are centered on the mounting pad. So I would have to move them over about 1/2” to make room for a fourth spinlock XAS.

I tied the two sock lines around the deck grab rail. But that’s a little tuff to tie to. Some suggest tying to life line. My crappy knot slipped and let the sock snuff the top 1/3 of the sail before I figured why the sail wasn’t trimming... The pendant on the hoop works great and a crane shouldn’t be needed.

I had trouble with the luff folding in, then the sail would snap out fully pressurized, looking cool. Then the leech would collapse or the luff folded back then the whole sail would collapse and want to get caught behind the upper spreader, especially when raising the sock. I think it was being blanketed by the main as the wind shifted deeper. We had 3-6 knots of true wind but the wind was moving between 90-120 deg apparent.

I’m reading as much as I can about trim. Seems straight forward, but I haven’t built a good mental model yet of how to trim.

After about 20 minutes of trying to fly it (after spending 30 min untangling all the lines...haha) we almost sailed into an active channel in front of a container ship. Never saw it till the last minute. So much for cockpit resource management. We called it quits for the day. I did practice up hauling and down hauling the sock a few times because I didn’t like how the sail seemed to be wrapping around it self. Is that the dreaded hourglass? We were at about 130 apparent to use the main to blanket the asym. I left the tack line attached but fully eased and had the Admiral keep loose tension on the sheet. It only got a little wet... as I snuffed the sail. Hopefully it’s easier next time!

Tips, tricks and pointers to trimming are welcome. Our archives have only a few threads on trim and most are on rigging. Apparently trimming an asym is too easy to mention....
Dan

 

[tfox2069]

Keep posting what you're learning!

 

[Jake N Eggs]

I have a 33 which is very similar. The main is so big that it causes problems with the genneker, which is short and fat, while running. I usually furl in the main sail when flying the genneker in a deepish broad reach. I have intentions to try and find how much main I can have out in different broad reach points of sail. In a beam reach I can have the full main out and the boat flies in light winds.

 

[Valerio]

The asymmetrical is not designed to fly below 160 degree, I rather roll in the main some and attach a pulley to the boom so I can open more the asy . the boom will work as a whisbone. Also there is a very good north sail tutorial on how to fly this sail.

 

[Bill19233]

Same set up on our 2000 340, spinnaker halyard exits a few inches above the forestay. We have two A-sails in ATN socks and have used them a lot in the last ten years, never had any issues with the sock hoop and the forestay that I know of. Just had a rig inspection a couple week ago.
I did have a short penant/lanyard on the spinnaker halyard snap shackle ring to make it easier to open with gloves on or whatever. In a race earlier this year, that penant caught on something on the forestay or roller furling or jib halyard as it went by and pulled open the shackle. The spinnaker and sock came down fast, I was at the mast pulling it out the hatch and guiding it up, luckily the headboard missed my head. But, no A-sail reach in that race and the halyard had to be retrieved with a trip up the mast.

 

[JRacer]

Here are a couple articles that may be helpful. On the sock lines, I have a horn cleat on the mast a few feet up from the deck that I use to cleat the sock lines. One wrap and a lock. Keeps it out of that way as it runs from that cleat snuggly up the side of the mast to the sock.

 

[Dan_Y]

...The spinnaker and sock came down fast, I was at the mast pulling it out the hatch and guiding it up, luckily the headboard missed my head. But, no A-sail reach in that race and the halyard had to be retrieved with a trip up the mast.

Ha! The same thing happened to us on our first time hoisting the sock. And I didn't have a pendant on the quick release. I had the admiral give the spin halyard one last "tug", and the whole thing came down in a hurry! I was then promptly accused of not locking the shackle properly... Winched the Admiral up to retrieve the halyard back at the dock. I put a piece of tape around the shackle the next time. It was really scuffed/bunched up, like it was being rolled off the shackle. I think I'll replace it with the type that has the 180 twist lock.

 

[Dan_Y]

Here are two shots of the A-spin flying finally. Plenty of clearance at the top due to the pendant on the head. The second shot was at about 70 apparent in 7 knots about 30 seconds before we experienced a near knock down...sheesh. A gust to only about 11-12 heeled us to 50-60 deg. I was slow at releasing the sheet being kinda amazed at what was happening and hoping we could drive through it. Unfortunately the autopilot didn't know to turn down for me...ha. Now I know hunters are tender, but I have a new respect for that much sail area on a beam-ish reach. I'm still finding stuff in odd places down in the cabin that went flying. On a later tack we were getting below 120 and the main was starting to blanket the aspin so I just furled in the main. You can sail the aspin a little deeper w/o the main and didn't loose too much boat speed. Behaved well at 150 -160. Still learning.

 

[JRacer]

Chute looks good!

Always good to have someone watching your back and rear quarter for puffs when downwind flying a chute. Or, you can turn your head around periodically and look for yourself if single handing. Let's you know it's coming and then you can be ready to adjust your course to head down in the puffs. Old rule - down in the puffs, up in the lulls. You will sail faster doing that and you won't get knocked down.