Reasons for a survey

[justsomeguy]

Desiderata an Islander 41 Freeport Ketch will be ours by Christmas.

Great name.
It brought back memories of National Lampoon's Deteriorata.

Go placidly amid the noise and waste, and remember what comfort there may be in owning a piece thereof. Avoid quiet and placid people, unless you are in need of sleep. Rotate your tires. Speak glowingly of those greater than yourself, and heed well their advice, even though they be turkeys. Know what to kiss, and when. Consider that two wrongs never make a right, but that three do. Whenever possible, put people on hold. Be comforted that in the face of all aridity and disillusionment, and despite the changing fortunes of time, there is always a big future in computer maintenance.

Remember the Pueblo. Strive at all times to bend, fold, spindle and mutilate. Know yourself; if you need help, call the FBI. Exercise caution in your daily affairs, especially with those persons closest to you—that lemon on your left, for instance. Be assured that a walk through the ocean of most souls would scarcely get your feet wet. Fall not in love therefore; it will stick to your face. Gracefully surrender the things of youth—birds, clean air, tuna, Taiwan—and let not the sands of time get in your lunch. Hire people with hooks. For a good time, call 606-4311… ask for Candy. Take heart amid the deepening gloom that your dog is finally getting enough cheese; and reflect that whatever misfortune may be your lot, it could only be worse in Milwaukee.

You are a fluke of the universe; you have no right to be here, and whether you can hear it or not, the Universe is laughing behind your back. Therefore, make peace with your God, whatever you may perceive Him to be: hairy thunderer, or cosmic muffin. With all its hopes, dreams, promises and urban renewal, the world continues to deteriorate.

Give up.

 

[OS2Dude]

Congratulations on finding your boat. Remember the best two days of a sailors life: The day you buy a boat and the day you sell it...

Fair Winds for your new adventure.

 

[Kings Gambit]

There was a survey on the boat and a separate one for the motor done 3 years ago. That and my general (mis)understanding of what I'm looking at and I decided not to do a survey this go around. She's old, she floats, and soon she'll be ours!! what more can we ask for.

One can only assume that you actually got to read those surveys, and that if you did, you got to ask why they were made. If for a prior contingent offer that did not finally go through, then hopefully you discovered why it did not go through, etc. Also, FYI, since you did not commission those surveys you probably have no viable legal recourse if something was overlooked or not reported in them that later causes you problems. Yes, I think you'll find it a big change from sailing a Hunter 28 on a lake to owning, maintaining, and sailing on San Francisco Bay an old Freeport 41 ketch that you just bought w/o a survey. In this example, rather like closing your eyes and with fingers crossed jumping into a rocky basin of the High Sierra filled with stupefyingly cold (ice melt) stream water, hoping that you don't hit any submerged rocks or otherwise knock yourself out or lose consciousnesses before you get back up to the surface and somehow climb out, still breathing, and not too badly scratched up. Good luck! See below.

http://www.thelog.com/news-departments/recovering-repair-costs-am-i-screwed/
http://www.thelog.com/ask-the-attorney/can-i-sue-my-marine-surveyor-over-a-shoddy-used-boat-survey/

Just as another aside, in case no one has told you, the cost of repairing and maintaining sailboats go up with length by the square, sometimes the cube, people say. So, 41/28 = 1.5x is likely not the relative cost. Figure 1.5^2 = 2.25x the cost of the 28 ft. For example, the cost of a basic Dacron mainsail for a Cal20 is about $1,000; but for my 38-ft it is about $3,600. Thus, 38/20 = 1.9^2 = 3.61x $$. As a friend once repeatedly said: "Small boat, small problems; big boat, big problems." You go into this swamp at the level of pre-inspection you're describing, you'll more likely regret it than not, IMHO.

 

[vhoisington]

Yes, I went in with eyes wide open. We have a list of items to replace/repair. and as you note, the costs for a 41 ft'er in salt water are significantly higher than for a 28 ft'er in fresh water. Everything is at least an order of magnitude more expensive. But I get things like a real bed to sleep in (once I replace the mattress), a real engine room that i can get into (with lots of wiring and hoses to label), and heads that allow me to turn around without having to step out and back into. I also now measure boat bucks in $1k increments not $100 increments.

As to the old surveys, they are more a matter of reference to things someone else noted, I would never think of going back to the surveyor for any reason. I've found that my best source for how to do things is to talk to people, hear their ideas (the more ideas the better) and then when its time for me to do the work, dive in, figure out what is the reality of the current situation and what needs to be done to solve the problem at hand. Youtube, this forum, west marine and the local chandleries as well as my fellow boaters all provide input, some useful, some not so useful. Mash it all together and you get a solution.

There is a saying (i forget the source) that goes something like this "There is nothing more satisfying than messing around with boats". I like doing my own work, I've done a enough of everything to think I can solve any problem, woodworking, fiberglass, electrical, plumbing, (construction, landscaping, etc.) my tool collection is up to date and I have an internet connection. What could possibly go wrong?

 

[Kings Gambit]

There is a saying (i forget the source) that goes something like this "There is nothing more satisfying than messing around with boats".

Try "The Wind in the Willows."

What could possibly go wrong?

Maybe ask these guys.

 

[vhoisington]

To all,

Here is the epilogue to boat purchase. We bought Desiderata, a 1977 Islander 41 Freeport Ketch based upon my own survey and test sail, I managed to ghost along at 2 knots in less than 5 knots of wind with a full keel ketch, didn't feel that was too bad. She's old, she has a lot of warts, and will need some TLC to bring her up to the admiral's standard

We moved aboard a week ago last Saturday during the biggest storms in Northern Ca. in at least 10 years. Lots of rain, lots of wind (even in the harbor). The admiral promptly found the only 2 leaks, one we knew about before coming on board, 1 was new but, neither is major, will probably move rebedding windows up on our list.

So far the only major issue has been the 40 year old battery charge finally gave up the ghost, it just didn't like to be used a lot but was good at boiling batteries. I'm guessing my surveyor would have noted its age but also noted it was working at the time. Did have one minor catastrophe, a hose came off on the pressure side of the water line. Spewed about 180 gallons of water across the engine room until I heard it (generator was also running at the time so masked the sound of the water pump running). Nothing major, I've started the process of tightening/replacing each and every clamp on the boat (I'm guessing about 2500 clamps in all). New battery charger installed last night in about 3 hours, per mainsails diagrams and instructions. Still a couple of fittings to finish but it is working on the house bank and generator.

Other things we have learned, we discovered that in the cold, Ca waters, she sweats a lot, Not good to reach for a long sleeve shirt and have the sleeve soaking wet. So, started the process of adding insulation in hanging lockers this weekend, another fun project (I'm not as slender or nimble as I used to be).

The admiral is beginning to adjust, she's finding places for everything and figuring out to cook on a boat, it's certainly different, Lots to fix and repair, but so far nothing major. New canvas is on order, probably a new mizzen as well, and we've started looking at electronics but, that will be another chapter.

So far, and its only been a week, we are happy, she is what we expected and the queen bed at night is nice and cozy, now if it would just quit raining.

Fair winds,

Victor

 

[Captain Bucknut]

Sweet! Thanks for the update. Enjoy!

 

[Kings Gambit]

I have one of these aboard that runs on AC; recommended to me on this forum. It's helpful, but you might need a couple of 'em for your boat. Congratulations on finding but few leaks! Enjoy.

http://www.practical-sailor.com/iss...ate/Product-Update-February-2015_11610-1.html

KG

 

[jssailem]

Way to go Victor! You are a boat owner. Looking as some pictures of the Islander 41 she strikes a fetching image. I believe that you buy a boat that finds and calls to you. It makes the fixing of the warts worthwhile.
Here in the PacNW we know about moisture. You need the rain in your neck of the woods. Otherwise those folks in Sacramento are going to legislate shutting down the rivers and you'll find your boat on the mud.... But that is not for this Forum.
Living aboard makes the issue of condensation worse than if your just day sailing. You can open up all of the ports and hatches getting the outside drier air into the moisture laden inside air, or you can try to manually remove the moist inside air. While attached to a shore line I use a dehydrator that I bought at Lowes. I run a hose to the drain and turn it on. It does a great job moving air and drying out the inside of the boat.
Cooking (with gas - boiling that pot of spaghetti and sauce) is a major moisture contributor. Opening vents and using a fan to exchange inside/outside air while cooking is a major help.
Do your closets have doors that allow air to circulate? You might look at other boats doors. Many have slates cut into them or louvers to encourage air in the closet to exchange with air in the rest of the boat. This year I'm planning to router some slots into my solid panel doors.
Enjoy each day of this experience. You are in for a lot of Fun.
John