HQST FLEXIBLE SOLAR, VICTRON MPPT CONTROLLER, BALMAR MC-614 REGULATOR AND INEXEPENSIVE AMP CLAMP

BayMan · May 31, 2016

Nice write up. Solar is in my future. I need to digest all of that info for a bit.

Maine Sail · May 31, 2016

NICK1951 said:
The panel is well designed and constructed, Amazon shipped it free to Puerto Rico. The panel retails for $189.00. The specs state the optimum output current to be 5.7 amps. The spec seems optimistic. The Victron history showed best amp output to be 4.5 amps. I averaged 18 to 20 amps per day (best was 24 amps). While the amp output was disappointing, considering the price and ease of use, I am satisfied and plan to add a second panel next year.

Nick

Nick,

The is the exact type of problem I see far too often with many Chinese semi-flexible knock offs. IMHO this is deceitful and entirely misleading...

They quite often fail to meet the specification. This is not really a surprise because they are also often using orphaned solar cells or "rejects" and some are even using fake/counterfeit Sunpower cells despite claiming "Sunpower cells"... The panels seem to be a good value but often are not especially when they fail to meet spec right out of the box. I would urge you to return that panel under warranty and get one that meets spec or darn close.

Keep in mind that not only are you not charging at 18V (the panels likely Vpmax) but you also have an MPPT that is likely boosting your current.

100W/ 18V = 5.55A

100W / 14.4V = 6.94A and this is without MPPT boost but in optimal conditions & temp.

During bulk charging, in optimal conditions, at say 13.6V, you should expect to see about:
100W / 13.6V = 7.35A +/-

Yes the Solbian, Gioco, Solara or Aurinco panels are considerably more expensive but they are using top grade components and "A" graded Sunpower cells.

I have a video on-line showing a flat mounted 12W panel driving a Lifeline battery bank to 15.2V and delivering .72A while doing so. This is over 91% of the max ideal potential (no mppt) being delivered to the bank even with the panel flat mounted (not optimally angled towards the sun). If you were to see a non-mppt similar performance you should be seeing a minimum of about 6.69A at 13.6V during bulk and upwards of about 7.3A in early bulk and again this is all without considering the MPPT boost you should also be seeing. At 4.5A with MPPT you're barely getting 55W +/- from your 100W panel.....

Honestly I would see if you can send it back and get one that performs better...

Tom23350 · Jun 1, 2016

Maine Sail said:
The is the exact type of problem I see far too often with many Chinese semi-flexible knock offs. IMHO this is deceitful and entirely misleading...

The fact is the Chinese make 87% of the world's solar panels, many of them the best available. Your comments are misleading and broad generalizations. The price/performance ratio of the panels you recommend just doesn't make sense (cents?). Vendor masquerading as a sailor?

In addition to quality, the key factor in MARINE solar panel performance is how the panels are wired. Because we sailors often have shading issues, the panels should have blocking diodes and not have all the cells wired in series. Aurinco and Custom Marine Products have such panels. Design for shading plus A+ quality cells plus potted junction boxes provides the best product for our application.

Maine Sail · Jun 1, 2016

Tom23350 said:
The fact is the Chinese make 87% of the world's solar panels, many of them the best available.

The Chinese make excellent products but based on actual measurements and testing, the semi flexible panels don't seem to be one of them.

Tom23350 said:
Your comments are misleading and broad generalizations.

My comments are based on actual testing of customers solar panels who complain of poor performance. I see a very, very high rate of the Chinese semi flexible panels failing to perform to spec and I rarely see this in rigid frame glass Chinese panels..

Tom23350 said:
The price/performance ratio of the panels you recommend just doesn't make sense (cents?). Vendor masquerading as a sailor?

I find your tone a bit rude.. You may want to check my post count, year joined and moderator status before making such ABSURD accusations (especially when you yourself are a sailor who owns a marine solar comapny which sells semi-flexible solar panels).

I am merely looking out for the average boater, as I regularly do, who does not realize they may have been taken to the cleaners performance wise. This is based on what I physically see and measure. It is not a slight against the Chinese but rather a warning to be very careful when you purchase Chinese semi-flexible panels to ensure that they meet spec.

I would strongly urge anyone and everyone buying a Chinese semi-flexible panel to confirm performance before installing it.

I am a marine electrician who specializes in marine energy systems and is the guy who has to stand behind what I install and send customers off around the world with reliable systems. I install all types of panels and systems from all vendors, including Chinese semi-flexibles, if the customer demands it (based on history I generally will try and talk them out of it, unless they like going to Vegas). More often than not I get to deal with shipping panels back and forth until I get one that actually performs. Of the Chinese made semi-flexibles GoPower has been the most consistent thus far but I still get more bad ones than I'd like to see.

If the customer bought the panels he/she can deal with the poor performance or send them back and pay for me to re-install them and have the canvas work done. One customer bought a Chinese semi-flexible, and like many, it failed to perform. The vendor had then discontinued the panel. He had spent nearly $500.00 to fit it to his bimini and now could no longer get a panel to fit it. He found one on eBay that was close but it failed to perform as well. The value for him was not just in the panel because that the one he originally bought was no longer available and he could not find one that fit the same way.

Recently I gave a cut out cell, cut from a failed Chinese semi-flexible panel, to the Sunpower rep. The cells were claimed to be Sunpower cells. According to the rep it was not a Sunpower cell.. Misleading? My customer thought it was.....

Tom23350 said:
In addition to quality, the key factor in MARINE solar panel performance is how the panels are wired. Because we sailors often have shading issues, the panels should have blocking diodes and not have all the cells wired in series. Aurinco and (EDITED OUT) have such panels. Design for shading plus A+ quality cells plus potted junction boxes provides the best product for our application.

Aurinco is but one of the quality manufacturers I recommended. As for calling me a "Vendor masquerading as a sailor" you are the apparent owner of (EDITED OUT) and you actually do sell Chinese Semiflexible panels..

woodster · Jun 1, 2016

Tom23350 said:
The fact is the Chinese make 87% of the world's solar panels, many of them the best available. Your comments are misleading and broad generalizations. The price/performance ratio of the panels you recommend just doesn't make sense (cents?). Vendor masquerading as a sailor?

In addition to quality, the key factor in MARINE solar panel performance is how the panels are wired. Because we sailors often have shading issues, the panels should have blocking diodes and not have all the cells wired in series. Aurinco and Custom Marine Products have such panels. Design for shading plus A+ quality cells plus potted junction boxes provides the best product for our application.

you may want to read his resume before you make to many assumptions ...just so you will know....ah he beat me to it

SFS · Jun 1, 2016

Tom23350 said:
Your comments are misleading and broad generalizations.
....
Vendor masquerading as a sailor?

....Because we sailors ....

Hey Tom,

I recognize you are VERY new here, and I think Maine Sail has more than adequately addressed your spurious and blatantly incorrect absurdities reproduced here, but allow me a few thoughts. The ironies here are truly astounding. Since YOU are a vendor masquerading as a sailor, I guess your it is your comments that are misleading and broad generalizations. Well we actual sailors tend to read, and think. If YOU bothered to read the pages and pages and pages and pages and pages and pages and pages of posts, articles, high quality research, painstakingly documented findings, and other helpful, FREE information that this well respected industry expert shares with our community, you might begin to get a feel for why everyone here was laughing at you even before you were exposed as a shill.

This is a site that is VERY different from other forums in tone, quality of information, and general attitude. We are tolerant, patient, rarely even irreverent, and never disrespectful.

I hope the moderators other than Maine Sail seriously consider two things: 1) editing BACK IN the name of your company so we know who not to buy from, and can begin spreading the word that no one else should buy from them; and 2) deleting your account along with banning your IP address from the system, as many other forums do, when vendors masquerade as participants.

Cat 310 #1 in GA · Jun 4, 2016

xwiredtva · Jun 6, 2016

I use the cheap Chinese units as well. 2x 100w panels to be exact but I use a waterproof PWM style controller in the trunk of my H30-2.

Peak power is rated with the panel at perfect alignment to the sun (there's a way to rate these and China rates them really well) however our Bimini's are typically flat or concave (as mine is in the pic because the weight of the front panel pushes down - NOTE: Over time this has stretched the top in the center). I have tested mine before I installed them on the boat. The proper tilt is your latitude. So if your on the 30* line you tilt the panels 30* and aim them about 190-200* south for best performance. With that in mind I did test mine before installing and before REMOVING THE PLASTIC coating for shipping protection. The rate on each was around 7amps and in testing I got just below 6 amps (Central PA, crappy spring weather - 2013) peak. A or B grade cells, fact is that it will charge the batteries. I use the 100w per 100ah on board, so you can tell I run a 200ah battery bank. This setup can charge up the batteries and keep them charged perfectly and have for two years. I think I paid the same $190 ish retail as well. But the charge controller can make or break a setup like this. Last weekend our batt voltage was only reaching 13.1v where last year it would be around 14.2v (AGM batts mind you) when we boarded. Now we had a deluge of water in Maryland this May so I wasn't worried. But on 3-5 day trips 200w over 200ah has always been more than enough power for my son's laptop, kindle, and 2 iPhones and a Blackberry along with using 2 iPads as chartplotters and a 13.3" TV/DVD for night time movies. LED lights obviously saved us...

You work with what you got. The pic here shows my son at the helm (11yr old Annapolis Sailing School graduate) but you see the front panel on the Bimini. Strapped down. However last winter I replaced the brass grommets with Stainless.

Rasselas36 · Jun 6, 2016

Disregard this message. I tried to delete it but never could find the delete option.

Rasselas36 · Jun 6, 2016

Tom23350 said:
The fact is the Chinese make 87% of the world's solar panels, many of them the best available. Your comments are misleading and broad generalizations. The price/performance ratio of the panels you recommend just doesn't make sense (cents?). Vendor masquerading as a sailor?

In addition to quality, the key factor in MARINE solar panel performance is how the panels are wired. Because we sailors often have shading issues, the panels should have blocking diodes and not have all the cells wired in series. Aurinco and Custom Marine Products have such panels. Design for shading plus A+ quality cells plus potted junction boxes provides the best product for our application.

Are you voting for Donald J Trump

SFS · Jun 6, 2016

There won't be any additional activity on Tom23350's login.

HQST FLEXIBLE SOLAR, VICTRON MPPT CONTROLLER, BALMAR MC-614 REGULATOR AND INEXEPENSIVE AMP CLAMP

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