Anyone ever rerget their C22 purchase?

[azguy]

I'm trying to become a 1st time boat owner and have gone around looking at C22, C25's and a C27. I would be on a large inland lake in Arizona, Lake Pleasant. I have almost zero sailing experience except for ASA 101 and 103 this summer and five 1/2 days solo on a C22 rentals at the same lake.

At first I was thinking C25/C27 as I didn't want to outgrow the C22 in a few months. After being on a C27 for an entire day my thoughts were great boat, roomy, impressive, but there's so much to it Diesel engine, transmission, through hulls, big sails, big everything, big maintenance bill$.

I'd probably buy a C25 if I could find a really nice one as the last thing I want or need is a project boat but I'm in Arizona and while we have a decent sailboat population it's not like the coasts. I've yet to find a great C25 in a year of casual looking.

Now I've found two real nice C22's and I'm thinking maybe that's the ticket. I can't see myself doing many if any overnights on this lake and 80% of the time I'd be solo or with one other person. Plus, I'm out there to sail, not hang out below deck, cook, sleep, watch TV, whatever.

Plus, I figure the maintenance has to be lots less. Am I on the right track...?

If all goes well in 3-5 years I'd like to buy a mid 30' in SoCal and use it for a weekend place and really become an ocean sailor. Other people have said if that's my goal buy the C27, it'll better prepare me...??

 

[keys please]

az. with a good looking 25 or 27ft you may end up like most of us; with a good looking special solo partner who likes a glass of wine or two and then that nite on the lake takes on a whole new meaning..... either one of those boats would make a good coastal sailer.... and a neat place to spend the weekend..... fair winds brian

 

[Nahart51]

If you're a lake sailor in a shallow lake, that 22 swing keel can get you out of a lot of trouble.
Nothing more embarrassing than going hard aground and having to be rescued...repeatedly.

 

[CaptDon01]

The C-25 and the C-27 are both nice boats. In fact, so are the C-30, the C-32, etc, etc. We live in San Diego and originally planned on getting a bigger boat, i.e. C-27 or a C-30. But, then we met up with a trailer-sailor group here in SoCal and they were such a fun bunch, we decided we would again go the trailer-sailor route,(we had a C-22 swing keel for many years back in Kansas City). We keep our C-22 slipped in Mission Bay. The ease of rigging and trailering our C-22 has opened a lot more adventures for us. Last summer we trailered to Florida. Your not that far away, and could easily trailer over to the coast on a long weekend, or longer very easily. Can't do that with a bigger boat.

Another advantage of the C-22 is afordability. Sails, hardware, slips rental, outboard purchase, repair, and operation are a fraction of the cost of a larger boat. I recently purchased a new Tohatsu Sail-Pro for $1,300. If I had an inboard diesel and say the injector pump went bad, I bet I would spend a lot more on an injector pump repair than I have in the entire engine on our boat. I expect another 10-15 years of service with my 6 HP Tohatsu, and when it starts giving me problems, I'll throw it away and but another that will go another 10 or 15 years.

Our C-22 has been modified for cruising us comfortably, and she does that extremely well. We've got some exciting things developing here in San Diego for the C-22's. We'll be doing at least a couple whale watching trips off the coast this fall and early winter, some weekend cruises up the coast, and don't forget the "Catalina's to Catalina" cruise next summer. A week long cruise to Catalina Island visiting Avalon and Two Harbor's. Couldn't do that if your land-locked at Lake Pleasant. We also plan on trailering over to Lake Pleasant to enjoy some of the C-22 fellowship there this winter. We couldn't do that if we had a larger boat. It's just a no brain'er for us, trailering ability is the way to go.

I have to respectfully disagree with the common opinion that a smaller boat is for beginners and when you get more experienced being able to move up to a bigger boat. It's not about out growing a boat, it's about enjoying your boat to it's potential. We're a little more than a year from retiring, and plan on trailering around the country and participating in some of the numerous C-22 cruises, along with exploring many other areas on our own. It's funney how we always get remarks from the "big boat owners" at our club on how much we use our boat. When they see her back on the trailer, they always ask where we're off to this time.

Good luck, hope to see ya's at one of the C-22 events coming up!

Don

 

[Q22]

When I was looking at the 25 vs 22 I looked at parts online mainly sails and the difference was pretty big.I also looked into slips and what they cost they put me on a two year waiting list.I did not want to launch a 25 much more than a couple times a year.Since I'm stuck on a trailer I can go to different lakes anyway.I bought a nice little 22 all I needed to buy was tunes and cup holders and could sail.A 25 in my price range would cost me more in the future.If there were reasonable slips a big lake and I had about $8000 dollars cash to spend carefully the 25 would work great.

 

[watercolors II]

Thinking right on!

Having owned and sailed a Catalina 22 for over 20 years on a smaller lake than yours I would say you’re thinking is definitely on the right track.

Entry price for boat ownership and cost of maintaining over the years, you are right at 100 percent thinking.

When it comes to learning to sail and cost, “less is more”. If you pay a reasonable price for a 22 and maintain it for the next 5 to 10 years all of your purchase price will be refunded upon upsizing, so use will be your only cost of ownership!

Learning to sail a 22 will enhance the learning curve so much more than starting out with a larger boat. Because the 22 has all of the same sail handling controls that the large yacht’s have, learning and understanding them will be faster because of the quick response to adjustment as compared to the slow and subtle change on larger boats. When you’re ready to step up larger, the dollars will be less and the only new skills required will all be below deck!

Your sailing area is not too large for a Catalina 22, it will handle anything mother nature can throw at it on that size lake. You should be able to sail that whole lake in a day so, why would a larger boat be that much better. Again, your thinking is right on!

 

[jimmcgee]

We bought our 22 to try sailing and see if it was something we really liked, the idea being that we would buy something bigger if we did.

I have absolutely no regrets about our Catalina 22 (other than I wasn't able to keep her). We had her for a couple of seasons; she was a great boat and we had a lot of fun with her.

There was a lot less maintenance with the 22 because you didn't have all the onboard systems you have with bigger boats.

There are a lot of 22's out there, buy one in good shape, keep her that way and you'll sell her for what you paid. In our case I made some upgrades and sold her for more than we paid in just three days - and that was back in '09 when the market was flat.

I certainly have no regrets about buying our 30, but I do miss the 22. You may well find she's the right boat and you won't want to something bigger. There's a reason they're the best selling sailboat ever.

 

[azguy]

Thanks for all the feedback, I'm making an offer tomorrow after I get a quote for a fresh coat of bottom paint. It's a really well loved C22 with multiple sails and everything in perfect working order.

While I really would like to be brave enough to buy the mint C27 I'm in love with, I really am looking at future maintenance costs as much as anything when making this purchase.

The thought of an inboard diesel, transmission, stuffing box, through hulls, big expensive sails, multiple batteries, invertor, solar panels, marine head, yada, yada, yada all seem daunting and expensive when the time comes to work on something.

Plus with the C22 I get a trailer and that would help with haul outs, maintenance and make it more re-sellable if it comes to that down the road. The C27 would be stuck at this one lake.

Lastly, I'm not really a camper/overnighter and worry the C27 would be overkill for single handed day trips around the lake.

 

[jimmcgee]

Good luck. If you get her post pictures.

 

[Minnesail]

I bought a 22 just this month. It seems like a cute little boat out on the water, but it seems huge parked next to the garage. I think it's going to be a very nice size, I can't wait till next spring when I can sail it.

 

[Snowman80]

I also picked up a 22 this month. She is still at her PO house. Ive been doing trailer work before bringing her home. The leafs were half gone, tires awful and studs rotted. But totally salvageable, hopefully my next trip down(95miles one way) will be my last without her.

Then ill post pics on the build restore and cleaning of her. she isn't in bad shape,just lots of elbow work

 

[Gene Neill]

I regretted not making the previous owner demonstrate that my C-22's keel bolts could still be removed. Regretted it VERY, VERY MUCH.

 

[Minnesail]

My thinking is that I will probably someday want a larger boat, but a C22 is a good way to learn boat about maintenance and repair without spending a fortune. I can make $500 mistakes instead of $5,000 mistakes.

But now that I have it, I'm thinking it might be just the right size.

 

[Snowman80]

There is nothing to hard to fix if your truly committed to your vessel,expensive maybe, pain in the ass, sure. But all can be done

 

[Ken Secor]

Ask me next spring when my new budget for repairs is re-funded.

 

[cmroles]

I currently have a C22 in a slip at Lake Pleasant. I love my boat. That being said, if I had known that it would be living in a slip I would have sprung for a C25 instead.

The two biggest advantages in the 25 (for me) are a more convenient head and wider side decks. The wider decks make it a bit easier to get on the foredeck and having more space for the head speaks for itself.

I purchased the 22 because i intended to keep on the trailer. I did that for the first year...and only sailed a handful of times. This year (with a slip) I sail almost every weekend. For me, the convenience of walking down the dock and stepping aboard is worth the slip fees.

It really all comes down to what you are comfortable with. I would never recommend something that is outside your "zone". If you are single-handing then even the 22 can feel big at first. I learned to sail on a bigger boat (Benneteau First 38) but had never gone solo until I had the 22...and it was a little nerve-wracking.

 

[azguy]

I agree, a C25 would be my first choice but there has only been two, that I know of, at Pleasant for sale in the last 6 months and both needed considerable work.

The C22 I'm looking at is pretty well loved...

 

[cmroles]

I agree, a C25 would be my first choice but there has only been two, that I know of, at Pleasant for sale in the last 6 months and both needed considerable work.

The C22 I'm looking at is pretty well loved...

You might have better luck looking in Southern California. There are LOTS of C25s in San Diego or Orange County / LA.

It wouldn't be difficult to trailer one back over to AZ.

 

[Stu Jackson]

I can't see myself doing many if any overnights on this lake and 80% of the time I'd be solo or with one other person. Plus, I'm out there to sail, not hang out below deck, cook, sleep, watch TV, whatever.

Heck, that's half the fun! You also get to learn to anchor, which is a handy tool to have in your quiver.

Watercolors and others have given you very good advice.

FWIW, we started with a C22 and loved it, really learned how to sail on that boat. Moved up after four years to a C25 for 12, then our C34 in 1998 - a keeper!

I posted this on another concurrent C22 question: We lived on our C22 Mark 1 during three or four summers every weekend and long weekends on Clear Lake, California, we sailed San Francisco Bay during the winter months. Having water at the galley sink, as well as a few separate jugs and a bucket really helps. We generally cooked outside on a Hibatchi! :dance: Many great steaks!

We simply found "daysails" only were too limited, and wanted to be on the boat as long as we possibly could. The eventual move to the C25 DOUBLED our volume. But perhaps it's too early for your to get 3 foot-itis - not yet.

I have never met anyone who regretted buying and sailing their Catalina 22s. Great boat, stable platforms, when correctly rigged it can have all the "big boat" sail handling gear - we ran our halyards aft.

Here's a handy bit of information from Pat Royce's great little book, Sailing Illustrated.

 

[kito]

I don't regret buying the C22. I like my C22.....for day sailing. My plan was to drive the C22 to different lakes and overnight on the weekends. I found out fast that it became a pain. Maybe if I was 20 years younger it would be fine. I now keep her at a marina stored on a trailer with mast up. I am 6'5" tall and find it uncomfortable to even sit inside the cabin. She is a blast to sail but we want to be more comfortable for weekend sailing adventures. She will be up for sale after I get my 30' Hunter Cherubini project boat finished.